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Who believes in horoscopes? - And who knows the signs of the Zodiac?

The myth: That marriages and romantic relationships of people who have favorable Zodiac signs are more compatible and successful.

The science: A major study of divorces in a Midwestern city showed that couples were getting divorced at a uniform rate regardless of what Zodiac signs they had. (Source: "Pseudoscience and the Paranormal," by Terence Hines),

Why are you quoting this at me?
 
My guess is, that hardly anybody believes in horoscopes - at least not openly.
But nearly everybody knows the signs of the Zodiac,
Am I right? ;)

As for me, I do not believe in horoscopes.
But I know my signs.

I don't believe in horoscopes and never got into it deeply at all, but I do know my sun sign. I have to say there are quite a few similarities with the description of my sign and myself.
 
Well, if you keep guessin',you're bound to get it right some of the time...:2razz:
 
I find astrology really entertaining and interesting. I don't put full stock in it, but I'm also not offended by it.

I am not offended by it either.

My point is:

Even if most people do not believe in it, everybody knows his sign of the Zodiac.
 
Years ago I briefly dated a woman who definitely did believe in horoscopes - but only by a specific well known person. Newpaper etc horoscopes were worthless. To be precise, she said I needed to know exactly the day and minute you were born and where. She swore he was always accurate.

She subscribed to him. One of his horoscopes for me vaguely said I will have a relationship failure. Turns out she was correct. After that horoscope she started in depth interrogating me - or trying anyway. Oh hell no. That may be a rarely convenient reason a guy gave for breaking up with a woman: "The horoscope you obtained about me said I will break up with you. Since it is inevitable anyway, why put it off? Sad, I thought we had a good thing going. But there is no denying what the stars say, is there?" :2razz:

No, I do not put any stock in horoscopes or any other prophets of the future.
 
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My guess is, that hardly anybody believes in horoscopes - at least not openly.
But nearly everybody knows the signs of the Zodiac,
Am I right? ;)

As for me, I do not believe in horoscopes.
But I know my signs.

I am twin - or GEMINI - in the European system
- and a dog according to the Chinese system.

And on January 25th the Year of the Rat will start - if anyone wants to know.

It is a silly myth. And, to be truthful, the constellation Ophiuchus should be a zodiacal sign, as the sun passes in front of it from November 30 to December 18.

I am an amateur astronomer, the constellations of the zodiac mean something different to me, they are something cool to look at in the night sky, and watch the sun, moon and planets pass through them.
 
Correlation does not equal causation

Hey Ramoss. In this case it may well be the case.

Tradition has it that the 12 tribes of Israel were formed when Moses went forth from Egypt.
So why did Moses split them into twelve? Supposedly they were the descendants of Jacob's 12 sons, but that makes very little sense historically.

The Israelites were what the Egyptians called "Habiru" (Hebrew), which seems to have been a catch-all for various non-Egyptian desert dwellers, nomads, caravan traders, and former raiders who had settled in Egypt at the time. They were primarily Semitic peoples who had immigrated to Egypt after the Hyksos invasion, and who started becoming seriously unpopular when Egyptian Nationalism became a big thing after the fall of the Hyksos Pharaohs, and especially in the return to the old ways that came after Pharaoh Ankhenaten tried to institute Aten (Adonai?) as the first monotheistic deity a mere century before the Exodus of Moses. However, the descendants of one man were unlikely to be numerous enough to be a threat to Egypt. OTOH, having entire races descend from a single person was a very common cultural narrative in ancient times (helped with social stuff donchaknow, when there was a blood relation).

One obvious possibility for selecting the number 12 is that it had huge cultural and mystical significance, and the reason for that was because of the 12 months of the stellar year.
In ancient cosmologies the number 12 variously represents the turning of the cosmic wheel, perfection, completeness, and sometimes the 12 primary deities (before they were reduced to 7 aka number of visible planets + sun/moon). It is no coincidence that juries since ancient times have consisted of 12 members. As the Jewish Elites were later exiled to Mesopotamia (the birth place of the Zodiac signs) there may also have been attempts to correspond various facets of their religion with that of their more urbane hosts. At the very least, Judaism certainly seems to have changed a bit by the time they got back to Jerusalem.
 
Hey Ramoss. In this case it may well be the case.

Tradition has it that the 12 tribes of Israel were formed when Moses went forth from Egypt.
So why did Moses split them into twelve? Supposedly they were the descendants of Jacob's 12 sons, but that makes very little sense historically.

The Israelites were what the Egyptians called "Habiru" (Hebrew), which seems to have been a catch-all for various non-Egyptian desert dwellers, nomads, caravan traders, and former raiders who had settled in Egypt at the time. They were primarily Semitic peoples who had immigrated to Egypt after the Hyksos invasion, and who started becoming seriously unpopular when Egyptian Nationalism became a big thing after the fall of the Hyksos Pharaohs, and especially in the return to the old ways that came after Pharaoh Ankhenaten tried to institute Aten (Adonai?) as the first monotheistic deity a mere century before the Exodus of Moses. However, the descendants of one man were unlikely to be numerous enough to be a threat to Egypt. OTOH, having entire races descend from a single person was a very common cultural narrative in ancient times (helped with social stuff donchaknow, when there was a blood relation).

One obvious possibility for selecting the number 12 is that it had huge cultural and mystical significance, and the reason for that was because of the 12 months of the stellar year.
In ancient cosmologies the number 12 variously represents the turning of the cosmic wheel, perfection, completeness, and sometimes the 12 primary deities (before they were reduced to 7 aka number of visible planets + sun/moon). It is no coincidence that juries since ancient times have consisted of 12 members. As the Jewish Elites were later exiled to Mesopotamia (the birth place of the Zodiac signs) there may also have been attempts to correspond various facets of their religion with that of their more urbane hosts. At the very least, Judaism certainly seems to have changed a bit by the time they got back to Jerusalem.

Good question. There are a lot of debate about it. From The Twelve Tribes of Israel

Modern scholarship does not generally accept the biblical notion that the twelve tribes are simply divisions of a larger unit which developed naturally from patriarchal roots. This simplistic scheme, it is felt, stems from later genealogical speculations which attempted to explain the history of the tribes in terms of familial relationships. The alliance of the twelve tribes is believed to have grown from the organization of independent tribes, or groups of tribes, forced together for historical reasons. Scholars differ as to when this union of twelve took place and when the tribes of Israel became one nation.

One school of thought holds that the confederation took place inside the country toward the end of the period of the Judges and the beginnings of the Monarchy. All of the traditions which see the twelve tribes as one nation as early as the enslavement in Egypt or the wanderings in the desert are regarded as having no basis in fact. This school recognizes in the names of some of the tribes the names of ancient sites in Canaan, such as the mountains of Naphtali, Ephraim, and Judah, the desert of Judah, and Gilead. With the passage of time, those who dwelt in these areas assumed the names of the localities.

Others feel that the tribes descended from the matriarch Leah - namely Reuben, Simeon, Levi, Judah, Zebulun and Issachar - existed at an earlier stage as a confederation of six tribes whose boundaries in Canaan were contiguous. Only at a later stage did other tribes penetrate the area, eventually expanding the confederation to twelve.

It goes into much more detail, and you can visit the page for a bigger overview.
 
My guess is, that hardly anybody believes in horoscopes - at least not openly.

Don't find horoscopes relevant, but the Zodiac had huge significance in ancient cosmologies, and there is a crapton of customs that survive even to this day that are related to them.
Ever notice how the Lunar, Stellar, and Solar year almost correspond with each other? These relationships are the source of many current traditions, from Christmas, to Easter, Halloween, and even the figure of Harlequin from Italian comedy.

Other cosmologically inspired customs that have survived to the modern era in various forms include:
- Throwing coins into fountains and making wishes (water sacrifice)
- Execution by hanging (sky sacrifce)
- Burials (going to the Earth Mother)
- Cremation (going to the Sky Father)
- Witches riding broom sticks (a fertility thing. I'm guessing J.K. Rowlings was unaware what the broom stick signifies when she wrote Harry Potter...)
- May Poles (the World Axis)
- Domesticated animals being bred to be black (significant to the Earth Mother) or white (the Sky Father).
- Both parties spitting in their hands and shaking to seal a deal/oath (mixing of bodily fluids having mystic significance related to the spirit/soul. Cross-peeing, the mixing of blood, and even sexual intercourse having similar mystic/religious significance).
- The Stork bringing babies.
- Bull fights (the killing of Taurus the sky bull, i.e. early Bronze Age Stellar New Year)
- The Bulls' Eye imitates patterns painted on the forehead of sacrifical bulls.
- Also the carnival strongman game where you attempt to kill the aforementioned sacrifical bull (ring the little bell) in a single stroke.
- Church Bells. (The Celtic Cauldron was a mini-representation of the cosmos, and made a fine sound when you struck it. Introduced to Christianity by former Irish Druids after their conversion to Christianity.)

This stuff is everywhere if you know how to look...
 
Now I could add the question: And who knows the signs of the Chinese Zodiac?
 
My guess is, that hardly anybody believes in horoscopes - at least not openly.
But nearly everybody knows the signs of the Zodiac,
Am I right? ;)

As for me, I do not believe in horoscopes.
But I know my signs.

I am twin - or GEMINI - in the European system
- and a dog according to the Chinese system.

And on January 25th the Year of the Rat will start - if anyone wants to know.

You forgot to add the precession of the equinoxes. All the signs have moved one place.
 
Now I could add the question: And who knows the signs of the Chinese Zodiac?

I have a very very old Chinese carved bone ball with all the symbols of the zodiac in it. Rat, monkey dragon, dog, tiger, ox, rabbit , horse , rooster , snake are the ones I can remember off the top of my head.
 
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