Whether you believe in God or not, does not matter

[Somerville]

Your personal actions matter more than any specific religious belief. Why do you think that only those who have the same faith, or non-faith, as you profess are the only 'good' humans?

​

 

[swing_voter]

Like Bill and Ted from Bill and Ted's Excellent Adventure said:

"Be righteous toward each other."

 

[CLAX1911]

Your personal actions matter more than any specific religious belief. Why do you think that only those who have the same faith, or non-faith, as you profess are the only 'good' humans?

View attachment 67269160​

Well I posit that nobody is good, but that people try to do good through actions. Even if it's misplaced or misguided I can recognize the inherent wish to do good. That should be inspiring.

But I agree with the premise. Basically actions speak louder than words.

 

[Daisy]

True, we conquer the world, not by our belief, but by our faith...1 John 5:4...

 

[Dragonfly]

Well I posit that nobody is good,

Why?

I posit most people are good.

 

[Daisy]

Why?

I posit most people are good.

Jesus said to him: “Why do you call me good? Nobody is good except one, God." Mark 10:18

 

[Dragonfly]

Jesus said to him: “Why do you call me good? Nobody is good except one, God." Mark 10:18

Shut up. :roll:

 

[CLAX1911]

Why?

I posit most people are good.

Explain what you mean by good.

 

[zyzygy]

Explain what you mean by good.

Not bad.

 

[NWO_Spook]

The old motto: Virtute Non Verbis

 

[lemmiwinx]

I'm going with don't f with people and don't let people f with you.

 

[CLAX1911]

Not bad.

Explain what you mean by bad.

 

[CLAX1911]

Not bad.

Is somebody that gives 90% of their wealth to charities good? Is somebody who doesn't therefore bad? If good means not bad than most people by your logic are bad, assuming you view generosity as good.

 

[Dragonfly]

Explain what you mean by good.

Shouldn't you explain it first? It was your posit that started this. :mrgreen:


But sure,

I think most people try to live their life as best they can, without hurting others.

 

[CLAX1911]

Shouldn't you explain it first? It was your posit that started this. :mrgreen:

Fair enough. I think the person who gives everything he has except for what he needs to survive two other so that they might survive is good. The person that lays down his life for a friend is good.

But sure,

I think most people try to live their life as best they can, without hurting others.

I think the person who lives two serve others is good. Simply not going out of your way to hurt others is the bare minimum not to be bad.

I believe we all are capable of doing good and most of us want to, and most of us do from time to time I don't think most of us live that selflessly. It goes against our nature. But if people did be pretty fantastic world live in.

 

[Dragonfly]

Fair enough. I think the person who gives everything he has except for what he needs to survive two other so that they might survive is good. The person that lays down his life for a friend is good.

I think the person who lives two serve others is good. Simply not going out of your way to hurt others is the bare minimum not to be bad.

I believe we all are capable of doing good and most of us want to, and most of us do from time to time I don't think most of us live that selflessly. It goes against our nature. But if people did be pretty fantastic world live in.

How do you determine what's needed to survive?

We all need to save at least a million dollars to be able to take care of ourselves in old age.

Are you saying the person who buys the Mercedes Benz is not a good person because they could have just as easily bought a Nissan Versa?

 

[CLAX1911]

How do you determine what's needed to survive?

Things that if you didn't have you would die.
Water food shelter. Basic needs

We all need to save at least a million dollars to be able to take care of ourselves in old age.

That's merely to pay people that aren't good. Cost would be minimal, if people were good.

Are you saying the person who buys the Mercedes Benz is not a good person because they could have just as easily bought a Nissan Versa?

They could have walked. You don't need a car to live.

Good people put others before themselves.

 

[Dragonfly]

Things that if you didn't have you would die.
That's merely to pay people that aren't good. Cost would be minimal, if people were good.

They could have walked. You don't need a car to live.

Good people put others before themselves.

So a doctor/surgeon who needs a car to get to work so he/she can save lives is a bad person for needing the car?
They should simply live within walking distance of the hospital they work in?

 

[Dragonfly]

That's merely to pay people that aren't good.

I have no clue what this means.

Medical costs, housing costs, food, and utilities all cost money. When your too old to work those medial costs rise substantially.
Are you saying you support a more "socialized" society? Because you know what kind of reaction that'll get around here.

 

[CLAX1911]

So a doctor/surgeon who needs a car to get to work so he/she can save lives is a bad person for needing the car?

no, it's not stark black and white. If you aren't good than you are bad.

Nobody needs a car. Humanity existed for millennia before cars.

They should simply live within walking distance of the hospital they work in?

No in order to be good they work in the hospital to help people not for the doctor salary, they would keep just enough that they could have a shelter and water and food.

This is done by choice. You asked me to define what good is that's what it is.

If you have a different definition I'm willing to hear it.

 

[ataraxia]

Your personal actions matter more than any specific religious belief. Why do you think that only those who have the same faith, or non-faith, as you profess are the only 'good' humans?

View attachment 67269160​

Yes, almost all religions have some version of the golden rule. It’s not THAT complicated.

"Whatever is hateful and distasteful to you, do not do to your fellow man. This is the entire Torah, the rest is commentary. Go learn."
-Talmud

 

[CLAX1911]

I have no clue what this means.

Okay the reason why things cost money is because people don't give them to you. Do you consider charity good if so why?

Medical costs, housing costs, food, and utilities all cost money. When your too old to work those medial costs rise substantially.

because people want money for them. If they gave it to you would you think that was good?

Are you saying you support a more "socialized" society?

absolutely not because number one reason people aren't good. Socialism is using government power to try and force humans to be something they are not. If people were good there would be no such word as socialism, or capitalism or money or economy.

Because you know what kind of reaction that'll get around here.

I'm not under any delusion is that any of this is possible.

You asked what I thought good was so I told you.

This is why I say people aren't good. And again that doesn't mean that people are bad. I don't look at it as black and white.

 

[marke]

Fair enough. I think the person who gives everything he has except for what he needs to survive two other so that they might survive is good. The person that lays down his life for a friend is good.

I think the person who lives two serve others is good. Simply not going out of your way to hurt others is the bare minimum not to be bad.

I believe we all are capable of doing good and most of us want to, and most of us do from time to time I don't think most of us live that selflessly. It goes against our nature. But if people did be pretty fantastic world live in.

Anyone wishing to be delivered from his own innate selfishness must repent of his sins and be forgiven and given a new life in Christ. It is only God's nature in a born again believer that enables that believer to do good.

 

[CLAX1911]

Yes, almost all religions have some version of the golden rule. It’s not THAT complicated.

some religions extol the virtues of Mercy and putting others above you. Don't get me wrong I like the Golden rule I think it's something we should all try and live by, but treating others as you would want others to treat you can mean a lot of things.

There are things several religions think should be given regardless of how you been treated by the person you're giving them to.

"Whatever is hateful and distasteful to you, do not do to your fellow man. This is the entire Torah, the rest is commentary. Go learn."
-Talmud

I would go further, if you really want to do good things it is not enough to live and Let live. Seek out the people in most need of help and help them in any way you can. This is an active movement that I think here's to the principle of the Golden rule, but takes it further.

If we did that sort of thing how much better would this world be?

 

[ataraxia]

Okay the reason why things cost money is because people don't give them to you. Do you consider charity good if so why?
because people want money for them. If they gave it to you would you think that was good?
absolutely not because number one reason people aren't good. Socialism is using government power to try and force humans to be something they are not. If people were good there would be no such word as socialism, or capitalism or money or economy.


I'm not under any delusion is that any of this is possible.

You asked what I thought good was so I told you.

This is why I say people aren't good. And again that doesn't mean that people are bad. I don't look at it as black and white.

Ethics can get complicated because there are often opposing considerations, causing dilemmas: perfect honesty and truthfulness can sometimes conflict with being tactful; being good at your work sometimes conflicts with wanting to spend time with your family; self-preservation sometimes conflicts with watching out for others, etc.... sometimes juggling between these things requires judgment and care and painful compromise.

A bad person is one who does not think anything should compromise their own personal self interest and agenda, ie, has no sense of empathy for others and their pain.