• This is a political forum that is non-biased/non-partisan and treats every person's position on topics equally. This debate forum is not aligned to any political party. In today's politics, many ideas are split between and even within all the political parties. Often we find ourselves agreeing on one platform but some topics break our mold. We are here to discuss them in a civil political debate. If this is your first visit to our political forums, be sure to check out the RULES. Registering for debate politics is necessary before posting. Register today to participate - it's free!

[W: #40] A learning discussion about Islam.

Yasureoktoo said:
So you basically have nothing to say and are ranting.
No I am not going to waste my time following your trail.

Post one thing and I will answer it.
Click to expand...
Yeah, being challenged to back up your stuff clearly disturbs you.

IOW this is (without further demonstration needed) not at all about "A learning discussion on Islam", but about spamming this forum with just another carbon copy of the rant you've already spammed just as many other forums with on here.

You want to be taken seriously, it's on you to provide proof of what you spout. Or see all of it referred to as the garbage it actually constitutes.
 
Chagos said:
Yeah, being challenged to back up your stuff clearly disturbs you.

IOW this is (without further demonstration needed) not at all about "A learning discussion on Islam", but about spamming this forum with just another carbon copy of the rant you've already spammed just as many other forums with on here.

You want to be taken seriously, it's on you to provide proof of what you spout. Or see all of it referred to as the garbage it actually constitutes.
Click to expand...

So you are proving you have nothing to say and are just trolling the thread.
 
Re: A learning discussion about Islam.

Dragonfly said:
WHAT???

You know this how?
Click to expand...

Just from personal experience discussing Islam, many times confirmed by others.
A dead give away is to make every excuse other than using Islamic text make their argument.
Change the subject.
Blame another religion. Look what the Christians do.
say it must be said in Arabic to understand.
It's out of context, ( I love this one)
Only the Qur'an is valid.

There are a few more.
 
Yasureoktoo said:
So you are proving you have nothing to say and are just trolling the thread.
Click to expand...
Which would lead to the interesting question of how one trolls a troll thread, but never mind.

Fact is, as demonstrated, that you run when challenged on what can thus only be seen as idiotic claims and that your accusation of others ranting is as much a clear indication of massive projection issues, as is your inane accusation of others having nothing to say.

Great going.
 
Re: A learning discussion about Islam.

Yasureoktoo said:
Just from personal experience discussing Islam,
Click to expand...

:roll:

Means little to nothing.

I return to my first post in this sad little thread.

If you want responses to this thread from Muslims, you're barking in the wrong forum.
 
Chagos said:
Which would lead to the interesting question of how one trolls a troll thread, but never mind.

Fact is, as demonstrated, that you run when challenged on what can thus only be seen as idiotic claims and that your accusation of others ranting is as much a clear indication of massive projection issues, as is your inane accusation of others having nothing to say.

Great going.
Click to expand...

Except that is not a challenge, you wrote a lot of garbage that I have no intention wasting time responding to.
I see you cannot write just one.
 
Re: A learning discussion about Islam.

Dragonfly said:
:roll:

Means little to nothing.

I return to my first post in this sad little thread.

If you want responses to this thread from Muslims, you're barking in the wrong forum.
Click to expand...

Well then it is an excellent opportunity for people to learn about Islam.
I am waiting for input with other opinions, or facts about the religion, but am not getting any, Just trolling.
 
Yasureoktoo said:
Except that is not a challenge, you wrote a lot of garbage that I have no intention wasting time responding to.
I see you cannot write just one.
Click to expand...
I wrote 7 challenges on 7 of your statements and you're running from all of them.

If that makes you look like a poster as unworthy of debate as your whole thread looks, you have only yourself to blame.
 
Re: A learning discussion about Islam.

Yasureoktoo said:
Well then it is an excellent opportunity for people to learn about Islam.
I am waiting for input with other opinions, or facts about the religion, but am not getting any, Just trolling.
Click to expand...

Hmm...disagreeing is trolling. Questions are trolling. Coming soon: breathing at a different rate than the OP is trolling.

I'm shocked at the way this is going...shocked I say.
 
Re: A learning discussion about Islam.

Yasureoktoo said:
Well then it is an excellent opportunity for people to learn about Islam.
I am waiting for input with other opinions, or facts about the religion, but am not getting any, Just trolling.
Click to expand...
There are plenty of excellent opportunities to learn about Islam and you have provided none of them.

Not here in this pitiful thread, not in any other sub-forum here with your equally pitiful threads or posts there.

As to your accusations of trolling, heal thyself.
 
Re: A learning discussion about Islam.

Pippi Longstock said:
Thanks. What do you mean by "The religion is in the Sunnah" is that another book?
Click to expand...

Yasureoktoo said:
actually, a lot.
Ishaq, Muhammeds only biography written within 200 years of his lifetime, and Islam's first documentation, is 800 pages of fine print.
Taburi is 40 volumes, granted they are small volumes,
Bukhari is 2 volumes.
Muslim, one book 250 pages, and a student of Bukhari.

It is these books that contain the history of the religion, the intents, the blow by blow stories of the Conquests, the murders, the tortures, the rapes, the slave trading, the intents of the religion, the raids, the results of the raids, the distribution of the booty, and endless other things we can discuss.
Click to expand...

That's a lot to take in. A lot of words and people I've never heard of. Is the Sunnah another book? I'm still not clear on that. Or is it a branch of Islam? or neither. And what is a student of Bukhari? I guess it would help if I knew who Bukhari is.
 
Re: A learning discussion about Islam.

Elvira said:
Well, I can tell ya the lineage Muhammad supposedly came through...Abraham's concubine, Hagar's son, Ishmael...that's about the extent of my knowledge...looking forward to some input from those who know more...
Click to expand...

This was written about long after the fact.

The reason we know so little about these people is that everyone was illiterate and nothing was written down.
a 100% fabricated genelogy from Ishmal to Muhammed was documented.

First we have to go into Muhammeds birth. He was an orphan early on and almost died, a wet nurse took care of him.
He was nobody in town, just another baby.
He was adopted into the Qusayy family.
Qusayy purchased the Custodianship of the Kab'ba fro a "Skinfull of wine and a lute" Islam's holiest site bought for music and booze.
He bought it from his grandfather, who conquered the tribe who lived there. The Juriam I believe, there were two before the Quaresh, Qusayys tribe.
All the settlements had Kab'bas, the people brought their offerings there, prayed there, walked around it , one of the pillars that would later become Islam.
The custodians were the bronze age televangelists, and profited from it.

Muhammed could not inherit it, it was for a blood relative, over 40, male, he did not qualify.

Muhammed spoke to spirits in a cave, and started his own religion, much to the chagrin of the townsfolk.
They became frustrated with him and tossed him out of town.

Now comes the lineage.
Ishmael to Muhammed.
and this is fully documented, I can look it up and get a link if interested.
Ishmael was 2000 BC.
Mecca was not even inhabited until 400 ad, and it was by different tribes.
Muhammed was nobody, why does he have a lineage.
what was it written on, where is it now. an excuse is camel bones.
what language was it written in.

I can see when he was tossed out of town,...….. and take your 20 tons of camel bones with you

Islam is one fabrication after another, the Qur'an is 9th century, not the 7th.
Most of the documents are 10th to 12th century.

Even the companions of Muhammed, supposed stories written by men who know him,
were written hundreds of years after the fact.
 
Re: A learning discussion about Islam.

Yasureoktoo said:
This was written about long after the fact.

The reason we know so little about these people is that everyone was illiterate and nothing was written down.
a 100% fabricated genelogy from Ishmal to Muhammed was documented.

First we have to go into Muhammeds birth. He was an orphan early on and almost died, a wet nurse took care of him.
He was nobody in town, just another baby.
He was adopted into the Qusayy family.
Qusayy purchased the Custodianship of the Kab'ba fro a "Skinfull of wine and a lute" Islam's holiest site bought for music and booze.
He bought it from his grandfather, who conquered the tribe who lived there. The Juriam I believe, there were two before the Quaresh, Qusayys tribe.
All the settlements had Kab'bas, the people brought their offerings there, prayed there, walked around it , one of the pillars that would later become Islam.
The custodians were the bronze age televangelists, and profited from it.

Muhammed could not inherit it, it was for a blood relative, over 40, male, he did not qualify.

Muhammed spoke to spirits in a cave, and started his own religion, much to the chagrin of the townsfolk.
They became frustrated with him and tossed him out of town.

Now comes the lineage.
Ishmael to Muhammed.
and this is fully documented, I can look it up and get a link if interested.
Ishmael was 2000 BC.
Mecca was not even inhabited until 400 ad, and it was by different tribes.
Muhammed was nobody, why does he have a lineage.
what was it written on, where is it now. an excuse is camel bones.
what language was it written in.

I can see when he was tossed out of town,...….. and take your 20 tons of camel bones with you

Islam is one fabrication after another, the Qur'an is 9th century, not the 7th.
Most of the documents are 10th to 12th century.

Even the companions of Muhammed, supposed stories written by men who know him,
were written hundreds of years after the fact.
Click to expand...

And Christianity is one fabrication after another. So what?
 
Re: A learning discussion about Islam.

Pippi Longstock said:
That's a lot to take in. A lot of words and people I've never heard of. Is the Sunnah another book? I'm still not clear on that. Or is it a branch of Islam? or neither. And what is a student of Bukhari? I guess it would help if I knew who Bukhari is.
Click to expand...
The Sunnah is a compilation of literature on traditional customs and practices of the Islamic community, both social and legal.

Those going by it are generally termed Sunnite , as opposed to Shiites who, while sharing many if not most of the fundamentals of Islam, have grievances over what is (was) the true successor of the Prophet.

It's a conflict about who holds (is within) the true lineage, each side claiming it for itself.

Bukhari was the author of a collection of hadiths, those in turn being (broadly and not exhaustively adeqately put) explanations of how the Qur'an need be interpreted.

Note how all this applies to a book that, according to some on here, forbids any further interpretation.
 
Re: A learning discussion about Islam.

Pippi Longstock said:
That's a lot to take in. A lot of words and people I've never heard of. Is the Sunnah another book? I'm still not clear on that. Or is it a branch of Islam? or neither. And what is a student of Bukhari? I guess it would help if I knew who Bukhari is.
Click to expand...

Ishaq, the first documentation of Islam, and the only biography of Muhammed written within 200 years of his lifetime.
4/5th of the book was lost, and none of the original exists today.
It was re-written by Ibn Hussin 60 years later into the Sirat Rasuall Allah.
The History of Al Taburi was next, and contains some of what was lost in Ishaq, but nobody knows what.
Iman Bukhari traveled and collected between 600,000 to 700,000 hadieths, to compile a book in which a little over 7,000 were used.
This would indicate there was a whole lot of bullsh-ting going on.
This is also 300 years after the fact.
Muslim was a student of Bukhari and wrote his book.
 
Re: A learning discussion about Islam.

Yasureoktoo said:
Ishaq, the first documentation of Islam, and the only biography of Muhammed written within 200 years of his lifetime.
4/5th of the book was lost, and none of the original exists today.
It was re-written by Ibn Hussin 60 years later into the Sirat Rasuall Allah.
The History of Al Taburi was next, and contains some of what was lost in Ishaq, but nobody knows what.
Iman Bukhari traveled and collected between 600,000 to 700,000 hadieths, to compile a book in which a little over 7,000 were used.
This would indicate there was a whole lot of bullsh-ting going on.
This is also 300 years after the fact.
Muslim was a student of Bukhari and wrote his book.
Click to expand...

Muslim was a person?
 
Re: A learning discussion about Islam.

Yasureoktoo said:
This was written about long after the fact.

The reason we know so little about these people is that everyone was illiterate and nothing was written down.
a 100% fabricated genelogy from Ishmal to Muhammed was documented.

First we have to go into Muhammeds birth. He was an orphan early on and almost died, a wet nurse took care of him.
He was nobody in town, just another baby.
He was adopted into the Qusayy family.
Qusayy purchased the Custodianship of the Kab'ba fro a "Skinfull of wine and a lute" Islam's holiest site bought for music and booze.
He bought it from his grandfather, who conquered the tribe who lived there. The Juriam I believe, there were two before the Quaresh, Qusayys tribe.
All the settlements had Kab'bas, the people brought their offerings there, prayed there, walked around it , one of the pillars that would later become Islam.
The custodians were the bronze age televangelists, and profited from it.

Muhammed could not inherit it, it was for a blood relative, over 40, male, he did not qualify.

Muhammed spoke to spirits in a cave, and started his own religion, much to the chagrin of the townsfolk.
They became frustrated with him and tossed him out of town.

Now comes the lineage.
Ishmael to Muhammed.
and this is fully documented, I can look it up and get a link if interested.
Ishmael was 2000 BC.
Mecca was not even inhabited until 400 ad, and it was by different tribes.
Muhammed was nobody, why does he have a lineage.
what was it written on, where is it now. an excuse is camel bones.
what language was it written in.

I can see when he was tossed out of town,...….. and take your 20 tons of camel bones with you

Islam is one fabrication after another, the Qur'an is 9th century, not the 7th.
Most of the documents are 10th to 12th century.

Even the companions of Muhammed, supposed stories written by men who know him,
were written hundreds of years after the fact.
Click to expand...

Oh, I'm not saying there's anything to substantiate his claims, all I'm saying is Muhammad, the founder of Islam, claimed to be an Ishmaelite descendant of Abraham but certainly not a lover of Jehovah...the animosity Ishmael had toward his half brother, Isaac seems to have been handed down to his descendants, even to the extent of hating the God of Isaac...the psalmist enumerated those that are “the very ones intensely hating” Jehovah, includes the Ishmaelites...Psalms 83:1, 2, 5, 6...
 
Re: A learning discussion about Islam.

Now as Chagos pointed out we have a conflict over the successor of Muhammed.
Muhammed left no successor and there was a little turmoil.
The two main generals. Ali, Muhammeds adopted son, and Abu Bakr the guy who gave his 6 year old daughter to a 50 year old pedophile.

Now we have lots of contradiction in the text here as to what happened.
Remember the leader gets 20% of the booty collected.

We know Ali was the most popular, but Abu Bakr became the first Calief.
Ashia was mad at her dad for stealing the property she thought was rightfully hers and sided with Ali.

It went back and forth for 4 Calief's until Ali was the 4th.

Then he was attacked by the other side and his whole family was murdered.
This event is celebrated by the Shia as Ashura.

The two opposing sides would later become Sunni, and Shia, and they went different dirrections.
Sunni into Europe, and Shia into India.

The 5th Calief Malick, is credited with starting the dome of the Rock, and being the first to start documentation of the religion.
He also had to re=conquer Mecca.
after Muhammed left, it went back to the rock god religion.
 
Re: A learning discussion about Islam.

Elvira said:
Oh, I'm not saying there's anything to substantiate his claims, all I'm saying is Muhammad, the founder of Islam, claimed to be an Ishmaelite descendant of Abraham but certainly not a lover of Jehovah...the animosity Ishmael had toward his half brother, Isaac seems to have been handed down to his descendants, even to the extent of hating the God of Isaac...the psalmist enumerated those that are “the very ones intensely hating” Jehovah, includes the Ishmaelites...Psalms 83:1, 2, 5, 6...
Click to expand...

There were existing religions in the area that he drew his information from.
Islam was plagiarized from Judaism, Christianity, Zoroastrianism, and Greek medical.
Islam has no history of it's own, just fabrication.
 
Re: A learning discussion about Islam.

Yasureoktoo said:
There were existing religions in the area that he drew his information from.
Islam was plagiarized from Judaism, Christianity, Zoroastrianism, and Greek medical.
Islam has no history of it's own, just fabrication.
Click to expand...

Pretty much what I've concluded, too...with a little fantasy mixed in, to boot...
 
Re: A learning discussion about Islam.

Oh, I didn't see you and sent you a PM.

I posted your answer on pg. 7
 
You must log in or register to reply here.
Back
Top Bottom