America is NOT a christian nation

Marxistleninist said:

Although it is the major religion

The U.S. Constitution is a secular document. It begins, "We the people," and contains no mention of "God" or "Christianity." Its only references to religion are exclusionary, such as, "no religious test shall ever be required as a qualification to any office or public trust" (Art. VI), and "Congress shall make no law respecting an establishment of religion, or prohibiting the free exercise thereof" (First Amendment). The presidential oath of office, the only oath detailed in the Constitution, does not contain the phrase "so help me God" or any requirement to swear on a bible (Art. II, Sec. 1). If we are a Christian nation, why doesn't our Constitution say so?

In 1797, America made a treaty with Tripoli, declaring that "the government of the United States is not, in any sense, founded on the Christian religion." This reassurance to Islam was written during Washington's presidency, and approved by the Senate under John Adams.

As to the Declaration of Independence

We are not governed by the Declaration. Its purpose was to "dissolve the political bands," not to set up a religious nation. Its authority was based on the idea that "governments are instituted among men, deriving their just powers from the consent of the governed," which is contrary to the biblical concept of rule by divine authority. It deals with laws, taxation, representation, war, immigration, and so on, never discussing religion at all.

The references to "Nature's God," "Creator," and "Divine Providence" in the Declaration do not endorse Christianity. Thomas Jefferson, its author, was a Deist, opposed to orthodox Christianity and the supernatural.




Where in America religion was a private matter

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Thankfully American was seen a a shinning light to my grandparents and other Jews who escaped Europe and the christian churches inspired pogroms

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soylentgreen said:

I will state that i have met a small handful of americans that could be said to treat their religious beliefs with some dignity and good sense. But unfortunately the majority of american christians are nothing more than a bunch of uneducated bigoted christians whose antics make them a laughing stock for the rest of the world. A shining light, how ridiculous. More like a dark hole of ignorance.

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Marxistleninist said:

Although it is the major religion

The U.S. Constitution is a secular document. It begins, "We the people," and contains no mention of "God" or "Christianity." Its only references to religion are exclusionary, such as, "no religious test shall ever be required as a qualification to any office or public trust" (Art. VI), and "Congress shall make no law respecting an establishment of religion, or prohibiting the free exercise thereof" (First Amendment). The presidential oath of office, the only oath detailed in the Constitution, does not contain the phrase "so help me God" or any requirement to swear on a bible (Art. II, Sec. 1). If we are a Christian nation, why doesn't our Constitution say so?

In 1797, America made a treaty with Tripoli, declaring that "the government of the United States is not, in any sense, founded on the Christian religion." This reassurance to Islam was written during Washington's presidency, and approved by the Senate under John Adams.

As to the Declaration of Independence

We are not governed by the Declaration. Its purpose was to "dissolve the political bands," not to set up a religious nation. Its authority was based on the idea that "governments are instituted among men, deriving their just powers from the consent of the governed," which is contrary to the biblical concept of rule by divine authority. It deals with laws, taxation, representation, war, immigration, and so on, never discussing religion at all.

The references to "Nature's God," "Creator," and "Divine Providence" in the Declaration do not endorse Christianity. Thomas Jefferson, its author, was a Deist, opposed to orthodox Christianity and the supernatural.


Thankfully American was seen a a shinning light to my grandparents and other Jews who escaped Europe and the christian churches inspired pogroms

Where in America religion was a private matter

Click to expand...

Marxistleninist said:

Although it is the major religion

The U.S. Constitution is a secular document. It begins, "We the people," and contains no mention of "God" or "Christianity." Its only references to religion are exclusionary, such as, "no religious test shall ever be required as a qualification to any office or public trust" (Art. VI), and "Congress shall make no law respecting an establishment of religion, or prohibiting the free exercise thereof" (First Amendment). The presidential oath of office, the only oath detailed in the Constitution, does not contain the phrase "so help me God" or any requirement to swear on a bible (Art. II, Sec. 1). If we are a Christian nation, why doesn't our Constitution say so?

In 1797, America made a treaty with Tripoli, declaring that "the government of the United States is not, in any sense, founded on the Christian religion." This reassurance to Islam was written during Washington's presidency, and approved by the Senate under John Adams.

As to the Declaration of Independence

We are not governed by the Declaration. Its purpose was to "dissolve the political bands," not to set up a religious nation. Its authority was based on the idea that "governments are instituted among men, deriving their just powers from the consent of the governed," which is contrary to the biblical concept of rule by divine authority. It deals with laws, taxation, representation, war, immigration, and so on, never discussing religion at all.

The references to "Nature's God," "Creator," and "Divine Providence" in the Declaration do not endorse Christianity. Thomas Jefferson, its author, was a Deist, opposed to orthodox Christianity and the supernatural.


Thankfully American was seen a a shinning light to my grandparents and other Jews who escaped Europe and the christian churches inspired pogroms

Where in America religion was a private matter

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RobertU said:

America is not a Christian nation; it is a nation governed by the Egyptian sun-god Re (aka Ra). Those who doubt the influence of the sun-god need only look to our nation’s capital, where the Washington Monument, an obelisk, dominates the cityscape. The Egyptians were the original creators of the obelisk, a structure dedicated to the sun god.

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RAMOSS said:

I disagree. I have seen lots of religious americans which treat their religious beliefs with dignity and good sense. However, it's the 'uneducated bigoted vocal ones' that make the most noise.

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Marxistleninist said:

The U.S. Constitution is a secular document.

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Thomas Jefferson, its author, was a Deist, opposed to orthodox Christianity and the supernatural.

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Thankfully American was seen a a shinning light to my grandparents and other Jews who escaped Europe and the christian churches inspired pogroms

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soylentgreen said:

And i disagree. the number of those who show any dignity or good sense is far smaller than those who just use a belief in a god to justify their own petty selfishness.

Further more i would say america is a country where keeping the masses in a state of uneducated superstitious thrall is a convenient way to control the masses.

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soylentgreen said:

But, however the doi does mention a god. It bases all the freedoms and rights you have as an american because of its superstitious belief that a deity was responsible for creating rights. IE. In your own statement of the doi you left out, and i quote, " ...it becomes necessary for one people to dissolve the political bands which have connected them with another, and to assume among the powers of the earth, the separate and equal station to which the Laws of Nature and of Nature's God entitle them,

And saying that the constitution does not mention a god does nothing to advance your argument. Your 9th amendment states that not all rights such as the right to call yourselves a christian nation is not denied by the constitution.


Now that is a laughable statement.

I will state that i have met a small handful of americans that could be said to treat their religious beliefs with some dignity and good sense. But unfortunately the majority of american christians are nothing more than a bunch of uneducated bigoted christians whose antics make them a laughing stock for the rest of the world. A shining light, how ridiculous. More like a dark hole of ignorance.

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RAMOSS said:

I live here, you don't.. so I get to see TONS more very religious CHristians here than you do.

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Marxistleninist said:

no, the creator and to deists who wrote it doesn't mean a Jesus


Declaration of Independence

We are not governed by the Declaration. Its purpose was to "dissolve the political bands," not to set up a religious nation. Its authority was based on the idea that "governments are instituted among men, deriving their just powers from the consent of the governed," which is contrary to the biblical concept of rule by divine authority. It deals with laws, taxation, representation, war, immigration, and so on, never discussing religion at all.

The references to "Nature's God," "Creator," and "Divine Providence" in the Declaration do not endorse Christianity. Thomas Jefferson, its author, was a Deist, opposed to orthodox Christianity and the supernatural.

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soylentgreen said:

America is not a closed society or a secret kept from the world. My ability to google what is happening is as good as yours.

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Marxistleninist said:

Although it is the major religion

The U.S. Constitution is a secular document.
It begins, "We the people," and contains no mention of "God"....

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The Declaration states that “all men are created equal, that they are endowed by their Creator with certain unalienable Rights, that among these are Life, Liberty and the pursuit of Happiness.”

The Declaration contains several other references to a higher power. The introduction states that the “Laws of Nature and Nature’s God” entitle the American people to a separate and equal station among the powers of the earth. In the conclusion, Congress appeals to “the Supreme Judge of the world” for the rectitude of its intentions and professes its “firm reliance on the protection of divine Providence.” In each case, reference to a deity serves to validate the assertion of independence.

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Marxistleninist said:

Although it is the major religion

The U.S. Constitution is a secular document. It begins, "We the people," and contains no mention of "God" or "Christianity." Its only references to religion are exclusionary, such as, "no religious test shall ever be required as a qualification to any office or public trust" (Art. VI), and "Congress shall make no law respecting an establishment of religion, or prohibiting the free exercise thereof" (First Amendment). The presidential oath of office, the only oath detailed in the Constitution, does not contain the phrase "so help me God" or any requirement to swear on a bible (Art. II, Sec. 1). If we are a Christian nation, why doesn't our Constitution say so?

In 1797, America made a treaty with Tripoli, declaring that "the government of the United States is not, in any sense, founded on the Christian religion." This reassurance to Islam was written during Washington's presidency, and approved by the Senate under John Adams.

As to the Declaration of Independence

We are not governed by the Declaration. Its purpose was to "dissolve the political bands," not to set up a religious nation. Its authority was based on the idea that "governments are instituted among men, deriving their just powers from the consent of the governed," which is contrary to the biblical concept of rule by divine authority. It deals with laws, taxation, representation, war, immigration, and so on, never discussing religion at all.

The references to "Nature's God," "Creator," and "Divine Providence" in the Declaration do not endorse Christianity. Thomas Jefferson, its author, was a Deist, opposed to orthodox Christianity and the supernatural.


Thankfully American was seen a a shinning light to my grandparents and other Jews who escaped Europe and the christian churches inspired pogroms

Where in America religion was a private matter

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C. The Rule of Law

The America of 1787 inherited from medieval England the concept of rule of law, sometimes expressed as “a government of laws, not of men.” One may trace the rise of this principle in English history all the way back to the signing of Magna Charta in the year 1215, when King John found it necessary to guarantee his obedience to English laws. For that matter, medieval English writers on law derived their understanding of the rule of law from ancient Roman jurisprudence.

“The king himself ought not to be under man but under God, and under the Law, because the Law makes the king. Therefore let the king render back to the Law what the Law gives him, namely, dominion and power; for there is no king where will, and not Law, wields dominion.” So wrote Henry de Bracton, “the father of English law,” about the year 1260, during the reign of Henry III. This teaching that law is superior to human rulers has run consistently through English politics and jurisprudence all the way down the centuries. It was rather belligerently asserted from time to time by the English colonies in North America.

By and large, America has enjoyed rule of law, not of men. No President of the United States has ever tried to make himself dictator or to extend his term of office unlawfully.

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Marxistleninist said:

In 1797, America made a treaty with Tripoli, declaring that "the government of the United States is not, in any sense, founded on the Christian religion."

This reassurance to Islam was written during Washington's presidency, and approved by the Senate under John Adams.

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Years ago the "Christian nation" part of this was being passed around, falsely attributed as a saying of George Washington, but not so much now. At any rate, we should start with some data that all parties seem agreeable on.

A full text of the treaty may be found here.
All agree that there are vagaries involving the Arabic text of the treaty, which was translated into English by the American official, John Barlow. A Skeptical site now offline offered the following:


The Barlow translation is at best a poor attempt at a paraphrase or summary of the sense of the Arabic . . . . Most extraordinary (and wholly unexplained) is the fact that Article 11 of the Barlow translation, with its famous phrase, 'the government of the United States of America is not in any sense founded on the Christian Religion,' does not exist at all [in the Arabic].

There is no Article 11 [in the Arabic].

The Arabic text which is between Articles 10 and 12 is in form a letter, crude and flamboyant and withal quite unimportant, from the Dey of Algiers to the Pasha of Tripoli. How that script came to be written and to be regarded, as in the Barlow translation, as Article 11 of the treaty as there written, is a mystery and seemingly must remain so. Nothing in the diplomatic correspondence of the time throws any light whatever on the point.

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Marxistleninist said:

The words "under God," did not appear in the Pledge of Allegiance until 1954, when Congress, under McCarthyism, inserted them. Likewise, Congress mandated that "In God We Trust" appear on all currency only in 1955, and it was absent from paper currency prior to 1957. (It appeared on some coins earlier, as did other sundry phrases, such as "Mind Your Business.") "In God We Trust" was belatedly adopted as our national motto in 1956.

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E pluribus Unum "One out of many" - out of the 13 colonies emerged a single nation.

Never codified by law, E pluribus unum was considered a de facto motto of the United States[5] until 1956 when the United States Congress passed an act (H. J. Resolution 396), adopting "In God We Trust" as the official motto.[6]

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The official U.S. motto, chosen by John Adams, Benjamin Franklin, and Thomas Jefferson, is E Pluribus Unum ("Of Many, One"), celebrating plurality, not theocracy.

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Rejected Designs for the Great Seal of the United States

But if John Adams, Thomas Jefferson, and Benjamin Franklin had their way, the seal would look very different.


After they'd completed their work on the Declaration of Independence, John Adams, Thomas Jefferson, and Benjamin Franklin were chosen by the Continental Congress to work as a committee and submit a seal design for approval

We have the descriptions of each man's proposed seal from a letter John Adams wrote to his wife, Abigail. Adams suggested an illustration depicting the Choice of Hercules. This Greek allegory has Hercules deciding which path to walk in life by deliberating with the female personifications of Pleasure and Virtue.


Jefferson wanted an illustration of the Israelites' exodus out of slavery and bondage from Egypt for the front of his seal. For the back side of the seal, Jefferson proposed an illustration of Hengist and Horsa, 5th-century Saxon warriors from Germany.


Franklin had a similar idea to Jefferson’s and wanted to illustrate a scene from the Exodus of the Israelites. The seal would show Moses parting the Red Sea with Pharaoh and his chariots being overwhelmed by the waters with the motto: Rebellion to tyrants is obedience to God.
Thomas Jefferson became so enamored with this motto he incorporated it for his own personal seal design.


One of the first actions of the Great Seal Committee was to call on an outside consultant to assist in the task. They picked artist Pierre Eugene Du Simitière, who, like the rest of this committee, was a member of the American Philosophical Society. Du Simitèire was born in Switzerland and was a painter, naturalist, and antiquarian collector. The picture above is what the committee picked for front of the seal, which was a revision of Du Simitèire’s proposal.

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Marxistleninist said:

America is NOT a christian nation

Although it is the major religion

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soylentgreen said:

I will state that i have met a small handful of americans that could be said to treat their religious beliefs with some dignity and good sense. But unfortunately the majority of american christians are nothing more than a bunch of uneducated bigoted christians whose antics make them a laughing stock for the rest of the world. A shining light, how ridiculous. More like a dark hole of ignorance.

Click to expand...

soylentgreen said:

America is not a closed society or a secret kept from the world. My ability to google what is happening is as good as yours.

Click to expand...

Marxistleninist said:

The words "under God," did not appear in the Pledge of Allegiance until 1954, when Congress, under McCarthyism, inserted them. Likewise, Congress mandated that "In God We Trust" appear on all currency only in 1955, and it was absent from paper currency prior to 1957. (It appeared on some coins earlier, as did other sundry phrases, such as "Mind Your Business.") "In God We Trust" was belatedly adopted as our national motto in 1956. The official U.S. motto, chosen by John Adams, Benjamin Franklin, and Thomas Jefferson, is E Pluribus Unum ("Of Many, One"), celebrating plurality, not theocracy.

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tosca1 said:

Lol. :lol:

Well.....it may not have been written in the Constitution, but certainly....

……....the USA is not secular as you'd want it to be.



IN GOD WE TRUST...……



………..is the OFFICIAL MOTTO of the USA!




Sorry.....but the God referred to, is the Abrahamic God - specifically, Christian!


History of 'In God We Trust'





Apparently, God is also mentioned in the Declaration of Independence.



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