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[W: 330] Why People Hate Religion

Re: Why People Hate Religion

Omega Man said:
Welcome to Dualism; meet "the devil".


OM
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Is dualism the belief that who we are can be separated from our brains and transposed into another ?

You know like the basis of the plot for the movie "Freaky Friday" ?
 
Re: Why People Hate Religion

Rich2018 said:
Is dualism the belief that who we are can be separated from our brains and transposed into another ?

You know like the basis of the plot for the movie "Freaky Friday" ?
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Ahura Mazda vs. Ahriman. Zoroastrianism's overt influence upon post-Exilic Judaism (and by direct extension, Judeo-Christianity) is unquestionable. Heaven, hell, a day of atonement, an adversary, and of course the "eternal flame" incorporated into the 2nd temple in Jerusalem - all borrowed concepts long since incorporated into the Judeo-Christian ideology.


OM
 
Re: Why People Hate Religion

Omega Man said:
Ahura Mazda vs. Ahriman. Zoroastrianism's overt influence upon post-Exilic Judaism (and by direct extension, Judeo-Christianity) is unquestionable. Heaven, hell, a day of atonement, an adversary, and of course the "eternal flame" incorporated into the 2nd temple in Jerusalem - all borrowed concepts long since incorporated into the Judeo-Christian ideology.


OM
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That's a little too deep for me. Chapter 6 of Richard Dawkins' book "The God Delusion" is about as deep as I can go.
 
Re: Why People Hate Religion

Rich2018 said:
That it's false and poisons people's minds.

Richard Dawkins tries to explain the power that religion has by exploring how we're programmed that way.

From birth we're programmed to obey authority figures to not eat colorful berries, don't touch hot things etc until we do things from a Classical Conditioning reaction ... often contrary to the evidence.

There's an example of a school on fire and kids running past a fire exit because it had been drilled into them not to use it as a convenient exit over the years.
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What better way to take advantage of this social and instinctual conditioning than to label your deity "The Father."
 
Re: Why People Hate Religion

Elvira said:
Some people mistakenly think that is the focus of Christianity when all they have to consider is the focus of Jesus Christ and the apostles when they were on earth...feeding of the poor was obviously not it, since Jesus stated...

"For you always have the poor with you, and you can do them good whenever you want to, but you will not always have me." Mark 14:7

The sick and the poor will always be present in this system of things...we can, and we should, do good things for them when possible but Jesus' and the apostle's main focus was preaching the good news of the kingdom, which would put an end to the sick and the poor forever...the only real hope for mankind...

But he said to them: “I must also declare the good news of the Kingdom of God to other cities, because for this I was sent.” Luke 4:43



Luke 4 — Watchtower ONLINE LIBRARY
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33 He will put the sheep on his right and the goats on his left.

34 “Then the King will say to those on his right, ‘Come, you who are blessed by my Father; take your inheritance, the kingdom prepared for you since the creation of the world. 35 For I was hungry and you gave me something to eat, I was thirsty and you gave me something to drink, I was a stranger and you invited me in, 36 I needed clothes and you clothed me, I was sick and you looked after me, I was in prison and you came to visit me.’

37 “Then the righteous will answer him, ‘Lord, when did we see you hungry and feed you, or thirsty and give you something to drink? 38 When did we see you a stranger and invite you in, or needing clothes and clothe you? 39 When did we see you sick or in prison and go to visit you?’

40 “The King will reply, ‘Truly I tell you, whatever you did for one of the least of these brothers and sisters of mine, you did for me.’

41 “Then he will say to those on his left, ‘Depart from me, you who are cursed, into the eternal fire prepared for the devil and his angels. 42 For I was hungry and you gave me nothing to eat, I was thirsty and you gave me nothing to drink, 43 I was a stranger and you did not invite me in, I needed clothes and you did not clothe me, I was sick and in prison and you did not look after me.’

44 “They also will answer, ‘Lord, when did we see you hungry or thirsty or a stranger or needing clothes or sick or in prison, and did not help you?’

45 “He will reply, ‘Truly I tell you, whatever you did not do for one of the least of these, you did not do for me.’
Matthew 25:33-45
 
Re: Why People Hate Religion

HonestJoe said:
Ironically, I actually think this is a key part of the problem. The writer presents the idea that this nun is good because she is Christian, because of what (she believes) she heard from God. The validity of her work isn’t being rationally explained and justified, it is automatically deemed positive by definition.

The creates the problem of when other people who claim to be doing the work of God do “bad” things. Because the definitive association between what a person does and their beliefs has been established by the earlier example, they have to make all those logical twists and turns to disconnect the “bad” from belief in God without disconnecting the “good”. That becomes even more difficult when there are different opinions over whether the acts in question are actually “bad”.
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Anyone who thinks that Christians aren't sinners is delusional.
 
Re: Why People Hate Religion

bearpoker said:
33 He will put the sheep on his right and the goats on his left.

34 “Then the King will say to those on his right, ‘Come, you who are blessed by my Father; take your inheritance, the kingdom prepared for you since the creation of the world. 35 For I was hungry and you gave me something to eat, I was thirsty and you gave me something to drink, I was a stranger and you invited me in, 36 I needed clothes and you clothed me, I was sick and you looked after me, I was in prison and you came to visit me.’

37 “Then the righteous will answer him, ‘Lord, when did we see you hungry and feed you, or thirsty and give you something to drink? 38 When did we see you a stranger and invite you in, or needing clothes and clothe you? 39 When did we see you sick or in prison and go to visit you?’

40 “The King will reply, ‘Truly I tell you, whatever you did for one of the least of these brothers and sisters of mine, you did for me.’

41 “Then he will say to those on his left, ‘Depart from me, you who are cursed, into the eternal fire prepared for the devil and his angels. 42 For I was hungry and you gave me nothing to eat, I was thirsty and you gave me nothing to drink, 43 I was a stranger and you did not invite me in, I needed clothes and you did not clothe me, I was sick and in prison and you did not look after me.’

44 “They also will answer, ‘Lord, when did we see you hungry or thirsty or a stranger or needing clothes or sick or in prison, and did not help you?’

45 “He will reply, ‘Truly I tell you, whatever you did not do for one of the least of these, you did not do for me.’
Matthew 25:33-45
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For clarification, this was a parable or illustration that pictured or referred to “the Son of man,” also called “the King,” as Jesus...the "brothers and sisters of mine," referring to those who would rule with Christ in heaven, as well as to all of mankind after they are restored to earthly perfection...it had nothing to do with actually feeding the poor on earth in the present...
 
Re: Why People Hate Religion

Elvira said:
For clarification, this was a parable or illustration that pictured or referred to “the Son of man,” also called “the King,” as Jesus...the "brothers and sisters of mine," referring to those who would rule with Christ in heaven, as well as to all of mankind after they are restored to earthly perfection...it had nothing to do with actually feeding the poor on earth in the present...
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So JW's aren't obligated to feed the hungry, care for the sick, shelter the homeless, visit the imprisoned? Good to know. You ignore our Lords commands at your peril.
 
Re: Why People Hate Religion

VanceMack said:
Using your rationale you might just have well said "why I hate black people". Its the same mindset that has people saying"why I hate cops". All you are doing is justifying your own petty hatred and bigotry. You seek the negative examples and let that justify your petty hatred while ignoring the VAST majority of people that do good work daily.

Bigotry is a pretty sick thing to watch.
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Hating religion is not hating people. Do you hate communism? Are you a bigot if you do?
 
Re: Why People Hate Religion

bearpoker said:
So JW's aren't obligated to feed the hungry, care for the sick, shelter the homeless, visit the imprisoned? Good to know. You ignore our Lords commands at your peril.
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Obligated, no...we just do it...parables are meant to be looked at with the spiritual eye, not the physical...that is an obligation...btw, our spiritual brothers should come 1st, just as Jesus stated in his parable..

"So, then, as long as we have the opportunity, let us work what is good toward all, but especially toward those related to us in the faith." Galatians 6:10
 
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Re: Why People Hate Religion

Elvira said:
Obligated, no...we just do it...parables are meant to be looked at with the spiritual eye, not the physical...that is an obligation...btw, our spiritual brothers should come 1st, just as Jesus stated in his parable..

"So, then, as long as we have the opportunity, let us work what is good toward all, but especially toward those related to us in the faith." Galatians 6:10
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Have you got biblical justification for that? The one time that Jesus said that he was come only for the Jews, he got knocked back.
Matthew 15:28 (WEB) Then Jesus answered her, "Woman, great is your faith! Be it done to you even as you desire." And her daughter was healed from that hour.

You don't have to convert the world to make them worthy of salvation. They don't have to be saved to be fed. That's a terrible notion. When we feed the hungry we don't ask about their religion or their politics.
 
Re: Why People Hate Religion

bearpoker said:
Have you got biblical justification for that? The one time that Jesus said that he was come only for the Jews, he got knocked back.
Matthew 15:28 (WEB) Then Jesus answered her, "Woman, great is your faith! Be it done to you even as you desire." And her daughter was healed from that hour.

You don't have to convert the world to make them worthy of salvation. They don't have to be saved to be fed. That's a terrible notion. When we feed the hungry we don't ask about their religion or their politics.
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The world will not be converted, that is a fact Jesus recognized when he told his disciples to dust off their feet and move on to those who would listen to them, but preaching the good news of the kingdom was Jesus' main focus during his human life, that cannot be denied...it was also the reason for his performing miracles, to show others what that kingdom will do for them...
 
Re: Why People Hate Religion

devildavid said:
Hating religion is not hating people. Do you hate communism? Are you a bigot if you do?
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bigot noun
big·​ot | \ ˈbi-gət
\
Definition of bigot

: a person who is obstinately or intolerantly devoted to his or her own opinions and prejudices especially : one who regards or treats the members of a group (such as a racial or ethnic group) with hatred and intolerance

When you go out of your way to site specific examples of individual behavior to justify your petty hatred of a group...you are a bigot.
 
Re: Why People Hate Religion

Elvira said:
The world will not be converted, that is a fact Jesus recognized when he told his disciples to dust off their feet and move on to those who would listen to them, but preaching the good news of the kingdom was Jesus' main focus during his human life, that cannot be denied...it was also the reason for his performing miracles, to show others what that kingdom will do for them...
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Galatians 6:9 New International Version (NIV)

9 Let us not become weary in doing good, for at the proper time we will reap a harvest if we do not give up.

Exactly. Which is why we feed the hungry etc. But more than that, it is who we are. We are to be the light of the world, the salt of the earth. We feed the hungry, shelter the homeless, welcome the stranger because in the hungry, the homeless, the stranger, we see Christ, our Lord.
 
Re: Why People Hate Religion

VanceMack said:
bigot noun
big·​ot | \ ˈbi-gət
\
Definition of bigot

: a person who is obstinately or intolerantly devoted to his or her own opinions and prejudices especially : one who regards or treats the members of a group (such as a racial or ethnic group) with hatred and intolerance

When you go out of your way to site specific examples of individual behavior to justify your petty hatred of a group...you are a bigot.
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Religion is not a group.
 
Re: Why People Hate Religion

bearpoker said:
Galatians 6:9 New International Version (NIV)

9 Let us not become weary in doing good, for at the proper time we will reap a harvest if we do not give up.

Exactly. Which is why we feed the hungry etc. But more than that, it is who we are. We are to be the light of the world, the salt of the earth. We feed the hungry, shelter the homeless, welcome the stranger because in the hungry, the homeless, the stranger, we see Christ, our Lord.
Click to expand...

Do you know what Paul was referring to when he said "Let us not become weary in doing good"? Like Jesus, we can endure trials if we keep focused on the Kingdom hope, because as Jesus and Paul already knew ans endured themselves, followers of Christ would be hated for the message they bring to the nations....

"as we look intently at the Chief Agent and Perfecter of our faith, Jesus. For the joy that was set before him he endured a torture stake, despising shame, and has sat down at the right hand of the throne of God. Indeed, consider closely the one who has endured such hostile speech from sinners against their own interests, so that you may not get tired and give up." Hebrews 12:2, 3

Do you realize what "we will reap a harvest if we do not give up" actually means? It has nothing to do with taking care of others...Paul goes on to tell us in his other writings, such as...

"For we actually become partakers of the Christ only if we hold firmly down to the end the confidence we had at the beginning." Hebrews 3:14

"Indeed, consider closely the one who has endured such hostile speech from sinners against their own interests, so that you may not get tired and give up." Hebrews 12:13
 
Re: Why People Hate Religion

I don't know about hate, as I feel more contempt for the concept than anything else.
 
Re: Why People Hate Religion

Rich2018 said:
So the little or no evidence to support any religion, or the terrible things it has done, is of no relevance to you ?
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No, because the crimes and the lies of our accusers are far worse. Get the splinter out of your own eye first, then I'll hear what you have to say.
 
Re: Why People Hate Religion

it's just me said:
No, because the crimes and the lies of our accusers are far worse. Get the splinter out of your own eye first, then I'll hear what you have to say.
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Let's see you actually show that is true. Give your sources and your reasoning.
 
Re: Why People Hate Religion

RAMOSS said:
Let's see you actually show that is true. Give your sources and your reasoning.
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Either ask Rich that same question or butt out.
 
Re: Why People Hate Religion

devildavid said:
Hating religion is not hating people. Do you hate communism? Are you a bigot if you do?
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Correct. So, when people accuse me of hating Muslims because I hate Islam, can I count on you jumping in and telling them that "Hating religion is not hating people"?
 
Re: Why People Hate Religion

it's just me said:
Because you aren't going to get away with not doing it.
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What do you think I am trying to 'get away with '? Trying to get you to support your claims?
 
Re: Why People Hate Religion

VanceMack said:
bigot noun
big·​ot | \ ˈbi-gət
\
Definition of bigot

: a person who is obstinately or intolerantly devoted to his or her own opinions and prejudices especially : one who regards or treats the members of a group (such as a racial or ethnic group) with hatred and intolerance

When you go out of your way to site specific examples of individual behavior to justify your petty hatred of a group...you are a bigot.
Click to expand...

Describing yourself?
 
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