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[W:843] How religious thinking works

nota bene said:
You're entitled to your opinion. And what you've expressed here is just that.
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Nope. That is fact.

It is fact that there was no world wide flood. It would show up in the geological record. It does not.

It is a fact that a person cannot live in side a fish for three days. They would be consumed.

It is a fact that mankind did not poof into existence. We evolved.

It is a fact that there is zero evidence that the Exodus happened, or that Jews were ever enslaved en masse in Egypt. This even though the Egyptians kept good records during the entire period, and never once mention the enslaving of the Jews..


Which of these do you not know is a fact? I'm not sure where your education is lacking, but if you tell me I can point you in the right direction to fix it.
 
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JustHanging said:
Nope. That is fact.

It is fact that there was no world wide flood. It would show up in the geological record. It does not.

It is a fact that a person cannot live in side a fish for three days. They would be consumed.

It is a fact that mankind did not poof into existence. We evolved.

It is a fact that there is zero evidence that the Exodus happened, or that Jews were ever enslaved en masse in Egypt. This even though the Egyptians kept good records during the entire period, and never once mention the enslaving of the Jews..


Which of these do you not know is a fact? I'm not sure where your education is lacking, but if you tell me I can point you in the right direction to fix it.
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You left out one very important fact...man does NOT know everything...
 
Elvira said:
You left out one very important fact...man does NOT know everything...
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I never said anything remotely like "man knows everything." But I did state fact.

Santa Claus may indeed exist. So might Harry Potter, Yahweh, or any other storybook character . But none are very likely.
 
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JustHanging said:
I never said anything remotely like "man knows everything."

Santa Claus may indeed exist. So might Harry Potter and Yahweh. But none are very likely.
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We do know that there was no Biblical flood, Jonah was not swallowed by a whale, etc.
 
zyzygy said:
We do know that there was no Biblical flood, Jonah was not swallowed by a whale, etc.
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You mean, with man's very limited knowledge...which in no way means it did not happen...
 
JustHanging said:
Yes it is.

Evidence tells us Noah's flood never happened. There is zero evidence outside of an old tale that the exodus happened. People can't live inside a fish for three days. Mankind wasn't poofed into existence, we evolved over billions of years.

If you believe the bible is the word of a god, then that god sure got a lot of things wrong. A modern middle school student could tell you that.
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You also must remember the educational level of those people who wrote the bible. There is so much of our modern world that they could never fathom.

Our today would be there heaven. If you could go back in time and show them on a video of modern life (a video would be mind blowing for them) they would be in shock to seeing people driving cars and flying in airplanes. They would be unable to comprehend all the luxuries we have in our homes. Surely this would be heaven to them.

I have nothing against those people as they were just doing their best to make an answer for all the mysteries of life.
 
Elvira said:
You left out one very important fact...man does NOT know everything...
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And, you left out another. Man does know a lot. Man has objective and tangible evidence for geological events. Man know the physics involved in rainfall, pressure and energy. We know enough physics, geography, and history to know that many of the events in the bible are physically impossible. We know, for example, mankind existed for much longer than the YEC claim. We know, for example, that there were civilizations that were uninterrupted for 12000 years. We know , by examining the green river varves that there was not a massive flood even that distributed it for the last 5M to 8M years. Those are what is based on objective and tangible evidence. Say ' we don't know everything 'is ignoring everything we do know so that the ridiculous can be believed.
 
RAMOSS said:
And, you left out another. Man does know a lot. Man has objective and tangible evidence for geological events. Man know the physics involved in rainfall, pressure and energy. We know enough physics, geography, and history to know that many of the events in the bible are physically impossible. We know, for example, mankind existed for much longer than the YEC claim. We know, for example, that there were civilizations that were uninterrupted for 12000 years. We know , by examining the green river varves that there was not a massive flood even that distributed it for the last 5M to 8M years. Those are what is based on objective and tangible evidence. Say ' we don't know everything 'is ignoring everything we do know so that the ridiculous can be believed.
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So he says...:roll:
 
Elvira said:
So he says...:roll:
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Yes, I said. I have specific examples, such as 'The green river varves'. Can you refute that? Or, are you doing hand waving dismissal, because you can't address the evidence?
 
RAMOSS said:
Yes, I said. I have specific examples, such as 'The green river varves'. Can you refute that? Or, are you doing hand waving dismissal, because you can't address the evidence?
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Evidence proves what is, not what isn't...just because evidence has not been found yet, it does not mean evidence is not there to be found in the future...
 
Elvira said:
You left out one very important fact...man does NOT know everything...
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Scientific men don't and freely admit to it. Their aim is to find out knowledge and seek the truth.

The ones that claim to know everything are the Theists like your JW. They claim to have a revealed truth and know things like the afterlife based on what a book tells them.
 
Rich2018 said:
Scientific men don't and freely admit to it. Their aim is to find out knowledge and seek the truth.

The ones that claim to know everything are the Theists like your JW. They claim to have a revealed truth and know things like the afterlife based on what a book tells them.
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That is a lie...we have never claimed to know everything and readily admit to that...unlike certain atheists who claim if there is no evidence, it does not exist...
 
Elvira said:
Evidence proves what is, not what isn't...just because evidence has not been found yet, it does not mean evidence is not there to be found in the future...
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THis, actually is incorrect. Evidence can prove what it is. Evidence can also falsify ideas. That is how both science works, and how problem solving work. Evidence can eliminate possibilities. One possibility that has been eliminated is the idea of a world wide flood.
 
RAMOSS said:
THis, actually is incorrect. Evidence can prove what it is. Evidence can also falsify ideas. That is how both science works, and how problem solving work. Evidence can eliminate possibilities. One possibility that has been eliminated is the idea of a world wide flood.
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That is actually incorrect...evidence can only prove what is, not what is not...
 
Elvira said:
That is actually incorrect...evidence can only prove what is, not what is not...
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Use a real life scenario, and show that is true. Give me evidence.
 
Elvira said:
Jehovah God...give evidence that He is not...
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That is what is known as 'argument from ignorance'. Let me give an example of where evidence shows something is NOT.

I am IT programer, and I was working on a customer problem. He had a program that wouldn't work when he had all a bunch of disks accessed (THink of the different drives in a PC). WHen he just have the standard drives access, the program worked fine. I took away one of the drives he had accessed when he was failing, and it still failed. That is evidence that the problems he had was not on that drive. I repeated that until I removed a specific drive, and then his program suddently started working again. That is evidence that the problem he had was because he was accessing that specific drive and it was interfering with his program.

So, I found, through the process of elmination, drives that he was accessing that was NOT his problem.

You are just doing the logical fallacy of 'shifting the burden of proof', as well as not understanding how evidence works.

Another item I did is give specific evidence that showed there was no 'world wide flood' within the last 5 million years. You fail to refute that positive evidence for the lack of a flood. Refute the evidence of the Green River Varves.


Now, before I approach the subject , can you define what you mean by 'the jehovah god'? Can you define 'The Jehovah God' in terms other than things that 'The Jehovah God' was supposed to have done, and without using terms that are exclusively metaphysical?? What is the 'Jehovah God'?
 
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RAMOSS said:
That is what is known as 'argument from ignorance'. Let me give an example of where evidence shows something is NOT.

I am IT programer, and I was working on a customer problem. He had a program that wouldn't work when he had all a bunch of disks accessed (THink of the different drives in a PC). WHen he just have the standard drives access, the program worked fine. I took away one of the drives he had accessed when he was failing, and it still failed. That is evidence that the problems he had was not on that drive. I repeated that until I removed a specific drive, and then his program suddently started working again. That is evidence that the problem he had was because he was accessing that specific drive and it was interfering with his program.

So, I found, through the process of elmination, drives that he was accessing that was NOT his problem.

You are just doing the logical fallacy of 'shifting the burden of proof', as well as not understanding how evidence works.

Another item I did is give specific evidence that showed there was no 'world wide flood' within the last 5 million years. You fail to refute that positive evidence for the lack of a flood. Refute the evidence of the Green River Varves.
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Deflection, I see...you cannot give evidence to prove something does not exist...plain and simple...
 
Elvira said:
That is a lie...we have never claimed to know everything and readily admit to that...unlike certain atheists who claim if there is no evidence, it does not exist...
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Oh really?

What do you claim to not know? (that is what you wish to know)

There are different definitions of "evidence" one would be to support that which is evident. By that definition there is no evidence that god exists.
But we will use the legal usage and refer to evidence as that which may support your argument.
 
Elvira said:
Deflection, I see...you cannot give evidence to prove something does not exist...plain and simple...
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Why, yes I did. I showed that the world wide flood did not exist within the last 5 to 8 millino years, by using the example of the Green River Varves. WHy do you misrepresent things?
 
RAMOSS said:
Why, yes I did. I showed that the world wide flood did not exist within the last 5 to 8 millino years, by using the example of the Green River Varves. WHy do you misrepresent things?
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No, you gave information pertaining to man's limited knowledge at the present, which could change tomorrow...that's how science works...
 
Elvira said:
No, you gave information pertaining to man's limited knowledge at the present, which could change tomorrow...that's how science works...
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Ah, the argument from ignorance, with the sophomoric 'we can't know anything conclusion. That is incorrect. We know enough that we have elminated a lot of things from possibility. One is definitely 'a world wide flood from the last 5 to 8 million years.
 
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