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Does God Approve of Gays?

Omega Man said:
...only since the messianic authors insisted as such; but not before. My teacher was much more authoritative on the subject than yours.


OM
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My teacher is Jesus...
 
Elvira said:
My teacher is Jesus...
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...which unfortunately he never wrote for himself. So... all you got to depend on are messianic authors; authors notorious for betraying the original texts. On a related note, I thought that was the entire premise behind your ideology? That the "others" got it all wrong by betraying the texts? Kind of ironic, seeing as they're still betrayed.


OM
 
RAMOSS said:
It's a different book, written by a different person, a number of hundreds of years later.

Here is some history about that viewpoint


How the Serpent Became Satan - Biblical Archaeology Society
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Pre-CISELY.

"The worldview of Jewish readers of Genesis 2–3 profoundly changed in the centuries since the story was first written. After the canon of the Hebrew Bible closed, beliefs in angels, demons and a final apocalyptic battle arose in a divided and turbulent Jewish community. In light of this impending end, many turned to a renewed understanding of the beginning, and the Garden of Eden was re-read—and re-written—to reflect the changing ideas of a changed world. Two separate things happened and then merged: Satan became the proper name of the devil, a supernatural power now seen to oppose God as the leader of demons and the forces of evil; and the serpent in the Garden of Eden came to be identified with him."

Or to state it succinctly, a betrayal of the original texts.


OM
 
Elvira said:
Yeah, the whole book was written by 40 some different persons...what does that have to do with the price of eggs in China? I already know how...the Bible tells me how...
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Because, of course, Christianity plagiarized it from Judaism, and made claims about it were foreign from the writer of Genesis, or the Jewish religion all together. It's known as 'reading in context'.
 
Omega Man said:
Pre-CISELY.

"The worldview of Jewish readers of Genesis 2–3 profoundly changed in the centuries since the story was first written. After the canon of the Hebrew Bible closed, beliefs in angels, demons and a final apocalyptic battle arose in a divided and turbulent Jewish community. In light of this impending end, many turned to a renewed understanding of the beginning, and the Garden of Eden was re-read—and re-written—to reflect the changing ideas of a changed world. Two separate things happened and then merged: Satan became the proper name of the devil, a supernatural power now seen to oppose God as the leader of demons and the forces of evil; and the serpent in the Garden of Eden came to be identified with him."

Or to state it succinctly, a betrayal of the original texts.


OM
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One thing the writer of the article got wrong is the range of dates of 'the wisdom of solomon'.. which was 1st century bc to 1st century ce. It also doesn't mention that it was written in Greek.
 
RAMOSS said:
Because, of course, Christianity plagiarized it from Judaism, and made claims about it were foreign from the writer of Genesis, or the Jewish religion all together. It's known as 'reading in context'.
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That's your tale...I sit on mine...:2razz:
 
Omega Man said:
Please cite the verse for purposes of context.


OM
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Matthew 16:4, "A wicked and adulterous generation seeks after a sign; and there shall no sign be given unto it, but the sign of the prophet Jonah. And he left them, and departed."

Matthew 12:38-39, "Then some of the scribes and Pharisees said to Him, "Teacher, we want to see a sign from You." But He answered and said to them, "An evil and adulterous generation craves for a sign; and yet no sign will be given to it but the sign of Jonah the prophet;"

John 4:48, "So Jesus said to him, "Unless you people see signs and wonders, you simply will not believe."

This one is for you: John 6:30, "So they said to Him, "What then do You do for a sign, so that we may see, and believe You? What work do You perform?" I've been giving you the method to know God. It's in James 1:5, "If any of you lack wisdom, let him ask of God, that giveth to all men liberally, and upbraideth not; and it shall be given him." Those who seek for a sign are double-minded people which subsequent versus warn against.
 
RAMOSS said:
It's a different book, written by a different person, a number of hundreds of years later.

Here is some history about that viewpoint


How the Serpent Became Satan - Biblical Archaeology Society
Click to expand...

Adam and Eve knew who he was after they partook of the fruit of the tree of knowledge. Their eyes were open and said the serpent gave Eve the fruit and she ate. However, once they left the Garden, Lucifer (now Satan) was not recognized. He and the third of the hosts of heaven that fell with Lucifer are here to tempt and torment mankind. And, possibly for centuries, Satan was able to stay hidden from the people's understanding. No big issue. For centuries after the Apostles died off, there was a great apostasy that took place in which the people struggled to identify Satan and his teachings of evil and destruction. But, now, the Holy Ghost can again be given to the people by those who have the authority to do so.
 
Calamity: The truth about homosexual behavior is that it is natural, at least it is for anyone who is attracted to people of the same sex.

Cougarbear: It's not natural. We are here on earth to multiply and replentish the earth. Only Heterosexual sexual intercourse is natural for this purpose. The natural purpose we are here. Those who have developed same-sex attraction have done so from their environment and then they have obsessive behavior difficulties and fall into that trap. Eventually, their minds are changed so they can accept that which is unnatural to make it natural for them. But, as in Romans chapter 1 says, it is still a vile sin to partake in this unnatural sexual behavior. Better to remain celibate.

Calamity: Do you know what is not natural? Obsessing about other people having sex.

Cougarbear: Why is that? I hope people are having sex and keeping their babies and not murdering them prematurely while still in the womb. And, I'm not obsessing. I'm warning them that their actions are sinful and they should stop and repent. Give their lives over to Jesus Christ and be saved. So, if I'm obsessed in saving my brothers and sisters from self-destruction, then I'm fine with that.
 
Cougarbear said:
Adam and Eve knew who he was after they partook of the fruit of the tree of knowledge. Their eyes were open and said the serpent gave Eve the fruit and she ate. However, once they left the Garden, Lucifer (now Satan) was not recognized. He and the third of the hosts of heaven that fell with Lucifer are here to tempt and torment mankind. And, possibly for centuries, Satan was able to stay hidden from the people's understanding. No big issue. For centuries after the Apostles died off, there was a great apostasy that took place in which the people struggled to identify Satan and his teachings of evil and destruction. But, now, the Holy Ghost can again be given to the people by those who have the authority to do so.
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let's see you show that is more than religious dogma, rhetoric, opinion and speculation. You make lots of claims full of loaded terms. You have yet to show that it is based on reality.

As for 'Roman's 1' , Paul/Saul was just a man, that seemed to have many emotional issues. I don't see anything he writes as truth.
 
Cougarbear said:
Matthew 16:4, "A wicked and adulterous generation seeks after a sign; and there shall no sign be given unto it, but the sign of the prophet Jonah. And he left them, and departed."

Matthew 12:38-39, "Then some of the scribes and Pharisees said to Him, "Teacher, we want to see a sign from You." But He answered and said to them, "An evil and adulterous generation craves for a sign; and yet no sign will be given to it but the sign of Jonah the prophet;"

John 4:48, "So Jesus said to him, "Unless you people see signs and wonders, you simply will not believe."

This one is for you: John 6:30, "So they said to Him, "What then do You do for a sign, so that we may see, and believe You? What work do You perform?" I've been giving you the method to know God. It's in James 1:5, "If any of you lack wisdom, let him ask of God, that giveth to all men liberally, and upbraideth not; and it shall be given him." Those who seek for a sign are double-minded people which subsequent versus warn against.
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First, the Gospel of John was written quite late, for a community that was already Christian, but was involved in doctrinal disputes. Its purpose wasn't to present a realistic picture of Jesus, but rather to use him as a figure through whom to present the authors theology, rather than the conflicting views of others prevalent at the time. In short, didactic fiction; similar to how Plato previously had placed his own philosophy into the mouth of Socrates. The author was definitely inspired by Greek principles and methods. By the time it was written, it was at least a full-generation removed from the destruction of Jerusalem, at a time when the paths of Judaism and Christianity had irrevocably diverged, and it was fully understood that the future of Christianity itself - its very survival - depended upon the Gentile world. This is why the tale reflects Jesus as more a "universal Son of God", and less of a sectarian Jewish prophet. In other words, Lao Tzu-like sage advice from a fictional story really bears no relevance to me, personally; especially if it merely reflects the authors own personal theology.

Secondly, the Book of James is kind of a scam, really; attempting to come off as fundamentally authoritative. It was written rather late, circa 90 CE; during the reign of Domitian. It was an anachronism. The unknown author ascribed the book to James in an attempt to give it a sense of authority (a common tactic of the era and region), and attempted to frame it to appear as though it were authored prior to the Council of Jerusalem in 48 CE (which if were true, would it make it the earliest epistle, and thus pre-date Paulian Christianity). The author gives himself away, as the book itself was written in much better Greek than one could ever have hoped to expect from an unlettered and unrefined Galilean such as the real James. In other words, I don't need to heed to words of an ancient acolyte, nor do they apply to me.


OM
 
Cougarbear said:
Adam and Eve knew who he was after they partook of the fruit of the tree of knowledge. Their eyes were open and said the serpent gave Eve the fruit and she ate. However, once they left the Garden, Lucifer (now Satan) was not recognized. He and the third of the hosts of heaven that fell with Lucifer are here to tempt and torment mankind. And, possibly for centuries, Satan was able to stay hidden from the people's understanding. No big issue. For centuries after the Apostles died off, there was a great apostasy that took place in which the people struggled to identify Satan and his teachings of evil and destruction. But, now, the Holy Ghost can again be given to the people by those who have the authority to do so.
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Not only are you referring to a myth as though it was history, but you've also got the entire biblical basis of Lucifer wrong as well. The biblical Lucifer, literally, referred to the planet Venus as a symbolic reference to the impending downfall of Nebuchadnezzar at the hands of Cyrus. Bronze and Iron Age kings of the Near East were renowned for declaring themselves as solar deities; "eternal" sun gods. Nebuchadnezzar was no exception, and Deutero-Isaiah was poking fun at him symbolically by comparing him instead to the fleeting light of Venus (the "morning star") which quickly disappears at dawn, rather than comparing him to the "eternal" light of the sun. Once one understands true context of the Bible, it is much easier to understand the basis of the stories, rather than spend ones entire life dedicated to a lie - betrayals of the original texts.


OM
 
Omega Man said:
Not only are you referring to a myth as though it was history, but you've also got the entire biblical basis of Lucifer wrong as well. The biblical Lucifer, literally, referred to the planet Venus as a symbolic reference to the impending downfall of Nebuchadnezzar at the hands of Cyrus. Bronze and Iron Age kings of the Near East were renowned for declaring themselves as solar deities; "eternal" sun gods. Nebuchadnezzar was no exception, and Deutero-Isaiah was poking fun at him symbolically by comparing him instead to the fleeting light of Venus (the "morning star") which quickly disappears at dawn, rather than comparing him to the "eternal" light of the sun. Once one understands true context of the Bible, it is much easier to understand the basis of the stories, rather than spend ones entire life dedicated to a lie - betrayals of the original texts.


OM
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Is the Bible True? | Videos
 
Elvira said:
the video speaks for itself...
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Would rather you do that. Prompting people who have taken considerable time to formulate written arguments to watch videos in a discussion forum has become so blasé.


OM
 
Omega Man said:
Would rather you do that. Prompting people who have taken considerable time to formulate written arguments to watch videos in a discussion forum has become so blasé.


OM
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Your choice...talking to skeptics has become even more blasé...
 
Omega Man said:
Not only are you referring to a myth as though it was history, but you've also got the entire biblical basis of Lucifer wrong as well. The biblical Lucifer, literally, referred to the planet Venus as a symbolic reference to the impending downfall of Nebuchadnezzar at the hands of Cyrus. Bronze and Iron Age kings of the Near East were renowned for declaring themselves as solar deities; "eternal" sun gods. Nebuchadnezzar was no exception, and Deutero-Isaiah was poking fun at him symbolically by comparing him instead to the fleeting light of Venus (the "morning star") which quickly disappears at dawn, rather than comparing him to the "eternal" light of the sun. Once one understands true context of the Bible, it is much easier to understand the basis of the stories, rather than spend ones entire life dedicated to a lie - betrayals of the original texts.


OM
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It might be the planet later known as Venus, but from a mythological point of view, it was dealing with the myth of Attar, which was a Cannonite myth, and was a god attempting to over reach himself, and occupy the throne of Baal, and fell.
 
calamity said:
D8wArGsX4AkGMHW


I believe so.



Are there any other signs out there suggesting the Almighty is all good with the same sex thing?
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The problem I have with your question is this, and it is my principle Number #1.


!. You can't ask a question with an assumed premise.


You must first prove the premise, or achieve a meeting of mind with the person to whom you are posing the question first, and then, and only then, can the question be asked.


So, it kinda kills the thread, if you ask me, as God cannot be proven.


However, "meeting of mind" means that you could have framed it thus, "For those of you who believe in God, does God Approve Of Gays".


Framed that way, you are soliciting the opinion of those who accept the premise.
 
calamity said:
D8wArGsX4AkGMHW


I believe so.



Are there any other signs out there suggesting the Almighty is all good with the same sex thing?
Click to expand...

I could care less if some imaginary guy in the sky approves of my life style.
 
Why does it even matter.

God does not exist. But even if god did exist why would or should we care about the feelings of an absentee parent.
 
OscarLevant said:
The problem I have with your question is this, and it is my principle Number #1.


!. You can't ask a question with an assumed premise.


You must first prove the premise, or achieve a meeting of mind with the person to whom you are posing the question first, and then, and only then, can the question be asked.


So, it kinda kills the thread, if you ask me, as God cannot be proven.


However, "meeting of mind" means that you could have framed it thus, "For those of you who believe in God, does God Approve Of Gays".


Framed that way, you are soliciting the opinion of those who accept the premise.
Click to expand...

It can apply to those who don’t as well.
 
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