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What do we replace religion with?[W:675]

Tim the plumber said:


So the bit where JC said that all the rules of the old testament were in force is not applicable here then. All the rules except those which get in the way...;..
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That is not what he said and it's been explained here umpteen times, not gonna go through it again, if you're really interested, go looking for it...the same old boring questions are getting old...and redundant...
 
Logician Man said:
Fact of the matter is, in depth study of biblical scriptures, as well as other holy texts ( to a lesser degree ) is why I am a religious skeptic. I started out truth seeking with no pre-conceived notions as to whether God(s) existed or not. So your 'assumption I did so is incorrect. As to the rest of your post, those are merely more of your personal testimonies and unproven claims,which is fine for you, but not applicable to me personally. Just so you know, I'm not here to try to convince you, or anyone else to believe as I do, nor to renounce their respective religious world views. Can you say the same about yourself ?
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People can believe as they want to. But, when you make a hypocritical claim such as you did, I will point that out. As far as you study of biblical scriptures, what are the "other holy texts" you studied? Were they other testaments of Jesus Christ? If not, then why give them validity? And, what in the bible confused you or directed you away from knowing if there is a God in Heaven? Be specific :think:
 
Cougarbear said:
People can believe as they want to. But, when you make a hypocritical claim such as you did, I will point that out. As far as you study of biblical scriptures, what are the "other holy texts" you studied? Were they other testaments of Jesus Christ? If not, then why give them validity? And, what in the bible confused you or directed you away from knowing if there is a God in Heaven? Be specific :think:
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Nothing in the bible 'confused' me. That is just another 'assumption' on your part, and we all know what people say about those who make assumptions... I've never stated I 'know' if there are any Gods in any heavens. If you can prove differently, please feel free to pull up any post(s) in which I did such a thing. Those are your words you are attributing to me. You probably should consider sticking to posting YOUR beliefs/non-beliefs, and let others do the same, as you're failing miserably in your misguided attempts to read others minds, and futile attempts to put Your words in OTHER'S mouths. That is clearly above your pay scale.
 
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Cougarbear said:
People can believe as they want to. But, when you make a hypocritical claim such as you did, I will point that out. As far as you study of biblical scriptures, what are the "other holy texts" you studied? Were they other testaments of Jesus Christ? If not, then why give them validity? And, what in the bible confused you or directed you away from knowing if there is a God in Heaven? Be specific :think:
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Oh, btw...What hypocritical claim are you referring to that I made. Be specific! :lol:
 
Tim the plumber said:
I was watching this video by Jordan Peterson;

YouTube

The gist is that the civilization we have is founded upon Christian principals. And that by abandoning this religion we will create a civilization that simply does not function.

I can see his point. The present philosophy of business is the MBA. In that lying is something you do in your actions all the time. You expect others to do it. You live the life of the slippery slope.

This is, I think the exact opposite of how I, an atheist, wish to live.

The truth and disiple of not cheating or swindling others is what I want my life to be about.

I think we need a new philosophy of progress and responsibilty. Maybe JP is one of the herads of this process of creating such a thing.

Does anybody else have an input into the new philosophy of society?
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Practically nothing good about our civilization is founded on Christian principles. There are plenty of civilizations with little or nothing Christian about them, and they do just fine.
 
You don't replace Christianity. And you especially don't replace it with today's God-awful progressive (regressive) liberalism, which is turning Democratic-led American cities into slums and toilets.
 
Logicman said:
That's nonsense.

America's Christian Foundations

Helping Christians apply the Word of God to all | Chalcedon Foundation

You might also read:

View attachment 67259100
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Of course, a consitutional expert who reviewed it said

"Book Review - Reviewing John Eidsmoe, Christianity and the Constitutio" by Stephen R. Alton

Judging by its title, John Eidsmoe's Christianity and the Constitution: The Faith of Our Founding Fathers, appears to promise an historical look at the religious beliefs and backgrounds of America's founders. It does that - and more-with mixed results. To be sure, there is some good in this book: to the extent that it sticks to its nominal purpose and attempts to document the religious beliefs of some of this nation's founding fathers, Eidsmoe's work is useful.


Unfortunately, both the author's scholarship and his motives in writing this book are questionable. His scholarship suffers from his tendency to rely on secondary sources, rather than primary ones, for his citations to the words of the founders. As a result, the context of those original words is called into doubt.
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That technique is known as 'cherry picking'
 
RAMOSS said:
Of course, a consitutional expert who reviewed it said

That technique is known as 'cherry picking'
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Which is what you just did. There's plenty of accolades by others to counter that.

By the way, do you consider your "anything goes," version of Reform Judaism to be anything other than a man made testimonial to political correctness?
 
Logicman said:
Which is what you just did. There's plenty of accolades by others to counter that.

By the way, do you consider your "anything goes," version of Reform Judaism to be anything other than a man made testimonial to political correctness?
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You are comparing apples to orangaes. One is taking a look at , you know scholarship. The other is making a judgement on spiritiual belief. One is objective, the other is subjective.

Something like scholarship , and examining quotes in context can be totally objective, outside of personal beliefs. THis person is not doing that.

I also will note your other source is a 'dominion theology' who want so destroy the 1st amendment of the US. They are screwed up in the head.
 
Logicman said:
That's nonsense.

America's Christian Foundations

Helping Christians apply the Word of God to all | Chalcedon Foundation

You might also read:

View attachment 67259100
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No, THIS response is nonsense. If you have something to say, say it. Don't direct me to soem webpage and a book.

I skimmed the webpage you cited, and the things it mentions are like the fact that the DoI refers to God favorably and that the Constitution gives the President Sundays off. If you consider those examples of how our civilization is found on Christian principals, I can only assume that the rest are equally weak.

In fact, there's literally nothing of consequence in our Constitution that has anything to do with uniquely Christian principles. Rather, the Bill of Rights starts out quite the opposite.
 
Tlrmln said:
No, THIS response is nonsense. If you have something to say, say it. Don't direct me to soem webpage and a book.

I skimmed the webpage you cited, and the things it mentions are like the fact that the DoI refers to God favorably and that the Constitution gives the President Sundays off. If you consider those examples of how our civilization is found on Christian principals, I can only assume that the rest are equally weak.

In fact, there's literally nothing of consequence in our Constitution that has anything to do with uniquely Christian principles. Rather, the Bill of Rights starts out quite the opposite.
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Nonsense. The Judeo-Christian Heritage of our nation is well understood.

Judeo-Christian Roots of America's Founding Ideals and Documents

You don't like it then too bad.
 
Logicman said:
Nonsense. The Judeo-Christian Heritage of our nation is well understood.

Judeo-Christian Roots of America's Founding Ideals and Documents

You don't like it then too bad.
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So compelling that you can't personally cite a single even remotely compelling example. Once again, you've linked to a website full of nonsequitur. 3 posts, and you have yet to identify a single specifically American value that is rooted specifically in Christianity.

And by the way, having a Judeo-Christian heritiage, and the claiming that our civilization is founded on Christian principles, are two dramatically different claims. So congrats on moving the goalposts there.
 
Tlrmln said:
So compelling that you can't personally cite a single even remotely compelling example. Once again, you've linked to a website full of nonsequitur. 3 posts, and you have yet to identify a single specifically American value that is rooted specifically in Christianity.

And by the way, having a Judeo-Christian heritiage, and the claiming that our civilization is founded on Christian principles, are two dramatically different claims. So congrats on moving the goalposts there.
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The website I linked you to - which had numerous examples - demolished your anti-Christianity follies.
 
Logicman said:
The website I linked you to - which had numerous examples - demolished your anti-Christianity follies.
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No it didn't. The very first example is a total fail. It doesn't refer to Christianity in any way, nor does it even refer to a single religious principle of any kind as a founding principle of the nation.

And by the way, it takes a special kind of dishonesty (or stupidity) to claim that it is "anti-Christian" not to believe that this country was founded on Christian principles. I also don't believe that this country was founded on love for ice cream. But I personally love ice cream.
 
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Tlrmln said:
No it didn't. The very first example is a total fail. It doesn't refer to Christianity in any way, nor does it even refer to a single religious principle of any kind as a founding principle of the nation.

And by the way, it takes a special kind of dishonesty (or stupidity) to claim that it is "anti-Christian" not to believe that this country was founded on Christian principles. I also don't believe that this country was founded on love for ice cream. But I personally love ice cream.
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Yada yada yada. You don't know what you're talking about.

The Moral Foundations of America

The Moral Foundations of America << The Righter Report

Concerning the outcome of the American Revolution, John Quincy Adams noted, “The highest glory won from the American Revolution was this: it connected, in one indissoluble bond, the principles of civil government with the principles of Christianity.”

In a letter to Thomas Jefferson dated June 28, 1813, John Adams wrote: “The general principles on which the (founding) fathers achieved independence were…the general principles of Christianity.”

Founding father Noah Webster proclaimed much the same message when he said, “The religion which has introduced civil liberty is the religion of Christ and His Apostles…This is genuine Christianity and to this we owe our free constitutions of government.”

I also love this quote from Benjamin Franklin:

In a pamphlet for Europeans titled Information to Those Who Would Remove to America, 1754, Benjamin Franklin wrote: "Atheism is unknown there; Infidelity rare and secret; so that persons may live to a great age in that country without having their piety shocked by meeting with either an Atheist or an Infidel."

Then there's the religious affiliations of the founding fathers:

Dr. M. E. Bradford of the University of Dallas conducted a study of the Founding Founders to look at this very important question (whether the Founding Fathers were deists or Christians). He discovered the Founders were members of denominations as follows: twenty-eight Episcopalians, eight Presbyterians, seven Congregationalists, two Lutherans, two Dutch Reformed, two Methodists, two Roman Catholics, and only three deists.

You're busted.
 
Logicman said:
You're busted.
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Hardly, given the fact that you have yet to identify a single specifically American value or concept that is specifically based on Christianity.
 
Tlrmln said:
Hardly, given the fact that you have yet to identify a single specifically American value or concept that is specifically based on Christianity.
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You're obviously blinded to them.
 
Logician Man said:
Nothing in the bible 'confused' me. That is just another 'assumption' on your part, and we all know what people say about those who make assumptions... I've never stated I 'know' if there are any Gods in any heavens. If you can prove differently, please feel free to pull up any post(s) in which I did such a thing. Those are your words you are attributing to me. You probably should consider sticking to posting YOUR beliefs/non-beliefs, and let others do the same, as you're failing miserably in your misguided attempts to read others minds, and futile attempts to put Your words in OTHER'S mouths. That is clearly above your pay scale.
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Well, you proved my point. You couldn't even state the other holy texts you seem to be using to confuse yourself with the Bible. And, yes, you are confused about the Bible.
 
Tlrmln said:
Hardly, given the fact that you have yet to identify a single specifically American value or concept that is specifically based on Christianity.
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At the time of the Constitution, many states still had state religious establishments, but the new federal government was barred, in the First Amendment, from erecting its own, or from requiring religious tests for public officials. The paradox can be seen in the fact that the Declaration of Independence, which forms the ideological bedrock of our system, directly invokes the Creator as the source of our inalienable human rights and concludes with “a firm reliance on the protection of Divine Providence,” while the Constitution, which creates and constrains our federal government, makes no mention of God. What are "inalienable" human rights? The answer is the right to own our own property. Property includes land and money. This is Divine Providence that gives us this, a Christian concept. The Constitution thus disallows the Federal Government from taking away any of our property. That's why you see some who refuse to pay their taxes. Socialism has infiltrated our Federal Government and it's Godless concepts now take as much property from us as we allow them to. Conservatives try to open up the consciousness of liberals to lower taxes and for some, stop taxing altogether. It's a Christian principle. That's just one point for now. chew on it for a while.
 
Re: What do we replace religion with?

Angel said:
Religion is irreplaceable.
I believe this is what Peterson is saying too.
Namaste.
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The vast majority of the worlds people have already rejected what you claim as religion.
 
Cougarbear said:
Well, you proved my point. You couldn't even state the other holy texts you seem to be using to confuse yourself with the Bible. And, yes, you are confused about the Bible.
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What part of the bible am I confused about ? *specifics*,plz.....
 
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Cougarbear said:
At the time of the Constitution, many states still had state religious establishments, but the new federal government was barred, in the First Amendment, from erecting its own, or from requiring religious tests for public officials. The paradox can be seen in the fact that the Declaration of Independence, which forms the ideological bedrock of our system, directly invokes the Creator as the source of our inalienable human rights and concludes with “a firm reliance on the protection of Divine Providence,” while the Constitution, which creates and constrains our federal government, makes no mention of God. What are "inalienable" human rights? The answer is the right to own our own property. Property includes land and money. This is Divine Providence that gives us this, a Christian concept. The Constitution thus disallows the Federal Government from taking away any of our property. That's why you see some who refuse to pay their taxes. Socialism has infiltrated our Federal Government and it's Godless concepts now take as much property from us as we allow them to. Conservatives try to open up the consciousness of liberals to lower taxes and for some, stop taxing altogether. It's a Christian principle. That's just one point for now. chew on it for a while.
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You seem to be claiming that the idea of private property ownership is a Christian principle. Where are you getting that?

And by the way, the DoI is not a legal document that defines anything about what the USA actually is.
 
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