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What do we replace religion with?[W:675]

Re: What do we replace religion with?

Rising Sun said:
You are free to cherry-pick, insult or fabricate anything you like, but my point was that there are assholes on both sides of the question.
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No, your point is that you will make up your own version of atheism because you cannot deal with what atheists have to say. Do not try to side track this by pretending this is about insults.
 
Tim the plumber said:
I was watching this video by Jordan Peterson;

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=EyYdGiJpyXk

The gist is that the civilization we have is founded upon Christian principals. And that by abandoning this religion we will create a civilization that simply does not function.

I can see his point. The present philosophy of business is the MBA. In that lying is something you do in your actions all the time. You expect others to do it. You live the life of the slippery slope.

This is, I think the exact opposite of how I, an atheist, wish to live.

The truth and disiple of not cheating or swindling others is what I want my life to be about.

I think we need a new philosophy of progress and responsibilty. Maybe JP is one of the herads of this process of creating such a thing.

Does anybody else have an input into the new philosophy of society?
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The major part of religion we need to keep is it's ethos. I even think I heard Peterson say that.

There are parts of religion and just about any tradition that need to be abandoned through a process called enlightenment.

So a Christian ethos with enlightenment is probably the best mix in order to advance and not spiral into absolute hedonism.

I don't think there is a necessity to reinvent the wheel. I.e. replace the Christian ethos.
 
CLAX1911 said:
The major part of religion we need to keep is it's ethos. I even think I heard Peterson say that.

There are parts of religion and just about any tradition that need to be abandoned through a process called enlightenment.

So a Christian ethos with enlightenment is probably the best mix in order to advance and not spiral into absolute hedonism.

I don't think there is a necessity to reinvent the wheel. I.e. replace the Christian ethos.
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Agreed.
 
Re: What do we replace religion with?

Angel said:
The Rutabaga Man lost his credibility to CharisRose and now roams the streets of our town shouting at the sky and scaring little children.
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CharisRose mistook my words for an actual physical rutabaga and refused to find her own rutabaga. You can lead a horse to water...
 
Re: What do we replace religion with?

If/when religion dies off, why replace it with anything?
 
Re: What do we replace religion with?

Rising Sun said:
I don't know. You're the self-proclaimed expert. Why aren't you answering the question? Here, let me repeat it for you:
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I never proclaimed myself an expert on religion. But I do know that neither consumerism nor atheism are religions. They lack the characteristics of religions. So those who claim those two things to be religions need to explain what a religion is. Otherwise, such claims mean nothing and the word religion means nothing.
 
Re: What do we replace religion with?

ataraxia said:
Not at all. The physical sciences arose out of philosophy. Isaac Newton, for example, considered what he was doing as a branch of philosophy, known at the time as natural philosophy.

Philosophy was started by the ancient Greeks as a way to put aside supernatural and superstitious mythologies and try to understand the world through reason. That’s what made it so different than everything else going on around the world, which was just myth-making. There was a period of time in the Middle Ages when philosophers tried to reconcile religion and philosophy. But by the renaissance and the European enlightenment, that project was pretty much abandoned by the educated class.

Religion is not philosophy.
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A number of people use some philosophical forms to push their theology. WLC for example does that. Alvin Plantinga did that also.
 
Re: What do we replace religion with?

TrumpTrain said:
Fair question. I'll have to dig it up. Don't hold your breath though, I have stuff to do today.

Here is an interesting article, but it does not give that math: https://www.forbes.com/sites/starts...tence-were-not-infinitely-small/#61f3209840b0
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Because those odds are phony. They were never actually calculated as there is no basis for them. And unless the odds are absolutely zero there is no such thing as impossible odds.
 
Re: What do we replace religion with?

Omega Man said:
Atheists adhere to a belief-system that can neither be proven, nor disproven. Sounds suspiciously like faith to me. Now OTOH if they were to claim that they don't know for certain... well... then they wouldn't be atheists, would they? ;)


OM
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What belief "system". What makes it a system? How is lacking belief in gods a system of any kind?
 
Re: What do we replace religion with?

Omega Man said:
It reminds me a lot of self-professed “nihilists” who embrace nihilism, because they profess to want to not cling to an ideology. Like atheists, the irony is apparently lost upon them.

OM
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Atheism is not an ideology.
 
Re: What do we replace religion with?

devildavid said:
CharisRose mistook my words for an actual physical rutabaga and refused to find her own rutabaga. You can lead a horse to water...
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No, that's not the way it went. CharisRose mistook nothing. In order to point up the unreasonable demand made by you and other materialists that theists produce a physical proof of a spiritual entity, she challenged you to produce a physical proof of your physical rutabaga in the forum, in cyberspace. Of course, you couldn't, but you either missed the point or pretended you missed the point and posted images and directed her to go to a market. You were either being disingenuous, or you didn't grasp the point of her analogy, or even that it was an analogy. Six months later and you're still at it.
 
Re: What do we replace religion with?

Angel said:
Atheism is part of a world view, a central part of a world view. And the word is "tenets," not "tenents," although one does live inside a world view, but then that would make him a "tenant."
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No, atheism is not central to a world view. It is a lack of make believing about things that can't be viewed.
 
Re: What do we replace religion with?

Rising Sun said:
LOL. I always find it interesting when a comment of mine causes someone to react so emotionally they have to make two different posts in reaction to it.

FWIW, I don't believe in Christian Hell, but you are free to fear it. You're also free to collect or not collect stamps. When have I said anything different?
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Why don't you believe in Christian Hell?
 
Re: What do we replace religion with?

Angel said:
I know the Christian wine; along with the Christian bread, it represents the deepest mystery of Christian ritual and faith. The mystery is captured by a big word -- swallow your pommes frites before reading this word as it has in the past induced choking in skeptics --TRANSUBSTANTIATION.

Now, in order to help with understanding this post, allow me to point out that it turns on a pun, on the homonymy of the words whine and wine. In New York City humor is often relied upon to defuse potentially embarrassing situations. Is it the same in Flanders?
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Transubstantiation leads to cannibalism.
 
Re: What do we replace religion with?

devildavid said:
I never proclaimed myself an expert on religion. But I do know that neither consumerism nor atheism are religions. They lack the characteristics of religions. So those who claim those two things to be religions need to explain what a religion is. Otherwise, such claims mean nothing and the word religion means nothing.
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Some people do treat atheism as a religion, but I agree it's not necessarily so.

As for definitions, this works for me:
a particular system of faith and worship.

a pursuit or interest to which someone ascribes supreme importance.
 
Re: What do we replace religion with?

CLAX1911 said:
If you have no ethos you have no culture.
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I am of the opinion that religion is not a prerequisite for ethos.
 
Re: What do we replace religion with?

Omega Man said:
So in other words, you don't know for certain whether or not God - whatever it is that God is; IF God is - exists. I must have somehow mistaken you for an atheist. My apologies.


OM
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You don't know for certain that any of the many made up gods or religions or myths or fairy tales or tall tails or lies or propaganda is true or false. Do you give equal credence to all made up things being possibly true? How do you distinguish the real from the imaginary?
 
Re: What do we replace religion with?

Rising Sun said:
Atheists often try to look "moderate" and reasonable in their views. Some are, but my experience with online atheists is that, after discussing the topic with them for any length of time, they are simply the flip-side of the same coin as Bible-thumpers: people who seek to push their views onto others but have no evidence they are correct.
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Another false generalization about atheists. What does evidence of the lack of something look like?
 
Re: What do we replace religion with?

Rising Sun said:
Disagreed, but I'm content to let forum readers decide for themselves which of us is most honest and realistic and which is just an oppressive, lying scumbag hater.
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Is that the only choice?
 
Re: What do we replace religion with?

Rising Sun said:
Agreed. Agnosticism is the only truly logical point of view: "I don't know and there's no way to know, therefore I'll focus on what I can know". Atheists and Theists both believe they do know. Military atheists and militant theists not only believe they do know, but want to force others to believe just like them either with laws or, as often seen on political forums, sniping, trolling and personal attacks.
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Theists believe in god(s). They do not know.

Atheists lack belief in gods. They dismiss belief.
 
Re: What do we replace religion with?

devildavid said:
Why don't you believe in Christian Hell?
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There's an ancient parable about the Blind Men and the Elephant. I think all of the world's religions are akin to that story; with each religion being one of the blind men.

I also think that the commonalities of each of the world's religions have a higher probability of being true. Christian Hell isn't one of those commonalities. It doesn't make sense that an all-knowing, all-powerful and all-merciful god would create something, know what it's going to do then condemn it to eternal pain for failing to toe a particular line.
 
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