• This is a political forum that is non-biased/non-partisan and treats every person's position on topics equally. This debate forum is not aligned to any political party. In today's politics, many ideas are split between and even within all the political parties. Often we find ourselves agreeing on one platform but some topics break our mold. We are here to discuss them in a civil political debate. If this is your first visit to our political forums, be sure to check out the RULES. Registering for debate politics is necessary before posting. Register today to participate - it's free!

“If We Stay Quiet They Crush Us”

In some Europeans countries like Hungary, Poland, Croatia and Bulgaria in the face of mass migration are taking a strong stance, stopping the migrants from crossing at their borders, mostly of Muslins, are not confronting those problems with regard to freedom of speech and religion.
 
Religious repression in Cuba The half century crackdown on Christianity in Cuba
Notes from the Cuban Exile Quarter: Religious repression in Cuba: The half century crackdown on Christianity in Cuba

POSTED BY JOHN SUAREZ
FRIDAY, APRIL 13, 2018

Dedicated to those whose final words before Castro's firing squads were "Long live Christ the King!"

Buque-Covadonga.jpg

Priests were taken at gun point and forced out of Cuba in 1961

The Cuban dictatorship has had a hostile relationship with religion since the beginning when it officially declared itself an atheist state and expelled scores of priests on September 17, 1961, cancelled Christmas in 1969 under the pretext to prevent work shortages for the 1970 ten million ton sugar harvest but continued the ban until 1997, and sent mobs to intimidate Cubans attending religious services. In the first years 90% of Cuba's Jewish population fled the dictatorship shrinking from 15,000 to 1,500 persons of the Jewish faith.

The Catholic Church in Cuba was attacked; many of its clergy and religious figures exiled or sent to work camps. Being a practicing Catholic would mean being blacklisted from certain professions such as teaching. Christmas was ended as a national holiday in 1970 and replaced with holidays celebrating the 1959 communist revolution. This means that the ability to separate the political from the personal and the religious has been undermined and atrophied under the dictatorship of the Castro brothers. It was not supposed to be this way.

The revolutionaries in Cuba came down from the hills in 1959 wearing rosaries, and the leadership used this image to reject the charge that they were communists. Fidel Castro claimed throughout the 1950s and in the early days of the revolution that their aim was to restore democracy, but the reality was that they had always planned to consolidate their rule and establish a communist regime.
Click link above for full article.
For 60 years the Castroit communist regime, which declare itself an atheist state, has restricted religious freedom. Churches and religious groups are required to register with the Ministry of Justice to obtain official recognition.

Churches are not allowed to conduct educational activities and their publications are control and subject to censorship by the office of religious affairs. They does not have access to the regime control media and public spaces and the ability to build new churches.
 
In 1961, in an effort to curtail religious influence and establish a communist state, the regime began confiscating all private school, more than 150 of them religious schools and the expulsion of hundreds of foreign priests. Practicing Christians were banned from certain professions like teachers. From 1965 to 1967, the regime forced many priests and pastors, into forced labor camps called Military Units to Aid Production (UMAPS), alongside homosexuals, vagrants, and others considered by the regime to be “social scum.” Many Christians were executed by firing squads and their last words were Long Live Christ King!
 
The Cumulative Academic Record contain an annual evaluation of the “political ideological integration” of students and their parents and investigate their religious involvement. This information will be used to deny access to the university to those students. The regime had undermine the charitable work of religious organizations and seized the humanitarian donations from abroad, like food and medications, selling them in hard currency stores. Religious repression has substantially increased since 2013 and number of churches demolition have increased according to Christian Solidarity Worldwide (CSW) reports.
 
Re: “If We Stay Quiet They Crush Us�

Cuba, where Religious Freedom Continues to be Repressed
StackPath

By Frank Simon
May 28, 2018

ajiaco.jpg

Cuban churchgoers. Photo: lahabana.com (The photo has been removed, no reason given by Havana Times)

HAVANA TIMES — “In the ‘60s, Catholics had stones thrown at them and a cord line was even put up at mass time so nobody could enter the churches because they used to say we were counter-revolutionaries. The only element of truth in all of that is that the priest did criticize the new government’s atheism, but he never planted bombs or fired shots,” Pedro tells me.

Anita is now an old woman but she remembers how she was banned from going to university in spite of her high grades as a student, because her records featured the dishonorable Baptist label. “It seems that the Revolution had already forgotten that its first great martyr was Frank Pais, was a Baptist.”

Thousands of young believers were sent off to Camaguey province, convicted for their respective religions, aging between 15-25 years old. “They were forced labor camps, where we had to be reeducated to become the ‘new man’ and that meant a system of exploitation where the slightest inkling of human rights weren’t respected, some people even committed suicide,” Jesus tells me. He recalls that at the work camps there were also homosexuals, teenagers without any work ties, political opponents and people of all persuasions. He heard a guard accidentally tune the radio to an evangelical radio station one morning, and one of the most beautiful hymns started playing “torre alta y roca mia,“ then, he told me, “I felt like I was going to come out of that abusive time alive.”

UMAP.png

Click link above for full article.
Quote from the article:
Cuba’s Military Units to Aid Production (UMAP), as the camps were called, were a Machiavellian invention which attempted to imitate the Soviets’ brainwashing experiment on “prerevolutionary” generations, who had been educated in a kind of “bourgeois moral”, a preview of the ideological prejudice which would go on to define this brand new Castro government. Alarmed, the world pressured the government to get rid of these forced labor camps, which were taken down and this time the dictatorship couldn’t hide or put on a front. The UMAPs are a taboo subject in every Cuban media editorial department, as well as in university investigations, as if “this never happened” according to official discourse.
The Unidades Militares de Ayuda a la Producción (Military Units to Help Production), known by its abbreviation UMAP, were concentration camps stablished by the Castro regime in Camagüey Province. These camps were in operation from November 1965 to July 1968. In November 26, 1963, the regime approved law 1129, which established the Obligatory Military Service (SMO). The regime alleged, as a justification, that those disqualify to serve in the military service would be sent to the UMAP camps. In reality, the regime sent to those camps dissidents, Catholics, Baptist, Methodists, Jehovah's Witnesses, Seventh Day Adventists, Santería practitioners, priests, artists, intellectuals, gays, lesbians, prostitutes, pimps, hippies, drug addicts and anyone considered anti-social. According to Tahbaz, former Cuban intelligence agents have estimated that approximately 35,000 people were interned in the UMAP camps. Some died from torture, others committed suicide, were rape, beating, mutilated and many were traumatized for life, as shown in Néstor Almendros and Orlando Jiménez Leal 1988 award-winning documentary “Improper Conduct” that recorded the testimonies of victims and witnesses (YouTube).
 
Re: “If We Stay Quiet They Crush Us�

Religion thrives in Cuba today
In 1992 the Cuban Constitution was amended to declare it a secular state. It was no longer an atheist Republic.

Today, religion on the island, like Cuba itself, is much more intricate than the Catholic Church. Afro-Cuban religions such as Santería, spiritual practices such as “Espiritismo” (Spiritism) and other practices that came as a result of the fusion of different faith traditions overwhelmingly mark the religious landscape in Cuba.

Our Lady of Charity, the patron saint of Cuba, remains one of the most prominent and visible symbols of Cuban identity of the island and in the diaspora. Evoked in independence struggles against Spain in the late 19th century, Our Lady of Charity retains a prominent place in Cuban Catholicism, Santería and other popular religions. She reveals the complexity and cultural coming together of the Cuban people.

Religion shapes Cuba despite Castro's influence
 
Re: “If We Stay Quiet They Crush Us�

Quote from the article: The Unidades Militares de Ayuda a la Producción (Military Units to Help Production), known by its abbreviation UMAP, were concentration camps stablished by the Castro regime in Camagüey Province. These camps were in operation from November 1965 to July 1968. In November 26, 1963, the regime approved law 1129, which established the Obligatory Military Service (SMO). The regime alleged, as a justification, that those disqualify to serve in the military service would be sent to the UMAP camps. In reality, the regime sent to those camps dissidents, Catholics, Baptist, Methodists, Jehovah's Witnesses, Seventh Day Adventists, Santería practitioners, priests, artists, intellectuals, gays, lesbians, prostitutes, pimps, hippies, drug addicts and anyone considered anti-social. According to Tahbaz, former Cuban intelligence agents have estimated that approximately 35,000 people were interned in the UMAP camps. Some died from torture, others committed suicide, were rape, beating, mutilated and many were traumatized for life, as shown in Néstor Almendros and Orlando Jiménez Leal 1988 award-winning documentary “Improper Conduct” that recorded the testimonies of victims and witnesses (YouTube).
The Jehovah's Witnesses, Seventh Day Adventists and gays were victims of the worst treatment at the UMAP camps. A poster placed at the entrance to the forced labor camps, where homosexuals were confined, read: “The work will make you men”, replica of the slogan “The work will make you free” used in the Nazi concentration camps. The regime intended to correct the homosexual behavior with rigorous work, which it considered a social deviation.
 
Re: “If We Stay Quiet They Crush Us�

Two main round-up of unfit people took placed in November 1965 and June 1966. Most of them were taken to the camps through a false notice to appear for military service. They were transported by bus, truck and train to hundreds of concentration camps, built in isolate areas of Camagüey Province, under unsanitary conditions without water and food. The camps were surrounded by 10 feet tall electrified barbed-wire fences, patrol by guards with machine guns and police dogs, and had no running water or electricity.

According to many internees, the quantity of food provided at the camps was insufficient. They were force to work from dawn to dust six days a week in agricultural tasks, mostly cutting sugar cane. They have daily quotas and those that did not meet the quota were deprived of food. They were paid only 7 pesos a month, one-tenth of the regime monthly minimum wage in agriculture. During family visits, the recluse were force to were uniform and march to give the impression they were in the Obligatory Military Service (SMO).
 
Re: “If We Stay Quiet They Crush Us”

UMAP was created with a double purposed in mine. One to neutralize those considered potential long-term threats to the regime, like religious groups, homosexuals and other members of the civil society whose loyalty to the regime were in doubt. The other one with the purpose to compensate a severe agricultural labor shortage with the force labor of the internees and their economic exploitation without any regard for the human cost. The concentration camps of the UMAP subjected the internees to a regime of forced labor and political reeducation, similar to the Russian GULAG.1

1. Joseph Tahbaz, Demystifying las UMAP: The Politics of Sugar, Gender, and Religion in 1960s Cuba, DeRLAS, Vol. 14 No. 2 December 31, 2013 (University of Delaware | Page not found Enrique Ros, La Umap: El Gulag Castrista, Ediciones Universal, Miami, 2004.

The map below shows the locations of the prisons in Cuba classified as:
Prison of maximum rigor
Prison of minimum rigor
Correctional facility

carceles.2.jpg
 
Re: “If We Stay Quiet They Crush Us�

2017 Report on International Religious Freedom: Cuba
Cuba - United States Department of State

Executive Summary

The constitution provides for freedom of religion and prohibits discrimination based on religion. The government and the Communist Party, through the Communist Party’s Office of Religious Affairs (ORA), continued to control most aspects of religious life. Observers noted the government continued to use threats, travel restrictions, detentions, and violence against some religious leaders and their followers. In May the government officially informed the Assemblies of God (AG) it would not proceed with confiscation orders against 2,000 AG churches or demolish a church in Santiago under zoning laws passed in 2015; however, it did not provide written guarantees to this effect. Christian Solidarity Worldwide (CSW) noted 325 violations of freedom of religion or belief during the year. CSW reported a “significant drop” in the reported cases of violations of religious freedom or belief in the year compared with previous years, which it attributed to the government’s verbal rescinding in May of the decree outlawing the 2,000 AG churches. The majority of CSW’s reported violations were related to government efforts to prevent members of the human rights organization Ladies in White from attending Catholic Mass, as well as government threats and harassment of members of religious groups advocating for greater religious and political freedom. Religious groups reported a continued increase in the ability of their members to conduct charitable and educational projects, such as operating before and after school and community service programs, assisting with care of the elderly, and maintaining small libraries of religious materials.
Click link above for full article.
The Castroit regime Office of Religious Affairs (ORA), control all aspects of religious activities. It deny authorization for such activities, issue fines, thread confiscation of churches, impose travel restrictions, use violence against religious leaders, and more. According to CSW, “ORA exists solely to monitor, hinder and restrict the activities of religious groups.”
 
Re: “If We Stay Quiet They Crush Us”

The prevailing religion in Cuba is Christianity. The Catholic Church membership is estimate about 70% of the population. The Protestant churches membership is estimated at 5%. About 18% of Cubans are agnostic and 5% atheists. Many Cubans of African descent practice Santeria, which blend elements of Christianity with West African believes. All these religious groups have been restricted in their activities by the ORA. Basically through the years religious freedom have improve to some extent. Until 2015, religious people were not allow to join the regime Communist Party.
 
Re: “If We Stay Quiet They Crush Us”

Evangelicals in Cuba: Controlled, Repressed, but Still Multiplying
Evangelicals in Cuba: Controlled, Repressed, but Still Multiplying - The Christian Post

By Voices Contributor Michael Mutzner | Sat 18 Aug 2018

cuba.jpg

(PHOTO: REUTERS/ENRIQUE DE LA OSA)Worshippers carry a statue of Jesus Christ during a Via Crucis (Way of the Cross) procession on Good Friday in Havana, April 6, 2012.

Like every other UN Member State, Cuba was reviewed earlier during this year in the framework of the Universal Periodic Review (UPR) conducted by the UN's Human Rights Council in Geneva. At this occasion, our Geneva Liaison Office worked on a report explaining the situation of the Evangelical churches in Cuba. Following years of steady growth, Evangelicals currently amount to about 10% of the Cuban population. While a small minority of churches are protected, most still face some forms of restriction and yet hope for the government to guarantee more freedom. In this current context, it has not been possible for an Evangelical Alliance in Cuba to be created yet.
Click link above for full article.
The Catholic Church, that has the larger number of members, under the guidance of Cardinal Jaime Ortega until his retirement in 2016 when he reached 75, has been in cohort with the regime. He has been very critical of capitalism and the U.S. embargo.

The Evangelical churches in Cuba have suffered persecution and harassment by the regime. They are considered illegals, their churches have been destroyed, and their leaders arrested. Any church that does not support the liberation theology and are politically non-aligned are severely persecuted.
 
Re: “If We Stay Quiet They Crush Us�

Catholic Church insiders are calling for Pope Francis to resign. Here’s why
Pope Francis faces calls for resignation over Catholic Church sex abuse scandals - Vox

The internal politics informing the church’s reaction to the clerical sex abuse crisis.

By Tara Isabella Burton, Aug 28, 2018

Reeling from new claims of unfettered sexual abuse at the hands of priests and cover-ups by high-ranking officials, the Catholic Church is facing one of its most serious and divisive crises of the 21st century.

Last weekend, a former Vatican official, ex-papal nuncio Carlo Maria Viganò, published an incendiary open letter calling for Francis to resign for willfully turning a blind eye to ex-Cardinal Theodore McCarrick’s decades of sexual abuse and harassment against junior seminarians under his authority. (McCarrick has also been accused of abusing two minors; Viganò does not make any mention of those cases and does not imply Francis knew about them.)

Viganò claims that Francis’s predecessor, Pope Benedict XVI, had imposed sanctions against McCarrick, mandating that he carry out the remainder of his life in prayer and seclusion, only for Francis to lift the ban upon ascending to the papacy in 2013. During Francis’s papacy, McCarrick served as a trusted Vatican adviser and influential voice on both internal church appointments and global affairs.
Click link above for full article.
Vigano, the former Vatican ambassador to Washington, called on Francis to resign on the grounds the pope knew for years about the sexual misconduct of an American cardinal and did nothing.

The conference agreed to a declaration saying "a grave danger to the faith and the unity of the Church" had emerged under Francis.

Benedict stopped short of from having McKarrick jailed, and pretty much banished him to a private life of prayer and penance. Then along comes Francis and ignores the command of the prior Pope and brings McKarrick out to travel with him as an advisor.
 
Response:
The answer to your question was posted in post #118 on 10-04-18. Here it is again.

That's not an answer, it merely restates your claim.

How cam a lack of belief be viewed as a religion.

What do you think Atheists believe as fact? That is to say what do Atheists hold to be true?
 
Re: “If We Stay Quiet They Crush Us�

Conservative Catholic news outlets published a letter attributed to a former Vatican ambassador to the U.S. Archbishop Carlo Maria Vigano which accused Vatican officials of knowing about the sexual escapades of ex-Cardinal Theodore McCarrick since 2000, but making him a cardinal anyway. Francis accepted McCarrick’s resignation as cardinal last month after a U.S. church investigation determined an accusation he molested a minor was “credible.” The Vatican didn’t immediately comment on the letter.
 
Re: “If We Stay Quiet They Crush Us”

Conservative Catholic news outlets published a letter attributed to a former Vatican ambassador to the U.S. Archbishop Carlo Maria Vigano which accused Vatican officials of knowing about the sexual escapades of ex-Cardinal Theodore McCarrick since 2000, but making him a cardinal anyway. Francis accepted McCarrick’s resignation as cardinal last month after a U.S. church investigation determined an accusation he molested a minor was “credible.” The Vatican didn’t immediately comment on the letter.

The whole crumbling edifice of the Roman Catholic church will fall eventually. It will become more museum than church.

It needs a pope who cares more about people than the religion.

eg: Mother Theresa - exhibited the worst aspects of the church.
 
Re: “If We Stay Quiet They Crush Us”

Pastors in Cuba monitored, threatened by Communist officials despite requests for greater protections: watchdog
Pastors in Cuba monitored, threatened by Communist officials despite requests for greater protections: watchdog - The Christian Post

By Stoyan Zaimov, Christian Post Reporter
December 14, 2018

Church officials in Cuba have asked for greater protections for their denominations but instead pastors are being monitored and threatened as believers face increased incidents of harassment by Communist officials, a persecution watchdog group reports.

Christian Solidarity Worldwide released its findings in a report on Thursday, noting that freedom of religion or belief continues to be violated in the country.

Both Protestant and Roman Catholic institutions have called for greater protections, but that has led to increased harassment of religious leaders, CSW has warned.


"Often this takes subtler, hard to document forms, and is focused on attempting to create divisions between and within religious groups," the watchdog explained in its summary.

"Religious leaders who have taken on a leadership role in the campaign, both at the local and national levels, have reported that pressure on them remains high; over the past year many have chosen to flee the country and to seek refuge abroad," it added.
Click link above for full article.
The Castroit regime employ tactics to prevent pastors from performing their activities that appear to be in opposition to the regime policies. This repressive tactics includes arbitrary detentions, warnings, dismissal from jobs, surveillance, harassment, and in some cases forced exile.
 
Re: “If We Stay Quiet They Crush Us”

The Castroit regime employ tactics to prevent pastors from performing their activities that appear to be in opposition to the regime policies. This repressive tactics includes arbitrary detentions, warnings, dismissal from jobs, surveillance, harassment, and in some cases forced exile.

That's what a right wing, intolerant theocracy looks like.
 
Re: “If We Stay Quiet They Crush Us”

The Castroit regime employ tactics to prevent pastors from performing their activities that appear to be in opposition to the regime policies. This repressive tactics includes arbitrary detentions, warnings, dismissal from jobs, surveillance, harassment, and in some cases forced exile.

Governments should keep an eye on Catholic pastors for the sake of the children.
 
Re: “If We Stay Quiet They Crush Us”

I agree. The extremes meet.

Regimes with extreme levels of power invested in one or a few men, suffer from intolerance as the leader(s) have so much more to lose to any challenger.
 
Re: “If We Stay Quiet They Crush Us�

Christian leaders in Cuba under pressure to endorse new constitution
Christian leaders in Cuba under pressure to endorse new constitution

Sun 17 Feb 2019
By Cara Bentley

Government officials are putting pressure on religious leaders to vote 'yes' in a referendum on the new constitution which could limit the protection of religious people.

The referendum is due to happen on 24th February.

High ranking communist party officials summoned Christian, Yoruba and Masonic leaders in Santiago on Tuesday for assurance that they and their congregations would all be voting to adopt the new constitution.

Religious leaders elsewhere in the country have told the freedom charity Christian Solidarity Worldside (CSW) that they had been summoned to similar meetings in the past week.

They are concerned about supporting it as the draft looks like it could significantly reduce protections for freedom of religion or belief (FoRB) and it weakens references to freedom of conscience.
Click link above for full article.
In spite of the pressure on religious leaders to vote 'yes' in a referendum on the new constitution, Christian leaders issued public statements criticizing the proposed constitution. They opposed the new definition of marriage, were frustrated by limiting access to education and media, and barring financial investments among native Cubans. Also the support for “freedom of conscience” by the previous constitution, was eliminated.
 
Re: “If We Stay Quiet They Crush Us”

In spite of the pressure on religious leaders to vote 'yes' in a referendum on the new constitution, Christian leaders issued public statements criticizing the proposed constitution. They opposed the new definition of marriage, were frustrated by limiting access to education and media, and barring financial investments among native Cubans. Also the support for “freedom of conscience” by the previous constitution, was eliminated.

Cuba separates state from religion ?
 
Re: “If We Stay Quiet They Crush Us”

Cuba separates state from religion ?

Look to me that you confuse the country with the Castroit regime. Since the beginning the regime launched a propaganda campaign against religion. In 1960 Christmas was banned on the island, many churches shut down and priests placed under surveillance and no new church was allow to be built in Cuba. The regime fought a war against religion.
 
Re: “If We Stay Quiet They Crush Us�

Protestant denominations launch new evangelical alliance
Protestant denominations launch new evangelical alliance - CSW

13 Jun 2019

861fec7197a50e32a2315f7443700ff1.jpg

Protestant leaders gather at a Methodist retreat centre in Cuba for the launch of the new alliance.

Seven Protestant denominations in Cuba, including the five largest in terms of membership, joined together to launch a new Cuban Alliance of Evangelical Churches on 11 June in a show of inter-denominational unity unseen on the island since the 1959 Revolution.

A statement signed by the leaders of the seven denominations said: “The primary reason behind the creation of this alliance is that the denominations which form part do not feel represented by the Cuban Council of Churches before the authorities and the Cuban people and feel motivated to work united in the defense of Biblical values.”


The move to unify under a new evangelical alliance follows an unprecedented campaign led by the same denominations against a new constitution which was approved in a general referendum in February. The new constitution contains significantly weakened language on freedom of religion or belief and freedom of conscience as compared to the previous constitution. Since the referendum, the five largest Protestant denominations have told CSW that the Cuban government has barred them from receiving any visits from abroad.
Click link above for full article.
Communism is basically a religion that will established Heaven on earth. The Castroit regime has taking over Christian churches and control them through The Cuban Council of Churches (CCC) a branch of the government.

Seven protestant denomination have launched an alliance to fight against the regime control of religion. The regime has retaliated by prohibiting them from receiving any visits from abroad, to deny them spiritual and financial aid provided by the visitors.
 
Back
Top Bottom