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Star Wars: The Last Jedi **SPOILERS*

The lightspeed truck of peace move was ****ing expensive as hell. While the Liberty-class cruiser (or an M80C, if that was Ackbar's old flagship) was capable of cutting a couple warships in half, an asteroid would likely be significantly less effective for a hyperdrive ram, not to mention harder to aim.

Dont be silly, an asteroid doesnt need to be built, all you have to do is place engines on one, which means you could have a whole fleet of them at the equivalent cost of one cruiser. This is a highly economical way of destroying a whole enemy fleet. They would be like giant guns in space, just aim and engage lightspeed.

Or alternatively, just have the bombers do lightspeed kamikazes at the enemy. It was shown that a single bomb load could destroy a dreadnought, so why not just put a droid pilot on them and go for it- one bomber per ship. It was pretty stupid of them to use sublight drives because the bombers were so slow that they needed fighter cover just to get in close when they could have closed the distance gap in less than a second using LS.
 
This movie was just a clunky, poorly conceived mess from start to finish. The opening scene in particular felt more like a ridiculous parody of Star Wars than the genuine article.

Poe: *Effortlessly whips his X-Wing around, singlehandedly crippling the big bad space ship* "Haha! Aren't I awesome! Aren't I cool, audience? Aren't I?"

Leia: *Exasperated reaction shot* "OMG! He's so reckless! Such a Rebel!" *winks at audience*

Hux: *Chews scenery and acts like an angry cartoon character (looks like one too)*​

Rinse and repeat for like 25 minutes.

I literally felt like I was watching the made up SciFi satire film from the end of that Disney Chicken Little movie.



On top of that, I hate to break it to Disney, but just because it's "Science Fiction," doesn't mean that you get to throw the "Science" side of things completely out the window. This isn't a Marvel flick. This isn't Guardians of the Galaxy. Some degree of internal logic actually is needed here. Flashy colors alone don't cut it. The fact is those bombers were absurdly stupid by any objective measure. Big, painfully slow moving objects that literally have to hover over their target before dropping bombs like a freaking B-17? Umm... Wut?

Did the Star Wars universe just forget about missiles, all of the sudden? And how on Earth does that even work seeing as how there's no freaking gravity in space??

Ditto for the stupid laser cannons fired by the Star Destroyers that seem to arc through space like mortar rounds. Just... Why? Why screw with something so fundamental to the series' ascetic? It didn't need to be changed, and now it just looks goofy.

Which is before we even get into other silly features, like the "the cruisers can only get this far away from the Star Destroyers" plot device, or how using lightspeed for suicide attacks completely borks the universe. I won't get into those, however, in the interests of keeping post length manageable.

But I will say that the world building in this movie is just as half-assed and nonsensical as the science. The impression I got from the last film is that the Republic was the government in charge of everything, and had been for decades. The First Order were just some particularly well-funded lunatic fringe faction. How did that completely reverse itself all of the sudden?

Did the Republic not have any sort of military, or government, outside of its capital? That doesn't make any damn sense. It's just a transparently lazy way of preserving the "Rebels vs Empire" status quo of the first films, even though it's flatly ridiculous in this circumstance.

Now, I will say this much, most of the stuff with Kylo, Rey, and Luke actually was pretty decent. That did elevate the second half of the movie over the first. They even brought Rey's power level down to a more reasonable level (she was wildly overpowered in the first film), but that's ultimately not enough to save my overall impression of the film.

Seriously, get the guy who made Rogue One to just make ALL of the Star War movies from here on out. He actually seems to understand how to make a decent Star Wars flick. Rian Johnson and J.J. Abrams clearly DON'T.
 
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I just got back from an early matinee. I was entertained and I was sucked in enough to go see the next one but I felt like they left A LOT on the table and went off on needless tangents that added no value to the story.

My biggest peeve was...

Snoke was done in WAY too easily by Kylo. Are you kidding me? A frickin Sith Lord doesn't have his wits about him enough to realize that the light saber RIGHT NEXT TO HIM is slowly rotating into position to cut him in half? The most powerful character with the force was taken down, easily, by an apprentice still in training?

It totally de-legitimized the power of the dark side, IMO.

But, not a total bomb. Still much better than any of the prequels, IMO.
 
For myself.

When the credits rolled, I felt like I'd seen a brilliant film and for the most part, I still do, it was highly, highly entertaining, I think the film definitely lacked some focus and perhaps went on a bit too long.

But now that it's been about 15 hours since I've seen it, the plot is a bit, no strike that, horrifically nonsensical, barely anything that happened made any sense at all and despite my aforementioned feeling as the credits rolled... There were multiple times I literally did one of these and was completely taken out of the movie:

xnwLzqE.gif


The Yoda and the Princess Leia Space Scenes especally... I was just like... The. ****. Was. That.

Yoda especially could have been handled with a lot more grace and should have had a bit more meaning than some Three Stooges comedy routine.

The alliance cruiser being just a "little too fast" and suddenly having Star Trek shields... Ah... What?

Anyway look, if you take the experience at face value it was a fun ride and I gotta say, that opening scene, whoever worked on that understood how and why Star Wars came to be, those bombers and that entire idea and the way it was executed was very compelling and was excellent, Star Wars took a lot of inspiration from WWII and various other space operas of early Cinema and that scene certainly I think was interesting at least.

I think I may go watch it again and I'm sure I'll spot quite a few other flaws.

Yes. I’m glad you are joining us. I had to come back to this thread to bitch because of how pointless this movie was.
 
I just got back from an early matinee. I was entertained and I was sucked in enough to go see the next one but I felt like they left A LOT on the table and went off on needless tangents that added no value to the story.

My biggest peeve was...

Snoke was done in WAY too easily by Kylo. Are you kidding me? A frickin Sith Lord doesn't have his wits about him enough to realize that the light saber RIGHT NEXT TO HIM is slowly rotating into position to cut him in half? The most powerful character with the force was taken down, easily, by an apprentice still in training?

It totally de-legitimized the power of the dark side, IMO.

But, not a total bomb. Still much better than any of the prequels, IMO.

Worse than the prequels? The of prequels has direction. Purpose. They expanded on themselves. And while they weren’t the best written movies...the only tragically mishandled character plotwise was Darth Maul. And 1 stupid addition in JarJar. Now. The director of this dog turd of a movie now has a triology deal with Disney. He will be makin 3 more Star Wars movies. How does that make you feel?
 
Disney changed horses mid stream. Once this trilogy is over...I’m done with Star Wars. Disney has raped it. It is no longer what it was. They have given a movie deal to this director for 3 more movies. Great. This is what happens when you write movies for the toys. **** Disney.
 
Worse than the prequels? The of prequels has direction. Purpose. They expanded on themselves. And while they weren’t the best written movies...the only tragically mishandled character plotwise was Darth Maul. And 1 stupid addition in JarJar. Now. The director of this dog turd of a movie now has a triology deal with Disney. He will be makin 3 more Star Wars movies. How does that make you feel?

3 more? I thought TLJ was the 2nd movie of a trilogy.
 
3 more? I thought TLJ was the 2nd movie of a trilogy.

Lol. You didn’t expect Disney to quit after 3 movies did you? :beatdeadhorse:beatdeadhorse

They intend to rape the franchise and get every last cent out of it. They made the deal with this guy to make 3 more movies as a separate triplogy that will either be an old republic movie or something with the new characters here (that they will happhzardly cram into a movie to make it seem like they were organic or something). Ffs. It is like these jackasses never read a Tolkien novel. Oh wait.
 
This movie was just a clunky, poorly conceived mess from start to finish. The opening scene in particular felt more like a ridiculous parody of Star Wars than the genuine article.

Poe: *Effortlessly whips his X-Wing around, singlehandedly crippling the big bad space ship* "Haha! Aren't I awesome! Aren't I cool, audience? Aren't I?"

Leia: *Exasperated reaction shot* "OMG! He's so reckless! Such a Rebel!" *winks at audience*

Hux: *Chews scenery and acts like an angry cartoon character (looks like one too)*​

Rinse and repeat for like 25 minutes.

I literally felt like I was watching the made up SciFi satire film from the end of that Disney Chicken Little movie.



On top of that, I hate to break it to Disney, but just because it's "Science Fiction," doesn't mean that you get to throw the "Science" side of things completely out the window. This isn't a Marvel flick. This isn't Guardians of the Galaxy. Some degree of internal logic actually is needed here. Flashy colors alone don't cut it. The fact is those bombers were absurdly stupid by any objective measure. Big, painfully slow moving objects that literally have to hover over their target before dropping bombs like a freaking B-17? Umm... Wut?

Did the Star Wars universe just forget about missiles, all of the sudden? And how on Earth does that even work seeing as how there's no freaking gravity in space??

Ditto for the stupid laser cannons fired by the Star Destroyers that seem to arc through space like mortar rounds. Just... Why? Why screw with something so fundamental to the series' ascetic? It didn't need to be changed, and now it just looks goofy.

Which is before we even get into other silly features, like the "the cruisers can only get this far away from the Star Destroyers" plot device, or how using lightspeed for suicide attacks completely borks the universe. I won't get into those, however, in the interests of keeping post length manageable.

But I will say that the world building in this movie is just as half-assed and nonsensical as the science. The impression I got from the last film is that the Republic was the government in charge of everything, and had been for decades. The First Order were just some particularly well-funded lunatic fringe faction. How did that completely reverse itself all of the sudden?

Did the Republic not have any sort of military, or government, outside of its capital? That doesn't make any damn sense. It's just a transparently lazy way of preserving the "Rebels vs Empire" status quo of the first films, even though it's flatly ridiculous in this circumstance.

Now, I will say this much, most of the stuff with Kylo, Rey, and Luke actually was pretty decent. That did elevate the second half of the movie over the first. They even brought Rey's power level down to a more reasonable level (she was wildly overpowered in the first film), but that's ultimately not enough to save my overall impression of the film.

Seriously, get the guy who made Rogue One to just make ALL of the Star War movies from here on out. He actually seems to understand how to make a decent Star Wars flick. Rian Johnson and J.J. Abrams clearly DON'T.


I wasn’t a fan of rogue one. Maybe I need to go back and watch? But looking back? I don’t know why I didn’t like it honestly. JJ did on his movie. I can’t hate him. In fact it set up a wonderful starting point with lots of direction to go. This one failed miserably. And the guy gets 3 more movies? I wish someone would pay me an asinine amount of money? I could easily write a story better than this garbage.

Your statement was well crafted.
 
I wasn’t a fan of rogue one. Maybe I need to go back and watch? But looking back? I don’t know why I didn’t like it honestly. JJ did on his movie. I can’t hate him. In fact it set up a wonderful starting point with lots of direction to go. This one failed miserably. And the guy gets 3 more movies? I wish someone would pay me an asinine amount of money? I could easily write a story better than this garbage.

Your statement was well crafted.

What's especially heinous is how they seem to feel the need to point out everything silly or nonsensical in the plot to the audience as it happens, as a way of acknowledging/hand-waving it away.

A couple of tongue-in-cheek breaks like that is fine. But if you've got more than three in your movie, maybe you simply should have written the thing better to begin with, rather than trying to apologize for an inferior product every five minutes.
 
Lol. You didn’t expect Disney to quit after 3 movies did you? :beatdeadhorse:beatdeadhorse

They intend to rape the franchise and get every last cent out of it. They made the deal with this guy to make 3 more movies as a separate triplogy that will either be an old republic movie or something with the new characters here (that they will happhzardly cram into a movie to make it seem like they were organic or something). Ffs. It is like these jackasses never read a Tolkien novel. Oh wait.

It would actually give me some hope to see them do some Old Republic stuff... Because at least then they can't create things that completely ****up the in retrospect the entire original trilogy and because it'll have no ties to the original they might be able to I dunno, actually write a focused story that's not a contrived mess.
 
See, I don't. I simply don't care what anyone else thought about it. I care much more about my personal experience. I've never been big on allowing someone else to influence my opinions on something. I need to formulate my own. Whether that be in relation to a movie, a place or even a person, doesn't matter. I've loved pretty much anything SW from as far back as I can remember but I'm not one of those hard core fan freaks who think they own the franchise and get all pissy over Episode 1 and Jar Jar etc.

Very well said. Looking back, I think that many SW purists are going to pick the movie apart at the expense of just sitting back and enjoying a very thrilling film start-to-finish.

Oh and did I mention that I thought The Last Jedi was VERY good?!
 
I just got back from an early matinee. I was entertained and I was sucked in enough to go see the next one but I felt like they left A LOT on the table and went off on needless tangents that added no value to the story.

My biggest peeve was...

Snoke was done in WAY too easily by Kylo. Are you kidding me? A frickin Sith Lord doesn't have his wits about him enough to realize that the light saber RIGHT NEXT TO HIM is slowly rotating into position to cut him in half? The most powerful character with the force was taken down, easily, by an apprentice still in training?

It totally de-legitimized the power of the dark side, IMO.

But, not a total bomb. Still much better than any of the prequels, IMO.

I thought it was a bit clever since the whole scene started out as a repeat of the Return of the Jedi whereby the emperor tries to entice Luke to join the Dark Side.

Snoke is gone and it seems he was nothing more than a plot device, but then again it happens with so many Star Wars characters (like Boba Fett, and Captain Phasma in this movie) that it sort of became the norm. There's this tremendous buildup followed by a huge letdown- its become a Star Wars trope lol. I wondered what Snoke's backstory was, but now it seems redundant to even explore it.
 
Very well said. Looking back, I think that many SW purists are going to pick the movie apart at the expense of just sitting back and enjoying a very thrilling film start-to-finish.

Oh and did I mention that I thought The Last Jedi was VERY good?!

Sadly it doesn’t take a purist to pick this apart. My girlfriend isn’t a fan. She hates the plot. Thought it was stupid. Hard to enjoy the ride when it isn’t going anywhere.
 
Sadly it doesn’t take a purist to pick this apart. My girlfriend isn’t a fan. She hates the plot. Thought it was stupid. Hard to enjoy the ride when it isn’t going anywhere.

That pretty much describes the plot of all the SW films. Its always been out of the frying pan into the fire where one action set piece after another simply advances the film. Not exactly David Mamet on Broadway.
 
It would actually give me some hope to see them do some Old Republic stuff... Because at least then they can't create things that completely ****up the in retrospect the entire original trilogy and because it'll have no ties to the original they might be able to I dunno, actually write a focused story that's not a contrived mess.

I would love to see the Old Republic era on the big screen. I hope that is what Rian Johnson's trilogy is about.
 
I would love to see the Old Republic era on the big screen. I hope that is what Rian Johnson's trilogy is about.

If they make a trilogy on KOTOR I and II it would be awesome, even though I already know the ending since I played both games many times over.
 
Sadly it doesn’t take a purist to pick this apart. My girlfriend isn’t a fan. She hates the plot. Thought it was stupid. Hard to enjoy the ride when it isn’t going anywhere.

But you know what? It also isnt hard to just go and allow yourself to enjoy a movie. There were some things that were hokey. Some things that were frivolous. Hey...welcome to the Star Wars franchise...nice to meet you. You know what I mean? That stuff has been in there all along. The dots never REALLY always connected. But so what? I mean...if you are going to go into it with the mindset that it has to meet your Star Wars geek-o-meter standards...then why bother?
 
I thought it was a bit clever since the whole scene started out as a repeat of the Return of the Jedi whereby the emperor tries to entice Luke to join the Dark Side.

Snoke is gone and it seems he was nothing more than a plot device, but then again it happens with so many Star Wars characters (like Boba Fett, and Captain Phasma in this movie) that it sort of became the norm. There's this tremendous buildup followed by a huge letdown- its become a Star Wars trope lol. I wondered what Snoke's backstory was, but now it seems redundant to even explore it.

Greetings, PoS. :2wave:

A little off topic, but I just received The Maker of Entropy (The Dying World), and I can't wait to read it! :thumbs: I've got to get all my baking done first, though, - family orders!!..... :lamo

Today I'm making little individual cheesecakes for the big family get-together on Christmas Eve at my brother's house - whew! :lol:
 
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But you know what? It also isnt hard to just go and allow yourself to enjoy a movie. There were some things that were hokey. Some things that were frivolous. Hey...welcome to the Star Wars franchise...nice to meet you. You know what I mean? That stuff has been in there all along. The dots never REALLY always connected. But so what? I mean...if you are going to go into it with the mindset that it has to meet your Star Wars geek-o-meter standards...then why bother?

Ehh... No, it really hasn't, and that's exactly the problem. These latest films frankly have more in common with the Trek reboot franchise (with some injections from the MCU) than they do the original trilogy, and that's due to the combination of Disney's influence, and Abrams' direction.

Disney clearly wants a dumb as rocks series of action movies with good special effects, meant to appeal to as many focus group demographics as possible, so it can make gonzo dollars. Everything else (plot, continuity, theme, writing, quality story telling, etca) is of secondary or tertiary importance.

TFA and TLJ are basically "modern Hollywood blockbusters" in all the worst senses of the word - derivative, lazy, cautious, pandering, bloated, and built from the ground up to mostly appeal to the uncultured, who don't like to think, and are only really interested in seeing pretty colors on screen.
 
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Ehh... No, it really hasn't, and that's exactly the problem. These latest films frankly have more in common with the Trek reboot franchise (with some injections from the MCU) than they do the original trilogy, and that's due to the combination of Disney's influence, and Abram's direction.

Disney clearly wants a dumb as rocks series of action movies with good special effects, meant to appeal to as many focus group demographics as possible, so it can make gonzo dollars. Everything else (plot, continuity, theme, writing, quality story telling, etca) is of secondary or tertiary importance.

TFA and TLJ are basically "modern Hollywood blockbusters" in all the worst senses of the word - derivative, lazy, cautious, pandering, bloated, and built from the ground up to mostly appeal to the uncultured, who don't like to think, and are only really interested in seeing pretty colors on screen.
FFS

Listen to yourself.

Its a ****ing fantasy movie...set in a far away galaxy..a long time ago.

Please dont go see the next movie.
 
But you know what? It also isnt hard to just go and allow yourself to enjoy a movie. There were some things that were hokey. Some things that were frivolous. Hey...welcome to the Star Wars franchise...nice to meet you. You know what I mean? That stuff has been in there all along. The dots never REALLY always connected. But so what? I mean...if you are going to go into it with the mindset that it has to meet your Star Wars geek-o-meter standards...then why bother?

What is the point of going to a movie and EXPECTING it to suck? Lowering my standards? I shouldn’t have to do that. I can go into the movie expecting it to be not as good as the others. Sure. But the least I should be able to expect is some decent writing? I mean the prequels has a purpose. They weren’t great, but they had a purpose. I didn’t feel like I was being sold a Porg doll. This movie was a wreck. Pointless love story, pointless sacrifices and mutiny, wasted characters, and ruining the plot for the next movie. It feels like this movie was written to introduce little force wielding rebel kids to milk the friggin walrus of as much coin as possible and make some movies to take place after this trilogy.

The only reason anyone is enjoying this movie is because of the label. I mean I’m wondering what redeeming qualities this movie really had? At least the action in then prequels were good enough to mask the plot being weak.

As much time as they had? They could at least have delivered on story.
 
Sadly it doesn’t take a purist to pick this apart. My girlfriend isn’t a fan. She hates the plot. Thought it was stupid. Hard to enjoy the ride when it isn’t going anywhere.

Nah it went somewhere alright. But it's hard to elaborate on that without spoiling.
 
Yes. I’m glad you are joining us. I had to come back to this thread to bitch because of how pointless this movie was.

As goofy as it was the movie seemed to perform its main function as a handoff scheme to the next generation of star wars personnel.

Last Jedi wasnt as pointless as suicide squad.
That was full circle pointless. Billions in taxpayer resources were spent to form an agency of villains to stop otherworldly threats....Management creates an otherworldly threat...for them to stop.

Wait...was that a congressional action plan model...??doh
 
FFS

Listen to yourself.

I am. The fact of the matter is that these flicks are jumbled garbage, destined to be quickly forgotten, where the orginals are timeless classics. There's a reason for that.

Its a ****ing fantasy movie...set in a far away galaxy..a long time ago.

Which doesn't mean it has to suck. :rolleyes:

It's not like "Fantasy" can't be real art. There's a reason why the Lord of the Rings was the best selling book series of the 20th Century.

Please dont go see the next movie.

I probably won't if this trend continues. And if this trend continues, Star Wars will likely wear out it's welcome with audiences and die off again, just like other dumb as rocks, all flash and no brains, franchises tend to ultimately do.
 
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