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new computer

beerftw

beerftw

proud ammosexual
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Old computer was running slow, the ram was failing on it, and it was one of those cheap hp slimlines. Finally bought a new computer and a budget video card, got counter strike source to 250 average fps, 180 fps in bot games I host. Cs go I am flatlines at 30 fps which I read had to do with windows 10's xbox app. One of the things that got me was that a fullsize desktop new seems to be 400 bucks for the cheapest as anything below that is a slimline or a all in one, and I wanted full size to run a fullsize video card.

The other killer was the ddr4 ram, which I priced building my own computer, and now a days it is often cheaper to buy a prebuilt one and throw one upgrades in it than build your own, a real shocker compared to what I was used to last time I bought a pc. The ddr4 ram is anywhere from 40 for the cheapest crap to over 100 bucks per 8gb chip depending on the quality, which is vastly different from the last time I priced ram which was ddr3 and was cheap. Graphics cards have mostly shot up in price due to data miners, which is a shame.

The new system is a i5 7400 7th gen
Intel integrated hd 630 replaced with a radeon rx 550 4gb card
1tb hard drive
8gb ddr4 ram-upgradeable to 32 gigs, ain't gonna upgrade that for a while too pricey
Ofcourse a dvdr drive.


Not the greatest setup by any means, but should atleast play many modern games at decent fps at max settings and the newest dx12 games at lower settings with decent fps.
 
beerftw said:
Old computer was running slow, the ram was failing on it, and it was one of those cheap hp slimlines. Finally bought a new computer and a budget video card, got counter strike source to 250 average fps, 180 fps in bot games I host. Cs go I am flatlines at 30 fps which I read had to do with windows 10's xbox app. One of the things that got me was that a fullsize desktop new seems to be 400 bucks for the cheapest as anything below that is a slimline or a all in one, and I wanted full size to run a fullsize video card.

The other killer was the ddr4 ram, which I priced building my own computer, and now a days it is often cheaper to buy a prebuilt one and throw one upgrades in it than build your own, a real shocker compared to what I was used to last time I bought a pc. The ddr4 ram is anywhere from 40 for the cheapest crap to over 100 bucks per 8gb chip depending on the quality, which is vastly different from the last time I priced ram which was ddr3 and was cheap. Graphics cards have mostly shot up in price due to data miners, which is a shame.

The new system is a i5 7400 7th gen
Intel integrated hd 630 replaced with a radeon rx 550 4gb card
1tb hard drive
8gb ddr4 ram-upgradeable to 32 gigs, ain't gonna upgrade that for a while too pricey
Ofcourse a dvdr drive.


Not the greatest setup by any means, but should atleast play many modern games at decent fps at max settings and the newest dx12 games at lower settings with decent fps.
Click to expand...
1] Did you consider an SSD, as your main drive? That's your biggest speed bottleneck. You can always boot off a small moderately priced SSD drive, and keep your memory intensive data on the slower and larger HDD data drive.

2] RAM will have sweet spot pricing. It's expensive initially when introduced, falls to a low sweet spot when it achieves maximum market penetration, then gets more and more expensive as the new generation of memory comes out, finally getting uber expensive and eventually near non existent as it's phased-out completely.

The key, is to buy at the low point for your generation. So make sure you watch the markets, so you don't get priced-out and stuck without an upgrade path.
 
beerftw said:
Old computer was running slow, the ram was failing on it, and it was one of those cheap hp slimlines. Finally bought a new computer and a budget video card, got counter strike source to 250 average fps, 180 fps in bot games I host. Cs go I am flatlines at 30 fps which I read had to do with windows 10's xbox app. One of the things that got me was that a fullsize desktop new seems to be 400 bucks for the cheapest as anything below that is a slimline or a all in one, and I wanted full size to run a fullsize video card.

The other killer was the ddr4 ram, which I priced building my own computer, and now a days it is often cheaper to buy a prebuilt one and throw one upgrades in it than build your own, a real shocker compared to what I was used to last time I bought a pc. The ddr4 ram is anywhere from 40 for the cheapest crap to over 100 bucks per 8gb chip depending on the quality, which is vastly different from the last time I priced ram which was ddr3 and was cheap. Graphics cards have mostly shot up in price due to data miners, which is a shame.

The new system is a i5 7400 7th gen
Intel integrated hd 630 replaced with a radeon rx 550 4gb card
1tb hard drive
8gb ddr4 ram-upgradeable to 32 gigs, ain't gonna upgrade that for a while too pricey
Ofcourse a dvdr drive.


Not the greatest setup by any means, but should atleast play many modern games at decent fps at max settings and the newest dx12 games at lower settings with decent fps.
Click to expand...

Of course? I dont see why you would need one these days. I built mine without one and haven't come to a situation where I have needed it yet.

Anyways congrats on your new rig
 
Crovax said:
Of course? I dont see why you would need one these days. I built mine without one and haven't come to a situation where I have needed it yet.

Anyways congrats on your new rig
Click to expand...
I use DVD drives regularly, for a variety of reasons. For example, Linux distros, ripping DVDs to my personal server, creating photo DVDs, etc.
 
beerftw said:
Old computer was running slow, the ram was failing on it, and it was one of those cheap hp slimlines. Finally bought a new computer and a budget video card, got counter strike source to 250 average fps, 180 fps in bot games I host. Cs go I am flatlines at 30 fps which I read had to do with windows 10's xbox app. One of the things that got me was that a fullsize desktop new seems to be 400 bucks for the cheapest as anything below that is a slimline or a all in one, and I wanted full size to run a fullsize video card.

The other killer was the ddr4 ram, which I priced building my own computer, and now a days it is often cheaper to buy a prebuilt one and throw one upgrades in it than build your own, a real shocker compared to what I was used to last time I bought a pc. The ddr4 ram is anywhere from 40 for the cheapest crap to over 100 bucks per 8gb chip depending on the quality, which is vastly different from the last time I priced ram which was ddr3 and was cheap. Graphics cards have mostly shot up in price due to data miners, which is a shame.

The new system is a i5 7400 7th gen
Intel integrated hd 630 replaced with a radeon rx 550 4gb card
1tb hard drive
8gb ddr4 ram-upgradeable to 32 gigs, ain't gonna upgrade that for a while too pricey
Ofcourse a dvdr drive.


Not the greatest setup by any means, but should atleast play many modern games at decent fps at max settings and the newest dx12 games at lower settings with decent fps.
Click to expand...

I haven't built a computer since 2012...it has DDR2 RAM...so I don't know current prices, but if I WERE building one now, I don't think I'd go with the DDR4. Instead, I'd stick with 16GB of DDR3 and put the savings into a better processor and motherboard.
 
Mycroft said:
I haven't built a computer since 2012...it has DDR2 RAM...so I don't know current prices, but if I WERE building one now, I don't think I'd go with the DDR4. Instead, I'd stick with 16GB of DDR3 and put the savings into a better processor and motherboard.
Click to expand...

You can't get a board that takes ddr3 with the new processors not to mention dd4 is a pretty big jump from ddr3
 
Slyfox696 said:
I use DVD drives regularly, for a variety of reasons. For example, Linux distros, ripping DVDs to my personal server, creating photo DVDs, etc.
Click to expand...

Not trying to be argumentative here but why would you use a DVD for transferring data or what would you do with a photo dvd
 
Mycroft said:
I haven't built a computer since 2012...it has DDR2 RAM...so I don't know current prices, but if I WERE building one now, I don't think I'd go with the DDR4. Instead, I'd stick with 16GB of DDR3 and put the savings into a better processor and motherboard.
Click to expand...
At similar speeds, I don't think there's much of a price difference between DDR3 and DDR4. So you might as well use DDR4.
 
Crovax said:
Not trying to be argumentative here but why would you use a DVD for transferring data
Click to expand...
I wouldn't for transferring data, but I would for the things I mentioned. Not sure what you mean here.

EDIT: If you mean ripping DVDs, I'm talking about TV shows like Big Bang Theory to my Plex server, for example.
or what would you do with a photo dvd
Click to expand...
Give my sister her wedding photos, for example. :)
 
Slyfox696 said:
I wouldn't for transferring data, but I would for the things I mentioned. Not sure what you mean here.

EDIT: If you mean ripping DVDs, I'm talking about TV shows like Big Bang Theory to my Plex server, for example.
Click to expand...

Yeah I read it wrong, I see what you're saying now.

Give my sister her wedding photos, for example. :)
Click to expand...

USB drive, cloud storage seem like better ways to do it
 
Crovax said:
Yeah I read it wrong, I see what you're saying now.
Click to expand...
No problem. :)

USB drive, cloud storage seem like better ways to do it
Click to expand...
More expensive for USB drive, privacy concerns with the cloud. Much easier to put on a DVD, plus she can have a nice disc for her wedding photos. Not much decoration possible on a black USB drive.

Obviously I don't use a DVD every day, but I use it regularly enough to justify an extra $20.
 
Slyfox696 said:
No problem. :)

More expensive for USB drive, privacy concerns with the cloud. Much easier to put on a DVD, plus she can have a nice disc for her wedding photos. Not much decoration possible on a black USB drive.

Obviously I don't use a DVD every day, but I use it regularly enough to justify an extra $20.
Click to expand...

I mean yeah it's nice to have for not much cost but certainly not a necessity for a PC
 
Crovax said:
You can't get a board that takes ddr3 with the new processors not to mention dd4 is a pretty big jump from ddr3
Click to expand...

Not true. The i5 7400 7th gen processor uses the LG 1151 socket and there are many motherboards with that socket available that use DDR3 RAM. For example: Biostar H110MHV3 - Best Compatible Biostar H110MHV3 Mobo This motherboard is totally compatible with that i5 7400 processor. Intel Core i5-7400 3.0GHz CPU Compatible PC Motherboards

Now...for sure, DDR4 is a big jump from DDR3 and some people may be inclined to pay the premium for using it. I'm not so inclined, as I said.
 
Mycroft said:
Not true. The i5 7400 7th gen processor uses the LG 1151 socket and there are many motherboards with that socket available that use DDR3 RAM. For example: Biostar H110MHV3 - Best Compatible Biostar H110MHV3 Mobo This motherboard is totally compatible with that i5 7400 processor. Intel Core i5-7400 3.0GHz CPU Compatible PC Motherboards

Now...for sure, DDR4 is a big jump from DDR3 and some people may be inclined to pay the premium for using it. I'm not so inclined, as I said.
Click to expand...

You have to flash the bios on those with the 6th gen Intel processors, they won't work out of the box with the 7th gen.

And as another poster said ddr4 and ddr3 cost about the same because they are made from the same raw materials
 
Slyfox696 said:
At similar speeds, I don't think there's much of a price difference between DDR3 and DDR4. So you might as well use DDR4.
Click to expand...

DDR3 tops out at 2133. DDR4 starts at 2133. So that is the only similar speed between them.

Comparable RAM:

https://www.newegg.com/Product/Prod...231757&cm_re=DDR3-2133-_-20-231-757-_-Product

https://www.newegg.com/Product/Prod...31884&cm_re=ddr_4_2133-_-20-231-884-_-Product

It's a judgment call, but personally, I'd go with the DDR3 and put the difference into a better MB.
 
Crovax said:
You have to flash the bios on those with the 6th gen Intel processors, they won't work out of the box with the 7th gen.
Click to expand...

I wasn't aware of that, but a quick search confirms. In that case, I'd go with a 6th Gen processor, as well. But then, having a self-built 5 year old computer that works very well...even with recent games...I guess I've gotten over the need for the latest and greatest in hardware.
 
Mycroft said:
DDR3 tops out at 2133. DDR4 starts at 2133. So that is the only similar speed between them.

Comparable RAM:

https://www.newegg.com/Product/Prod...231757&cm_re=DDR3-2133-_-20-231-757-_-Product

https://www.newegg.com/Product/Prod...31884&cm_re=ddr_4_2133-_-20-231-884-_-Product

It's a judgment call, but personally, I'd go with the DDR3 and put the difference into a better MB.
Click to expand...

You can get 2400 ddr4 same brand, series and timing for $10 less than the 2133 ddr4

G.SKILL Ripjaws V Series 16GB (2 x 8GB) 288-Pin DDR4 SDRAM DDR4 2400 (PC4 19200) Intel Z170 Platform / Intel X99 Platform Desktop Memory Model F4-2400C15D-16GVS - Newegg.com
 
started googling it, even ddr3 has skyrocketed, apparently ram prices basically doubled across the board in the last year.
 
Chomsky said:
1] Did you consider an SSD, as your main drive? That's your biggest speed bottleneck. You can always boot off a small moderately priced SSD drive, and keep your memory intensive data on the slower and larger HDD data drive.

2] RAM will have sweet spot pricing. It's expensive initially when introduced, falls to a low sweet spot when it achieves maximum market penetration, then gets more and more expensive as the new generation of memory comes out, finally getting uber expensive and eventually near non existent as it's phased-out completely.

The key, is to buy at the low point for your generation. So make sure you watch the markets, so you don't get priced-out and stuck without an upgrade path.
Click to expand...

After googling it ram shot up in the last year, due to a combination of price fixing, a factory going down skewing supply and demand, and well data miners just like they did to video cards.

In terms of an ssd, have not had one since I had my old alienware laptop I bought used years ago, it had a 256 gb ssd, which then was top of the line expensive as hell option, and it was a full size hd. My coworker just bought a gaming rig, and it only had 256 gb as well with an ssd, but it was not full size like my alienware had, but was a tiny card in the motherboard. I have not tried ssd drives since the alienware, but I was underwhelmed by the little diference,may have to try it again with new tech vs tech from when ssd drives were brand new and prone to issues.
 
beerftw said:
After googling it ram shot up in the last year, due to a combination of price fixing, a factory going down skewing supply and demand, and well data miners just like they did to video cards.

In terms of an ssd, have not had one since I had my old alienware laptop I bought used years ago, it had a 256 gb ssd, which then was top of the line expensive as hell option, and it was a full size hd. My coworker just bought a gaming rig, and it only had 256 gb as well with an ssd, but it was not full size like my alienware had, but was a tiny card in the motherboard. I have not tried ssd drives since the alienware, but I was underwhelmed by the little diference,may have to try it again with new tech vs tech from when ssd drives were brand new and prone to issues.
Click to expand...
I would highly recommend trying an SSD. The difference is dramatic, enough so that I can say just about any laptop is bound by the main drive. An SSD today will launch your compy in a few quick seconds, and will cost under a hundred bucks for a smallish 128-256gB. But you only need it for your OS and apps. You can keep your data, movies, etc., on a conventional HDD.

Good luck whatever you do, but I believe you'll be very pleasantly surprised, if and when you try a boot SSD!
 
Slyfox696 said:
I use DVD drives regularly, for a variety of reasons. For example, Linux distros, ripping DVDs to my personal server, creating photo DVDs, etc.
Click to expand...

!!!!

Linux Distros of USB sticks ftw!!!

Ripping personal DVDS? People buy those still.. where?

Creating Photo DVD...where on earth would you play those???? TVs take USB sticks np now days!!





sorry had too, was too tempting!!!
 
Crovax said:
I mean yeah it's nice to have for not much cost but certainly not a necessity for a PC
Click to expand...
The same argument could be made for a graphics card.

It's just what one uses a computer for.
Mycroft said:
DDR3 tops out at 2133. DDR4 starts at 2133. So that is the only similar speed between them.
Click to expand...
Exactly.

Comparable RAM:

https://www.newegg.com/Product/Prod...231757&cm_re=DDR3-2133-_-20-231-757-_-Product

https://www.newegg.com/Product/Prod...31884&cm_re=ddr_4_2133-_-20-231-884-_-Product

It's a judgment call, but personally, I'd go with the DDR3 and put the difference into a better MB.
Click to expand...
But there's not that much of a difference. Ignoring for a moment you can get 16 GB of DDR4 RAM cheaper than the one you posted, you're really only saving $30 between the two products you listed. $30 isn't going to get you much more processor, so why limit yourself on memory to buy a processor whose difference in speed you're just not going to notice much?

Certainly it's a personal choice. You're welcome to choose what you want and the OP is welcome to choose what they want, but I'd probably make the same choice the OP did.
PeteEU said:
!!!!

Linux Distros of USB sticks ftw!!!
Click to expand...
Nah, I like to keep copies and having 15 USB drives is much more expensive and much harder to keep.

Ripping personal DVDS? People buy those still.. where?
Click to expand...
All the time. At stores, Amazon, etc.

Creating Photo DVD...where on earth would you play those???? TVs take USB sticks np now days!!

sorry had too, was too tempting!!!
Click to expand...
It took me waaay to long to note the tenor of your post. :)
 
Slyfox696 said:
The same argument could be made for a graphics card.

It's just what one uses a computer for.
Exactly.


But there's not that much of a difference. Ignoring for a moment you can get 16 GB of DDR4 RAM cheaper than the one you posted, you're really only saving $30 between the two products you listed. $30 isn't going to get you much more processor, so why limit yourself on memory to buy a processor whose difference in speed you're just not going to notice much?

Certainly it's a personal choice. You're welcome to choose what you want and the OP is welcome to choose what they want, but I'd probably make the same choice the OP did.
Nah, I like to keep copies and having 15 USB drives is much more expensive and much harder to keep.

All the time. At stores, Amazon, etc.

It took me waaay to long to note the tenor of your post. :)
Click to expand...

Which is why integrated Intel graphics is the most used "graphics card" on steam but for playing the newest AAA games a graphics is a necessity a lot more than a dvdr ever would be
 
Slyfox696 said:
But there's not that much of a difference. Ignoring for a moment you can get 16 GB of DDR4 RAM cheaper than the one you posted, you're really only saving $30 between the two products you listed. $30 isn't going to get you much more processor, so why limit yourself on memory to buy a processor whose difference in speed you're just not going to notice much?
Click to expand...

The savings is more than just the savings for the RAM. Unless you want to go through the hassle of updating the MB BIOS, you will also need a more expensive motherboard designed for that DDR4 RAM/processor combination. That's why I also suggested a different MB to go along with DDR3 for a self-built system. And, I would also look into a different processor...say, a gen 6 i7 of some kind.

As far as cheaper DDR4, the OP addressed that. The cheaper stuff is cheaper for a reason. With my comparison, I used a well-respected brand and one of their sweet-spot models.

One can alway make their own choices...depending upon their needs and their budget. Given the OP's mention of the common price point he sees...$400...for that money, I'd go with a better processor, 16GB's DDR3 RAM and use the savings for the graphics card or an SSD. But understand that I really haven't done any pricing. This is just my guesstimate.
 
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