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PS4 and RTS Gaming (Mouse and keyboard)

Deuce said:
I like how the argument went from "you can't get a playable gaming PC for less than $2000," then it was $1000, and now it's "well my budget is $300 and PCs take too long to set up."

Ok. If your budget is $300, buy a console. I suggest sticking to used games from a few years ago, those $60 new AAA titles will be a bit much.

As for "man hours to achieve 60fps." Uhh. What? You can walk into Best Buy and walk out with a machine that will do that. It wont take any longer to set up than a console does.
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Let's see. You can go to the store and buy a PC that is just as easy to setup as a console. Really?

https://www.google.com/amp/www.pcwo...atware-here-are-the-vendors-to-avoid.amp.html

You are still looking at researching and having to learn what kind of performance, bloatware, ram, processor, drive, graphics card, etc...ad naseum. And then factor in the fact that you are buying an out of date PC that day. And that you really won't be getting "top quality" performance or the "bang for your buck" experience. All the stuff that the PC elitists go ON and ON and ON about.

Walk in, buy a console...never look at specs, ram, processor, controllers are all the same, you have a media box for your TV, ALL AAA titles will be on your console, and you can plug and play. Disk space IS a new issue...yes. That's fine. Still pretty simple. Anyone with a smart phone can probably figure out how to delete things. Especially since it tells you how.

IF consoles were worthless...if PCs were just as simple, just as good...they would have killed the console. But they haven't. The console is just an easier and simpler and still fun gaming experience. Plus I don't have to feel like I'm getting knee capped by a colonel 100 with a **** bucket...because I didn't have $2000 and no other hobbies. And I am someone who DOES like PC and WOULD game on them...if they would actually make an effort for us "console trash."


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blackjack50 said:
Let's see. You can go to the store and buy a PC that is just as easy to setup as a console. Really?

https://www.google.com/amp/www.pcwo...atware-here-are-the-vendors-to-avoid.amp.html

You are still looking at researching and having to learn what kind of performance, bloatware, ram, processor, drive, graphics card, etc...ad naseum. And then factor in the fact that you are buying an out of date PC that day. And that you really won't be getting "top quality" performance or the "bang for your buck" experience. All the stuff that the PC elitists go ON and ON and ON about.
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Consoles are made with technology that is old by the time consoles come out.
 
blackjack50 said:
Let's see. You can go to the store and buy a PC that is just as easy to setup as a console. Really?

https://www.google.com/amp/www.pcwo...atware-here-are-the-vendors-to-avoid.amp.html

You are still looking at researching and having to learn what kind of performance, bloatware, ram, processor, drive, graphics card, etc...ad naseum. And then factor in the fact that you are buying an out of date PC that day. And that you really won't be getting "top quality" performance or the "bang for your buck" experience. All the stuff that the PC elitists go ON and ON and ON about.

Walk in, buy a console...never look at specs, ram, processor, controllers are all the same, you have a media box for your TV, ALL AAA titles will be on your console, and you can plug and play. Disk space IS a new issue...yes. That's fine. Still pretty simple. Anyone with a smart phone can probably figure out how to delete things. Especially since it tells you how.

IF consoles were worthless...if PCs were just as simple, just as good...they would have killed the console. But they haven't. The console is just an easier and simpler and still fun gaming experience. Plus I don't have to feel like I'm getting knee capped by a colonel 100 with a **** bucket...because I didn't have $2000 and no other hobbies. And I am someone who DOES like PC and WOULD game on them...if they would actually make an effort for us "console trash."


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Click to expand...


Again with the moving goalposts.

You can buy a PC that is as easy to set up as a console.

Having more product options doesn't make a computer harder to set up. You bring it home, plug it in, and turn it on. Quite frankly, the number of inputs and updates you have to do on a new Windows 10 machine takes less time than the consoles. When I first turned on my Xbox One it had to update the operating system. Then it had to update some other miscellaneous software. Then I put in a disc and it had to update the freaking game.

Your argument has gone all the way from "you can't get something playable for under $2000" to "computers are more complicated than consoles and there are more options!" Yeah, no **** sherlock. If that's too much for you, don't buy one. Nobody is offended.
 
blackjack50 said:
Let's see. You can go to the store and buy a PC that is just as easy to setup as a console. Really?

https://www.google.com/amp/www.pcwo...atware-here-are-the-vendors-to-avoid.amp.html

You are still looking at researching and having to learn what kind of performance, bloatware, ram, processor, drive, graphics card, etc...ad naseum. And then factor in the fact that you are buying an out of date PC that day. And that you really won't be getting "top quality" performance or the "bang for your buck" experience. All the stuff that the PC elitists go ON and ON and ON about.

Walk in, buy a console...never look at specs, ram, processor, controllers are all the same, you have a media box for your TV, ALL AAA titles will be on your console, and you can plug and play. Disk space IS a new issue...yes. That's fine. Still pretty simple. Anyone with a smart phone can probably figure out how to delete things. Especially since it tells you how.

IF consoles were worthless...if PCs were just as simple, just as good...they would have killed the console. But they haven't. The console is just an easier and simpler and still fun gaming experience. Plus I don't have to feel like I'm getting knee capped by a colonel 100 with a **** bucket...because I didn't have $2000 and no other hobbies. And I am someone who DOES like PC and WOULD game on them...if they would actually make an effort for us "console trash."


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Click to expand...

You must be a millennial
 
Deuce said:
Nice work! Although that PSU scares me a little.
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Yeah it's not ideal but a separate one would cost more and still be a very low tier one. However it's just a pentium with stock cooler, no overclock and a gpu that doesn't need power, I would feel reasonably comfortable with that psu. That's one thing that people seem to go crazy over is PSUs.
 
Redress said:
I tried once to play a FPS with a game controller. Never again. Mouse and keyboard works so much better.
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Mouse and keyboard are better for almost everything except for maybe racing games.
 
Fishking said:
Mouse and keyboard are better for almost everything except for maybe racing games.
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And flight simulators, but that is a whole different kettle of fish, and a whole different control needs.
 
Redress said:
And flight simulators, but that is a whole different kettle of fish, and a whole different control needs.
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Agreed. I didn't even think about the fancy controlers used for flight simulators. I don't think I've played a flight simulator since Windows ran on DOS.
 
Crovax said:
Yeah it's not ideal but a separate one would cost more and still be a very low tier one. However it's just a pentium with stock cooler, no overclock and a gpu that doesn't need power, I would feel reasonably comfortable with that psu. That's one thing that people seem to go crazy over is PSUs.
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Probably because it's the one component that can take literally everything else with it when it fails.

Or burn your house down.
 
Fishking said:
Agreed. I didn't even think about the fancy controlers used for flight simulators. I don't think I've played a flight simulator since Windows ran on DOS.
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I got Wing Commander from the discount bin back about '92ish for 5 bucks. The joystick and throttle cost me over 100. So much for that cheap game...
 
Deuce said:
Probably because it's the one component that can take literally everything else with it when it fails.

Or burn your house down.
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and that fear is way overblown, there are millions of prebuilts each day running more power than that machine on worse PSUs and those things rarely happen
 
Fishking said:
Agreed. I didn't even think about the fancy controlers used for flight simulators. I don't think I've played a flight simulator since Windows ran on DOS.
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Ive got one for my HTC vive VR setup and its amazing. You can even make yourself air sick
 
Henrin said:
Consoles are made with technology that is old by the time consoles come out.
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Which is ABSOlUTELY the truth, but also irrelevant. Everyone on console has the same console. And they have a much easier time with it.


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Deuce said:
Again with the moving goalposts.

You can buy a PC that is as easy to set up as a console.

Having more product options doesn't make a computer harder to set up. You bring it home, plug it in, and turn it on. Quite frankly, the number of inputs and updates you have to do on a new Windows 10 machine takes less time than the consoles. When I first turned on my Xbox One it had to update the operating system. Then it had to update some other miscellaneous software. Then I put in a disc and it had to update the freaking game.

Your argument has gone all the way from "you can't get something playable for under $2000" to "computers are more complicated than consoles and there are more options!" Yeah, no **** sherlock. If that's too much for you, don't buy one. Nobody is offended.
Click to expand...

Except the guy who is freaking out at the suggesting that a console is a simpler platform and the fact that the PC market in general sucks balls at marketing low cost gaming options that are easy to handle.

And we aren't talking about just setup dude. We are talking about those machines having to decide different parts and which parts you want and blah blah blah.

I can go to the store and buy a PS4 and play without worrying about any of that. Period.


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blackjack50 said:
Except the guy who is freaking out at the suggesting that a console is a simpler platform and the fact that the PC market in general sucks balls at marketing low cost gaming options that are easy to handle.

And we aren't talking about just setup dude. We are talking about those machines having to decide different parts and which parts you want and blah blah blah.

I can go to the store and buy a PS4 and play without worrying about any of that. Period.


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Click to expand...

Yes, you can.

None of this was ever a part of my argument. You went from "it's not playable below $2000" to "it's more complicated to buy a PC."

Yes. It is. And?
 
Fishking said:
Mouse and keyboard are better for almost everything except for maybe racing games.
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It depends on the setup. I enjoy FPS on both, but jumping into and flying something in a game is usually a lot easier on a controller (accept war thunder) when you ignore flight sim stuff. Racing too. I agree. Sports games as well.

The FPS edge on controller is that everyone is on the same frame rate and all that. Everyone is pretty much on the same equipment.


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blackjack50 said:
Why? Because I understand the limitations of the PC and I am fully baffled at the idiocy that encourages it?
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No, Its because you dont know anything about computers. I see it all the time with my employees they have grown up ubiquitously with technology but dont have a clue about anything other than how to work the basic functions of it.

All the barriers to entry into the PC realm are common knowledge things or easily researched, its the equivalent of saying that walking is superior to driving because you have to learn how to use a turn signal or that one day you might have to change a tire.
 
Crovax said:
No, Its because you dont know anything about computers. I see it all the time with my employees they have grown up ubiquitously with technology but dont have a clue about anything other than how to work the basic functions of it.

All the barriers to entry into the PC realm are common knowledge things or easily researched, its the equivalent of saying that walking is superior to driving because you have to learn how to use a turn signal or that one day you might have to change a tire.
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Dude. I know plenty about computers. I can set them up, I can run them, I use them all the time. And walking IS superior to driving if the distance is short. We are talking about trying to have fun here. I want to jump on, play for a bit, then get off. I have work, I have jujitsu, I have hunting, and all that. I have to prep for a hike in the Rockies too. Plus I have my wonderful animals that I train and take to the dog park.

At what point do you think I WANT to sit down and do hours of research on processor, motherboard, graphics card, SSD vs HD, ram, keyboards, mouse, sound.

Do you know how much research has to be done with a PS4? None. Period. 0. Do you realize how nice that is? Or are you completely ignorant of what is supposed to be an indoor rainy day/night hobby to many?


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blackjack50 said:
Dude. I know plenty about computers. I can set them up, I can run them, I use them all the time. And walking IS superior to driving if the distance is short. We are talking about trying to have fun here. I want to jump on, play for a bit, then get off. I have work, I have jujitsu, I have hunting, and all that. I have to prep for a hike in the Rockies too. Plus I have my wonderful animals that I train and take to the dog park.

At what point do you think I WANT to sit down and do hours of research on processor, motherboard, graphics card, SSD vs HD, ram, keyboards, mouse, sound.
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Yes you have a vast knowledge of computers yet it would take you "hours" of research to find basic info that could be done in 30 mins max

Do you know how much research has to be done with a PS4? None. Period. 0. Do you realize how nice that is? Or are you completely ignorant of what is supposed to be an indoor rainy day/night hobby to many?
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So there is no research involved in deciding between ps4, xbox and switch? just pick whichever name sounds coolest and you will be all set?
 
Crovax said:
Yes you have a vast knowledge of computers yet it would take you "hours" of research to find basic info that could be done in 30 mins max
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30 minutes to find a computer that gives me equal playing ability as everyone else I am playing against in an online game? And that it only costs $300 or so? And I can play any game I want coming out in the next like 7 years? Good luck.

So there is no research involved in deciding between ps4, xbox and switch? just pick whichever name sounds coolest and you will be all set?
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Not really. Sony. Why pick an Xbox? But seriously. Again. How much do you think there is given the above? Lol.


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blackjack50 said:
30 minutes to find a computer that gives me equal playing ability as everyone else I am playing against in an online game? And that it only costs $300 or so? And I can play any game I want coming out in the next like 7 years? Good luck.
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Good luck finding that on console. You dont get 7 years of play for $300 bucks. The whole lifespan is 7 years so if you buy it at the beginning and include the cost of the online play its $850 bucks and yes you can absolutely find a PC that can play games for 7 years for $850. As far as equal playing ability you are fooling yourself if you think consoles are equal, some games play better off disc or hdd, specialized controllers to make certain movements easier, along with the keyboard/mouse add ons that started this topic and not to mention the TV you play on can give a big advantage

Not really. Sony. Why pick an Xbox? But seriously. Again. How much do you think there is given the above? Lol.
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Significantly more than your claim of "None. Period. 0.", nice try to move the goalposts though
 
blackjack50 said:
Dude. I know plenty about computers. I can set them up, I can run them, I use them all the time. And walking IS superior to driving if the distance is short. We are talking about trying to have fun here. I want to jump on, play for a bit, then get off. I have work, I have jujitsu, I have hunting, and all that. I have to prep for a hike in the Rockies too. Plus I have my wonderful animals that I train and take to the dog park.

At what point do you think I WANT to sit down and do hours of research on processor, motherboard, graphics card, SSD vs HD, ram, keyboards, mouse, sound.

Do you know how much research has to be done with a PS4? None. Period. 0. Do you realize how nice that is? Or are you completely ignorant of what is supposed to be an indoor rainy day/night hobby to many?


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Click to expand...
Crovax said:
Yes you have a vast knowledge of computers yet it would take you "hours" of research to find basic info that could be done in 30 mins max



So there is no research involved in deciding between ps4, xbox and switch? just pick whichever name sounds coolest and you will be all set?
Click to expand...

I feel like you two (and maybe others) are simply talking past each other. Crovax you are asserting (rightly) that PC provides the better gaming experience in terms of performance. Blackjack is asserting (rightly) that buying a PS4 or Xbox is easier to use for gaming and is perfectly fine quality. If I'm wrong about either of your positions, feel free to say so.

I had Playstation, a PS2 and a PS3. Last year, I spent nearly $1800 on a new PC (and got a good $250 monitor for Christmas). My PC has 32 GB of RAM, the GTX 1080, i7-6700k, etc. As someone who enjoys PC gaming and am very happy with what I have (and don't want to go back to a console anytime soon), it is also very easy for me to see the allure to console gaming. Blackjack is correct when he says it is a less stressful purchase and a PS4 is dedicated to gaming (as opposed to a PC, which will be running other programs in the background). Additionally, hooking a console up to a TV is much easier than hooking a PC up to a TV, in terms of actually using it (controllers, keyboard/mouse, etc.). Furthermore, in many (most?) games which are released to all consoles and PC, the console versions will usually have far more players in multiplayer than the PC version.

There are appeals to each and each side of the argument has a legitimate argument. It basically boils down to personal preference and what is important to each person.
 
Crovax said:
Good luck finding that on console. You dont get 7 years of play for $300 bucks. The whole lifespan is 7 years so if you buy it at the beginning
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You realize that is not necessary? Then consider that people continue to play after the old console comes out?


and include the cost of the online play its $850 bucks and yes you can absolutely find a PC that can play games for 7 years for $850.
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So this is irrelevant. And cost of online play? My wallet can take $50 a year. If that.

As far as equal playing ability you are fooling yourself if you think consoles are equal, some games play better off disc or hdd, specialized controllers to make certain movements easier, along with the keyboard/mouse add ons that started this topic and not to mention the TV you play on can give a big advantage
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All minuscule and almost irrelevant. Do you honestly believe there is a less level playing field than there is on PC when it comes to hardware?

Oh. And mouse and keyboard? Not that big of an advantage. I play with someone who does that for R6.

Significantly more than your claim of "None. Period. 0.", nice try to move the goalposts though
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I don't think you understand what moving the goalposts is. You obviously don't understand the goal post here. It is that the PC is a ridiculously overpriced choice for someone who simply wants to sit down and have fun. Especially when that person has way more fun hobbies. I'm honestly torn between dumping gaming as a hobby or just wasting my money on a PC only because the console companies just don't innovate well.

I know you will defend the precious PC to death, but that is because the PC must be "l33t" or else the emperors new clothes will show. And if you still believe all the above...how much did you spend on your rig? Do you think someone spent less money and got a better player experience?


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Slyfox696 said:
I feel like you two (and maybe others) are simply talking past each other. Crovax you are asserting (rightly) that PC provides the better gaming experience in terms of performance. Blackjack is asserting (rightly) that buying a PS4 or Xbox is easier to use for gaming and is perfectly fine quality. If I'm wrong about either of your positions, feel free to say so.

I had Playstation, a PS2 and a PS3. Last year, I spent nearly $1800 on a new PC (and got a good $250 monitor for Christmas). My PC has 32 GB of RAM, the GTX 1080, i7-6700k, etc. As someone who enjoys PC gaming and am very happy with what I have (and don't want to go back to a console anytime soon), it is also very easy for me to see the allure to console gaming. Blackjack is correct when he says it is a less stressful purchase and a PS4 is dedicated to gaming (as opposed to a PC, which will be running other programs in the background). Additionally, hooking a console up to a TV is much easier than hooking a PC up to a TV, in terms of actually using it (controllers, keyboard/mouse, etc.). Furthermore, in many (most?) games which are released to all consoles and PC, the console versions will usually have far more players in multiplayer than the PC version.

There are appeals to each and each side of the argument has a legitimate argument. It basically boils down to personal preference and what is important to each person.
Click to expand...

Only because consoles have less choices. The biggest player bases in the world belong to pc exclusive games.
 
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