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Americans Losing Faith in College Degrees, Poll Finds

College is awesome...when the goal is seeking a degree that will provide for a successful financial future for ones self and their family. The ridiculous bull**** (overpriced) degrees that are not marketable, coupled with the social indoctrination and mental and emotional crippling of a generation......yeah...worthless. Worse than worthless because it comes with a mountain of debt.
 
The problem from my point of view is exemplified all over this thread regardless of position.

University is being put on a pedestal to the point the issue becomes sophistry 101.

Too many people in our society want too desperately to have their bad ideas or low-skill sets be seen with credibility. They trudge up their resumes with meaningless education rather than produce coherent and meaningful argumentation or inquiry. That is not the universities fault, that is the false credibility given to what post-secondary offers.

I truly have no issues with university. I think they represent themselves rather honestly and in their way approach true education. Despite their many limitations they no doubt contribute a lot more to society than they take. Even the most seeming useless degrees like English literature or Gender studies is not inherently wrong, just less than its advocates would have you believe. I think the world is a better place that our kids take the time to study those disciplines and be guided in how they approach any problem with discipline and rigger rather than common sense and the life lessons of pushing burgers at the local fast-food or starting production line in some factory.

This idea though that university grants one some type of privilege or status or that many of our top executives and innovators must possess some arbitrary level of higher education is just another move away from true meritocracy.

I don’t care if one has an Ph.d or a grade 9 education. Ideas and talents exist from hard work, self-driven education and practice. The path to that is up to the individual. For some that means university for other that means a more practical street-smart education. Why so many choose to be lazy holding up some meaningless accomplishments rather than evaluate other people based on merit is beyond me.

Universities are a net good. Student loans allow greater access. Government funding for post secondary including the humanities promotes a more dynamic and creative workforce.The second though we continue our move toward measuring a person by degree rather than more wholistic views of their their skill set, intelligence and expertises we've lost before we’ve even began. The success of the west was built on meritocracy and it that value we are risk of losing and that value I think is reflected in this poll rather any inherit new disrespect for academic pursuit.

The reality is more and more today university is a economic drain on a intelligent & creative person; how one goes about getting a good education is changing radically with the internet, economic and industrializing trends. If universities want to remain relevant they must adapt and do more to recognize less traditional routes and focus less on costly standardized mass-learning of students with vastly different learning-potentials and focus more on more accurate certification, testing and evaluations. Reputation is hurt with every low-intelligence high-determination ph.d being propagated by an out of date merit system. To reverse the reputation trend universities need to bring back more meritocracy!
 
Good. Not every kid needs a 4-year degree, and I think it's despicable that we shove them into it simply to sacrifice them into debt slavery at the altar of the district wanting to win a ribbon.

I also think it's despicable that we look down on people who want to do jobs that don't require a 4-year degree. I'd love to see some communications major try to wire a house, fix a car, or read a CT. This stuff takes more brain power than your average communications major ever uses in their lives, and none of it requires a 4-year degree. Hell, let's be real, most 4-year degrees don't require a 4-year degree either. We've just arbitrarily decided they're going to be 4 years.

We tell children their happiness is less important than winning superficial social approval by going a more expensive and time-consuming route. If someone is happy being a make-up artist, or a chef, or a welder, why on earth shouldn't they be?

A lot of degrees, especially in the BA category, have simply become status markers with little to no practical application. See: the struggle of every English major post-graduation.

But along those lines, I'm really tired of seeing people berate them for getting these useless degrees and using it as a reason to punish them even more. Look, man. When these kids were 16 years old, their school, academic counselor, and probably their parents, fought tooth and nail and convince them that even a pointless major is better than just going to trade school. That they would be more secure even with a useless degree than they would be with a practical certification. They were kids. They trusted their elders, already living in the real world, to steer them right.

And in some cases I saw, they even told their kids they would kick them out and pull the college fund if they didn't go to a 4-year college. Actually, my mother attempt to coerce me into it as well (not just the schooling, but the school, the timing, and the major, or she'd take my fund -- I couldn't help but wonder if she'd ever even met me, to think that would work on my personality). I held my ground, but most of my peers didn't. I understand why they didn't. I had a rough couple years. I'm just really stubborn.

If you wanna be a lawyer, yeah, go to college.

If you wanna be a mechanic, don't let anyone convince you a useless BA and a mountain of debt you'll never make enough to pay off is a better idea than making yourself happy with a certification that will let you do your dream, for less.
 
VanceMack said:
College is awesome...when the goal is seeking a degree that will provide for a successful financial future for ones self and their family. The ridiculous bull**** (overpriced) degrees that are not marketable, coupled with the social indoctrination and mental and emotional crippling of a generation......yeah...worthless. Worse than worthless because it comes with a mountain of debt.
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What year did you graduate from Bob Jones University?
 
Roadvirus said:
"It's all the Republicans' fault"....how original.
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SmokeAndMirrors said:
Good. Not every kid needs a 4-year degree, and I think it's despicable that we shove them into it simply to sacrifice them into debt slavery at the altar of the district wanting to win a ribbon.

I also think it's despicable that we look down on people who want to do jobs that don't require a 4-year degree. I'd love to see some communications major try to wire a house, fix a car, or read a CT. This stuff takes more brain power than your average communications major ever uses in their lives, and none of it requires a 4-year degree. Hell, let's be real, most 4-year degrees don't require a 4-year degree either. We've just arbitrarily decided they're going to be 4 years.

We tell children their happiness is less important than winning superficial social approval by going a more expensive and time-consuming route. If someone is happy being a make-up artist, or a chef, or a welder, why on earth shouldn't they be?

A lot of degrees, especially in the BA category, have simply become status markers with little to no practical application. See: the struggle of every English major post-graduation.

But along those lines, I'm really tired of seeing people berate them for getting these useless degrees and using it as a reason to punish them even more. Look, man. When these kids were 16 years old, their school, academic counselor, and probably their parents, fought tooth and nail and convince them that even a pointless major is better than just going to trade school. That they would be more secure even with a useless degree than they would be with a practical certification. They were kids. They trusted their elders, already living in the real world, to steer them right.

And in some cases I saw, they even told their kids they would kick them out and pull the college fund if they didn't go to a 4-year college. Actually, my mother attempt to coerce me into it as well (not just the schooling, but the school, the timing, and the major, or she'd take my fund -- I couldn't help but wonder if she'd ever even met me, to think that would work on my personality). I held my ground, but most of my peers didn't. I understand why they didn't. I had a rough couple years. I'm just really stubborn.

If you wanna be a lawyer, yeah, go to college.

If you wanna be a mechanic, don't let anyone convince you a useless BA and a mountain of debt you'll never make enough to pay off is a better idea than making yourself happy with a certification that will let you do your dream, for less.
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An example to prove your point:

I was studying with a group of classmates for an Anatomy exam when two other students sat to the table next to us. We all looked over and noticed that they were studying for an upcoming Business exam. This is where my point comes into fruition. One of my classmates looked at them and immediately made a comment that got under my skin. He said, "Wow, it must be nice to be a business major. What a joke! Why are they even studying for such an easy major." The worst part of this incident was that all my classmates started laughing and supported the asshole's comment.

But along those lines, I'm really tired of seeing people berate them for getting these useless degrees and using it as a reason to punish them even more. Look, man. When these kids were 16 years old, their school, academic counselor, and probably their parents, fought tooth and nail and convince them that even a pointless major is better than just going to trade school. That they would be more secure even with a useless degree than they would be with a practical certification. They were kids. They trusted their elders, already living in the real world, to steer them right.
 
LowDown said:
It depends on which area of study we are talking about. The STEM subjects still command a lot of respect while the mere existence of fields like gender studies and all the other grievance mongering departments showers down disdain upon academe from the public.

Complete elimination of student loan programs would correct most of this, I think. But then you can kiss the brass, glass and marble student centers goodbye.
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Well, people like titles more than jobs/career.

Many countries rely more on apprentice technic specialization than University. Take Germany for example.

And it seems that most people who finish their university studies end up not working in their graduated area. A lot end doing unskilled jobs and many others jobless.

 
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chuckiechan said:
College is popular with democrats because when you enter college you are not part of the unemployment figures. For many, college is just a big high school. 24/7 frat parties with fewer rules and more chicks.
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Absurd. Why would democrats want to have an artificially low unemployment statistic? Remember, republicans currently control the presidency and both houses of congress, so if what you are saying is true, then this artifical lowering of the unemployment rate is benefiting the opposite party.
 
wellwisher said:
Originally college was based on merit, which then translated to a place where the smartest students would collect. This kept the cost down due to limited enrollment and the need to lure the best and brightest with signing bonuses. This was the prestige game played by the universities. Now with quota type laws, where merit is not important as student loans, demand has far exceed supply and costs of education have increased. It no longer adds up in terms of cost/benefit. This is true all through culture where merit based has been exchanged for quotas. The result is system wide higher cost/benefit. What is happening is fewer men are going to college and instead opting for skilled trades where money is better and benefit is higher; new cream of the crop place where quotas are less evident.
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It was never merit based. It was based upon families having the wealth to not need their young adults to work on the farm. It was a place for the financially elite to send their adult children and the only real academic requirement was that they could read and do basic math. Heck, the University of South Carolina once allowed students to bring their own slaves.
 
reinoe said:
The trend of devaluing a degree wouldn't have merit if college degrees themselves weren't becoming increasingly worthless.


If I had a choice between hiring a person with a degree in Gender Studies and a student with no degree at all, I'd probably choose the person without the degree.
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Would that not be dependent upon what type of job it is?
 
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