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Abortion.

BrotherFease said:
I am pro-life and pro-mask. So I don't know how I fit into the OP's premise. I also oppose capital punishment.
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Bongs is saying if you are really "pro-life" you care about all lives, not just the tiny ones who can't do anything except grow and develop. "Pro-life" can't possibly mean a Republican only cares about the mere existence of homeless babies who are guaranteed to be in abusive homes or bounce from one foster home to the next because nobody wanted them.
 
Lursa said:
??? Our 'moral beliefs' are not imposed on anyone. That's what 'pro-choice' means.

And gay marriage doesnt affect anyone else's marriages. What are you thinking of?
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If your moral beliefs aren't being imposed on others here, I've a bridge with oceanfront property in Barstow, CA. to sell you.

In the abortion forum, don't kid yourself, everyone is trying to impose, sell, preach their morality onto others.
 
Crovax said:
I believe I did a few years ago. It seems to be a very disagreeable idea to a lot of people
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Damn straight!

What right does the govt have over our exercising our own right to life? To tell us we cant end it if we choose? Or to use govt force to make women remain pregnant against our wills? THere is something called 'balancing rights' that the higher courts would use for any laws that found conflict between the current Const and your idea of a new amendment.

And since prioritizing the public good is the primary criteria they are supposed to consider when doing so...they'll be reminded that there are no negative effects of abortion "on society." Unless you can list some? Or how suicide, assisted or otherwise, negatively affects "society?" There needs to be an overriding reason to violate an individual's rights.

It's like, "buh bye personal liberty."

This is the barely coherent and grammatically inept speech of a man who desperately wants to be able to claim that he "cured coronavirus."

That's it, in a nutshell. When we do get a handle on this crisis, he wants to be able to pull out footage and declare "I called it! I said use this! I said try this! I told them to do this, it was my idea!" He's just doing it with lots of stupid stuff because he doesnt want to miss an opportunity. He's afraid 'the big one' will be mentioned and he wont get credit for it.

It's all about declaring himself the savior of the cv crisis and we'll hear all about it, esp in his campaign. (Which is basically each of his press briefings these days) --- Lursa
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Blue Donkey said:
Bongs is saying if you are really "pro-life" you care about all lives, not just the tiny ones who can't do anything except grow and develop. "Pro-life" can't possibly mean a Republican only cares about the mere existence of homeless babies who are guaranteed to be in abusive homes or bounce from one foster home to the next because nobody wanted them.
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So much assumption being projected here. It should be noted I am casting no judgment on your own moral code here.
 
trixare4kids said:
In most cases an act of irresponsibility led to a pregnancy.
The act of abotioon doesn't erase the above irresponsibility.
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At least 2/3 of Americans have sex responsibly. And we all know that no non-surgical bc is 100% effective.

Should married couples that cant afford kids yet not have sex? Jeez, that would be hell on the divorce rate.

And are you saying people should double-down on irresponsibility? Or...try to correct the original accident?

This is the barely coherent and grammatically inept speech of a man who desperately wants to be able to claim that he "cured coronavirus."

That's it, in a nutshell. When we do get a handle on this crisis, he wants to be able to pull out footage and declare "I called it! I said use this! I said try this! I told them to do this, it was my idea!" He's just doing it with lots of stupid stuff because he doesnt want to miss an opportunity. He's afraid 'the big one' will be mentioned and he wont get credit for it.

It's all about declaring himself the savior of the cv crisis and we'll hear all about it, esp in his campaign. (Which is basically each of his press briefings these days) --- Lursa
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trixare4kids said:
If your moral beliefs aren't being imposed on others here, I've a bridge with oceanfront property in Barstow, CA. to sell you.

In the abortion forum, don't kid yourself, everyone is trying to impose, sell, preach their morality onto others.
Click to expand...

I asked you for examples. Let's see. A cake?

This is the barely coherent and grammatically inept speech of a man who desperately wants to be able to claim that he "cured coronavirus."

That's it, in a nutshell. When we do get a handle on this crisis, he wants to be able to pull out footage and declare "I called it! I said use this! I said try this! I told them to do this, it was my idea!" He's just doing it with lots of stupid stuff because he doesnt want to miss an opportunity. He's afraid 'the big one' will be mentioned and he wont get credit for it.

It's all about declaring himself the savior of the cv crisis and we'll hear all about it, esp in his campaign. (Which is basically each of his press briefings these days) --- Lursa
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trixare4kids said:
In most cases an act of irresponsibility led to a pregnancy.
The act of abotion doesn't erase the above irresponsibility.
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Nothing women do is irresponsible when their contraception fails or they are raped.

Why isn't her sex partner ever accused of being irresponsible instead? She did not make herself pregnant; he did it.
 
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BrotherFease said:
As you can tell, I am not a fan of the premise of the original post from the progressive poster. There's no magical connection between being pro-life/pro-choice and being pro-mask/anti-mask. The concept that mask wearing is somehow ideological or based on ones Presidential preference, seems disturbing to me.

My feeling here is that the government messed up. They should have said "wear a mask" and social distance. Shutting down the 50% of the economy proved to be devastating.
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I gave you a like because I agree with your first paragraph, and that's where it ends. When the CDC spoke during Trump's coronavirus briefings they did say to wear a mask. Heck, even today they are still saying to wear one while social distancing. The states closed down the economy. Let's keep this conversation in perspective. Trump is not against masks or social distancing even though his rabid haters will have us believe differently. If he were against this, he wouldn't have allowed people on his panel, Fauci, et all to preach to us about keeping safe. Trump is for allowing people to decide for themselves if wearing a mask is necessary. That's what freedom to choose is all about. God sustain our right to liberty!
 
I have a 'sampling' of quotes from posters re: CV 19 that show a clear hypocrisy. Many women need abortions due to financial reasons. Yet that is the primary reason that many far right or conservative posters use to rush re-opening the economy...writing off the lives of the elderly and at-risk people that would be unnecessarily lost due to the early opening. So...it appears 'pro-life' isnt 'all lives.'

Here's a few:

EMNofSeattle said:
It has nothing to do with “wanting people to die” everyone dies. Death is a natural part of life
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EMNofSeattle said:
I agree. The pansies shouldn’t be keeping everyone else from living their lives and earning a living.

We’re “saving” a relatively small number of people who are either near death already or have made poor health decisions at the expense of hundreds of millions more.
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VySky said:
Yeah, that 2/10's of 1% death rate keeps me up at night ((((((Yawn))))))
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Eriech said:
We are destroying our childrens futures to save the weak. There will be no one to care for the weak if this goes on many more weeks.
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"I got a million of 'em!"

This is the barely coherent and grammatically inept speech of a man who desperately wants to be able to claim that he "cured coronavirus."

That's it, in a nutshell. When we do get a handle on this crisis, he wants to be able to pull out footage and declare "I called it! I said use this! I said try this! I told them to do this, it was my idea!" He's just doing it with lots of stupid stuff because he doesnt want to miss an opportunity. He's afraid 'the big one' will be mentioned and he wont get credit for it.

It's all about declaring himself the savior of the cv crisis and we'll hear all about it, esp in his campaign. (Which is basically each of his press briefings these days) --- Lursa
Click to expand...
 
Blue Donkey said:
Nothing women do is irresponsible when their contraception fails or they are raped.

Why isn't her sex partner ever accused of being irresponsible instead? He always is.
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You can sugar coat it but becoming pregnant and knowing you shouldn't is an act of irresponsibility.
As to your second question, her sex partner bears equal responsibility for an unwanted pregnancy... but there again, both know going in he doesn't bear the ultimate responsibility of deciding to go forth or with the decision to end the pregnancy. It's her body, her decision, remember? Her ultimate responsibility to terminate the life growing inside her or going forth with her pregnancy.
 
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Lursa said:
I asked you for examples. Let's see. A cake?
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I don't need to give you examples when my above statement is 100% on the money.
 
trixare4kids said:
I gave you a like because I agree with your first paragraph, and that's where it ends. When the CDC spoke during Trump's coronavirus briefings they did say to wear a mask. Heck, even today they are still saying to wear one while social distancing. The states closed down the economy. Let's keep this conversation in perspective. Trump is not against masks or social distancing even though his rabid haters will have us believe differently. If he were against this, he wouldn't have allowed people on his panel, Fauci, et all to preach to us about keeping safe. Trump is for allowing people to decide for themselves if wearing a mask is necessary. That's what freedom to choose is all about. God sustain our right to liberty!
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If Donald Trump was not opposed to wearing masks, why did he repeatedly tell people NOT to wear them and always refuse to wear a mask himself?

Everyone who is educated about Trump knows he is totally opposed to wearing masks and closing any businesses that can't practice social distancing.
 
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trixare4kids said:
I don't need to give you examples when my above statement is 100% on the money.
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With no examples, it amounts to you saying, "the moon is made of green cheese."

Cool. :shrug:

This is the barely coherent and grammatically inept speech of a man who desperately wants to be able to claim that he "cured coronavirus."

That's it, in a nutshell. When we do get a handle on this crisis, he wants to be able to pull out footage and declare "I called it! I said use this! I said try this! I told them to do this, it was my idea!" He's just doing it with lots of stupid stuff because he doesnt want to miss an opportunity. He's afraid 'the big one' will be mentioned and he wont get credit for it.

It's all about declaring himself the savior of the cv crisis and we'll hear all about it, esp in his campaign. (Which is basically each of his press briefings these days) --- Lursa
Click to expand...
 
Tanngrisnir said:
No, that's what Republicans give lip service to. They've never actually been about personal responsibility and self-reliance.

It's called 'marketing' and it's designed to fool suckers, rubes and easy marks. Apparently it's working.
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No surprise that you think that you understand something that you don't...
 
Lursa said:
With no examples, it amounts to you saying, "the moon is made of green cheese."

Cool. :shrug:
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I'm sure in your world it appears like this.

Honestly, I expected better from you. Read what I wrote, and respond to that instead of resorting to the red herring fails.
 
Lursa said:
It's perfectly responsible to have an abortion. It cannot be denied...if you do, please explain how.

--There's nothing responsible about having a kid you cant afford and expecting tax payers to take up that burden with public assistance.

--There's nothing responsible about having a kid you arent emotionally prepared to have and may abuse or neglect.

--There's nothing responsible about having a kid if you know you wont stop drinking, smoking, doing drugs, etc that will damage the unborn.

--There's nothing responsible about remaining pregnant and dropping out of high school or college or missing work and not fulfilling your potential in society.

--There's nothing responsible about remaining pregnant/having a child and not being able to fulfill your other commitments and obligations to family, dependents, employer, church, community, society.

--There's nothing responsible about having a kid and giving it up for adoption when there are already over 100,000 kids in America waiting to be adopted. It means one less waiting will find a home.​
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I didn't say it was not reasonable to have an abortion...
 
trixare4kids said:
If your moral beliefs aren't being imposed on others here, I've a bridge with oceanfront property in Barstow, CA. to sell you.

In the abortion forum, don't kid yourself, everyone is trying to impose, sell, preach their morality onto others.
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trixare4kids said:
I'm sure in your world it appears like this.

Honestly, I expected better from you. Read what I wrote, and respond to that instead of resorting to the red herring fails.
Click to expand...

No thanks. It's up to you. Otherwise, everyone else can read it.

I'm good.

This is the barely coherent and grammatically inept speech of a man who desperately wants to be able to claim that he "cured coronavirus."

That's it, in a nutshell. When we do get a handle on this crisis, he wants to be able to pull out footage and declare "I called it! I said use this! I said try this! I told them to do this, it was my idea!" He's just doing it with lots of stupid stuff because he doesnt want to miss an opportunity. He's afraid 'the big one' will be mentioned and he wont get credit for it.

It's all about declaring himself the savior of the cv crisis and we'll hear all about it, esp in his campaign. (Which is basically each of his press briefings these days) --- Lursa
Click to expand...
 
Bodhisattva said:
I didn't say it was not reasonable to have an abortion...
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And I didnt address "reasonableness". I addressed responsibility.


This is the barely coherent and grammatically inept speech of a man who desperately wants to be able to claim that he "cured coronavirus."

That's it, in a nutshell. When we do get a handle on this crisis, he wants to be able to pull out footage and declare "I called it! I said use this! I said try this! I told them to do this, it was my idea!" He's just doing it with lots of stupid stuff because he doesnt want to miss an opportunity. He's afraid 'the big one' will be mentioned and he wont get credit for it.

It's all about declaring himself the savior of the cv crisis and we'll hear all about it, esp in his campaign. (Which is basically each of his press briefings these days) --- Lursa
Click to expand...
 
Blue Donkey said:
If Donald Trump was not opposed to wearing masks, why did he repeatedly tell people NOT to wear them and always refuse to wear a mask himself?

Everyone who is educated about Trump knows he is totally opposed to wearing masks and closing any businesses that can't practice social distancing.
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Link where DJT told people not to wear masks.
Trump sometimes wears a mask, but most of the time he doesn't because the people who are around him are tested every morning for covid.

I haven't seen any evidence of your being educated on the matter at hand.
 
Lursa said:
No thanks. It's up to you. Otherwise, everyone else can read it.

I'm good.
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IOWS, you have nothing.

Good night.
 
trixare4kids said:
IOWS, you have nothing.

Good night.
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Well, since it's there in bold, your words, it's your call if it's 'nothing.'

trixare4kids said:
If your moral beliefs aren't being imposed on others here, I've a bridge with oceanfront property in Barstow, CA. to sell you.

In the abortion forum, don't kid yourself, everyone is trying to impose, sell, preach their morality onto others.
Click to expand...
 
trixare4kids said:
You can sugarcoat it but becoming pregnant and knowing you shouldn't is an act of irresponsibility.

As to your second question, her sex partner bears equal responsibility for an unwanted pregnancy . . . but there again, both know going in he doesn't bear the ultimate responsibility of deciding to go forth or with the decision to end the pregnancy. It's her body, her decision, remember? Her ultimate responsibility to terminate the life growing inside her or going forth with her pregnancy.
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I am not sugarcoating anything. Republicans make this stupid claim a lot because if their goal was actually to protect every unwanted embryo's life, that would be the discussion, not whether a woman was being responsible or not when she had sex. The only reasons to call women irresponsible for having sex are a strong desire to control women and misogynistic beliefs, not a desire to save a couple hundred unspecified cells nobody except God knows about.
 
Lursa said:
And I didnt address "reasonableness" as a criteria. I addressed responsibility.
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You are right... I misread that. No idea why.

It's perfectly responsible to have an abortion. It cannot be denied...if you do, please explain how.
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I think it is fine to have an abortion... I was addressing that those that oppose it argue personal responsibility.

Lursa said:
--There's nothing responsible about having a kid you cant afford and expecting tax payers to take up that burden with public assistance.

--There's nothing responsible about having a kid you arent emotionally prepared to have and may abuse or neglect.

--There's nothing responsible about having a kid if you know you wont stop drinking, smoking, doing drugs, etc that will damage the unborn.

--There's nothing responsible about remaining pregnant and dropping out of high school or college or missing work and not fulfilling your potential in society.

--There's nothing responsible about remaining pregnant/having a child and not being able to fulfill your other commitments and obligations to family, dependents, employer, church, community, society.

--There's nothing responsible about having a kid and giving it up for adoption when there are already over 100,000 kids in America waiting to be adopted. It means one less waiting will find a home.
Click to expand...

All of this backs up their argument about personal responsibility. If one was acting according to that they would not get pregnant in the first place and if they did then they would not abort their irresponsibility.
 
Blue Donkey said:
I am not sugarcoating anything. Republicans make this stupid claim a lot because if their goal was actually to protect every unwanted embryo's life, that would be the discussion, not whether a woman was being responsible or not when she had sex. The only reasons to call women irresponsible for having sex are a strong desire to control women and misogynistic beliefs, not a desire to save a couple hundred unspecified cells nobody except God knows about.
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You've moved the goal posts in an attempt to divert what previously was discussed onto an entirely different conversation.

I'm out.
 
Blue Donkey said:
if their goal was actually to protect every unwanted embryo's life, that would be the discussion
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That is exactly what they discuss. I mean, you are 100% wrong. That is a pretty amazing feat.
 
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