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Pro-life or anti-choice?

Patriotic Voter

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If you oppose abortion, does only the objective, factual knowledge of biological human development from zygote to adult matter? Or do you think women need to be controlled by men and are too stupid to deserve bodily autonomy rights?

How smart are you about gynecology and obstetrics? Do you fully understand how women feel when they are pregnant with potential offspring that have only a 1/3 chance of being born?
 
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If you oppose abortion, does only the objective, factual knowledge of biological human development from zygote to adult matter? Or do you think women need to be controlled by men and are too stupid to deserve bodily autonomy rights?

How smart are you about gynecology and obstetrics? Do you fully understand how women feel when they are pregnant with potential offspring that have only a 1/3 chance of being born?

Anti-women, forced-birth hypocrisy is what I call it.
 
If you oppose abortion, does only the objective, factual knowledge of biological human development from zygote to adult matter? Or do you think women need to be controlled by men and are too stupid to deserve bodily autonomy rights?

I'll bet you don't support her right to control her own body either. For example, I doubt you support her right to sell sexual favors to men or to ingest whatever drugs she wants without government permission, which is equivalent to being "controlled by men" as you put it.
 
If you oppose abortion, does only the objective, factual knowledge of biological human development from zygote to adult matter? Or do you think women need to be controlled by men and are too stupid to deserve bodily autonomy rights?

How smart are you about gynecology and obstetrics? Do you fully understand how women feel when they are pregnant with potential offspring that have only a 1/3 chance of being born?

Hyperbole:

You're at a 13 right now... we could use you at a 4, maybe even a 3..
 
If you oppose abortion, does only the objective, factual knowledge of biological human development from zygote to adult matter? Or do you think women need to be controlled by men and are too stupid to deserve bodily autonomy rights?

How smart are you about gynecology and obstetrics? Do you fully understand how women feel when they are pregnant with potential offspring that have only a 1/3 chance of being born?

Let me preface my response with a declaration of my positions. First that I am Pro-Choice as shown by my record in this Forum. Second that I am also well-aware of the biological process which informs my opinions on which phases of said process allow for such a choice, and which should not.

I am also on record as to my opinion about arguing one's feelings, as opposed to rational thought.

So I am not going to argue either emotion or religion. I do argue for both individual responsibility and also individual rights.

As to individual responsibility? Individuals are responsible for their actions. The should take measures so that they do not find themselves is such situation, but if they do they must be responsible for making the right choice.

There is a Caveat: Individual Rights. Such rights can be limited by society under the rule of law to protect the lives and property of others.

Thus as to rights? It is my opinion that a woman has absolute rights to control over their own bodies, as do men. But they also have to recognize the rights of others, and in our society one of those is the right to life.

Therefore, I hold that it should be the woman's choice to abort at any time prior to the point where the developing fetus can be legally determined a "person" (human being). But at the point in it's development it is determined to be a "person," he/she should be accorded the same rights and protections as any other individual absent risk to the life of the mother.

Now an argument can be made regarding "at what point this shift occurs," and that is a different segment of the discussion. But that is not about whether a woman has a right to abort or not, as I say she does. No, it is when this choice has become one between removing an "unwanted growth," and the "killing of an unwanted child."

To point out the extreme; One could argue that since the "growth" took place inside a woman, why would a choice to "abort it" end just because it is born? After all, it remains a "burden" to the woman thereafter unless she can find some other way to get rid of it.

We know this is not a valid way of viewing the situation, as even the most extreme view allows for the declaration of "humanity" when the child is born. How then must we assume that right up UNTIL it is actually born, it remains disposable?

So while I argue a woman has the right to choose, it has a "time limit" before it cedes to the right of the unborn "child" to life.
 
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If you oppose abortion, does only the objective, factual knowledge of biological human development from zygote to adult matter? Or do you think women need to be controlled by men and are too stupid to deserve bodily autonomy rights?

How smart are you about gynecology and obstetrics? Do you fully understand how women feel when they are pregnant with potential offspring that have only a 1/3 chance of being born?

Really easy. I'm for choice, Your choice. If you don't want to have a baby, keep your pants on and the chances are slim you will conceive. If you want a baby, get with it and you likely will get pregnant. IF you don't want a baby abstinence works,. If you aren't mature enough to keep from getting pregnant you probably don't need to be having sexual relations.
 
How smart are you about gynecology and obstetrics? Do you fully understand how women feel when they are pregnant with potential offspring that have only a 1/3 chance of being born?

That is the problem with liberals, everything is about "feelings".
 
That is the problem with liberals, everything is about "feelings".

And this is the problem with conservatives. They don't know anything that can't be fit on a bumper sticker.
 
Really easy. I'm for choice, Your choice. If you don't want to have a baby, keep your pants on and the chances are slim you will conceive. If you want a baby, get with it and you likely will get pregnant. IF you don't want a baby abstinence works,. If you aren't mature enough to keep from getting pregnant you probably don't need to be having sexual relations.
Unrealistic and it fails to recognize that she has more choices than to either have sex and be willing to have a baby or don't have sex. The world is not black or white.

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I'll bet you don't support her right to control her own body either. For example, I doubt you support her right to sell sexual favors to men or to ingest whatever drugs she wants without government permission, which is equivalent to being "controlled by men" as you put it.

I fully support her right to choose between a chemical abortion and a surgical one as long as both methods are possible. Ingesting drugs without government permission is equally restrictive for men and women, so you have no equivalency argument.
 
Really easy. I'm for choice, Your choice. If you don't want to have a baby, keep your pants on and the chances are slim you will conceive. If you want a baby, get with it and you likely will get pregnant. If you don't want a baby abstinence works,. If you aren't mature enough to keep from getting pregnant you probably don't need to be having sexual relations.

Translation: Men need to control women.

Why do you oppose abortion if she does get pregnant?
 
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That is the problem with liberals, everything is about "feelings."

Anti-choicers only care about feelings. Pro-choicers only care about facts. Which side do you think liberals are on?
 
I fully support her right to choose between a chemical abortion and a surgical one as long as both methods are possible. Ingesting drugs without government permission is equally restrictive for men and women, so you have no equivalency argument.


What difference does that make? You either support a person's right to control their own body or you don't, and you obviously don't. Doesn't matter whether they are male or female.
 
What difference does that make? You either support a person's right to control their own body or you don't, and you obviously don't. Doesn't matter whether they are male or female.

We are only talking about one very specific bodily autonomy right that every pregnant American citizen has.
 
SCOTUS says that women have a certain right, regulated by the law, to make determinations about contraception and abortion.
 
We are only talking about one very specific bodily autonomy right that every pregnant American citizen has.

That's like saying you support free speech unless someone criticizes the government.

You either support the right of people to control their own bodies or you don't. It's not an a la carte menu where you can pick and choose.

Aside from that, it's ridiculously intellectually inconsistent to support a woman's right to choose to have an abortion, while defending the idea of imprisoning her over what she chooses to ingest or inhale.
 
That's like saying you support free speech unless someone criticizes the government.

You either support the right of people to control their own bodies or you don't. It's not an a la carte menu where you can pick and choose.

Aside from that, it's ridiculously intellectually inconsistent to support a woman's right to choose to have an abortion, while defending the idea of imprisoning her over what she chooses to ingest or inhale.

It is not like saying anything else. What don't you understand about the thread title?

There is no reason to say anything that is not specifically about abortion here.
 
And this is the problem with conservatives. They don't know anything that can't be fit on a bumper sticker.

Thanks for letting us all know how our bumper stickers made you "feel".


Bumper-Stickers-MA-Deport-e1388375471119.jpg
 
why would pro lifers want women under men?

Part of their "ideal" society maybe?

Though as a point, any society that routinely does such a thing as treat women like that. Are societies that don't have the luxury of lasting long.
 
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