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Thread: Debunking the "men don't get to control my body" nonsense argument

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    Re: Debunking the "men don't get to control my body" nonsense argument

    Quote Originally Posted by Media_Truth View Post
    Provide counseling, which will lead to deep thought on the part of a woman seeking an abortion. Many women aren't aware that the abortion "choice" could haunt them for life. But the choice doesn't need to be legislated. Even if Roe vs Wade would be repealed, that would open the door for different abortion laws in all the states.

    What makes you think women need counseling? Women don't need male instruction about abortion. Women are fully aware that abortion ends a potential child and there are emotional pitfalls. The cc pregnancy "counseling" centers have been established by Catholics and evangelicals to put pressure on women to carry the pregnancy to term. They do not provide neutral, informative and helpful counseling.

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    Re: Debunking the "men don't get to control my body" nonsense argument

    Quote Originally Posted by Crusader13 View Post
    What part of legislative history am I ignoring? I didn't know it was a law that men don't get to have a public opinion on abortion.
    I thought Dragonfly was pretty clear, as was I and a couple of other people at least, that mentioned that the legal system was created by, and still mostly applied by, males.
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    This seems less like palliative care and more like a last meal.
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    Re: Debunking the "men don't get to control my body" nonsense argument

    Quote Originally Posted by weaver2 View Post
    What makes you think women need counseling? Women don't need male instruction about abortion. Women are fully aware that abortion ends a potential child and there are emotional pitfalls. The cc pregnancy "counseling" centers have been established by Catholics and evangelicals to put pressure on women to carry the pregnancy to term. They do not provide neutral, informative and helpful counseling.
    I am going to say that there seem to be two "flavors" of these pregnancy centers.

    One is deceitful in tactics - including passing itself off as an actual clinic , giving false MEDICAL information , scaring women, stalling so the woman can no longer qualify for abortion.ETC.

    The other type seems much more on the up and up. More honest information - focused on showing a desperate woman how she CAN make pregnancy and motherhood work (without the deceit). They give actual help, information, and access to REAL resources.

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    Re: Debunking the "men don't get to control my body" nonsense argument

    A common pro-choice argument, especially from women, is that a man's opinion doesn't count. It's along the lines of "why is someone with a penis telling me what I can and can't do with my vagina?!" or (more sensibly) - "this is a woman's health issue - men don't get a say!".

    In truth, this is merely a hysteric appeal to sexism and self-victimization. For a start, the Left can't even define what a woman is (or is not). In theory, I could choose to identify as a woman until the end of this post, so that must mean my opinion is validated. Crazy.
    Uh, what? There is only onne definition of male and one definition of female in humans. There is only one legal definition of adult in the United States at which someone can become her own guardian. Everyone knows what a woman is.

    Second, some women have medical reasons to get abortinos. It is not an expecting mother's fault if she must choose between her own life and the unborn baby's life. Men are unable to accept this fact when they write laws that make every abortion a crime.
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    Re: Debunking the "men don't get to control my body" nonsense argument

    Quote Originally Posted by year2late View Post
    I am going to say that there seem to be two "flavors" of these pregnancy centers.

    One is deceitful in tactics - including passing itself off as an actual clinic , giving false MEDICAL information , scaring women, stalling so the woman can no longer qualify for abortion.ETC.

    The other type seems much more on the up and up. More honest information - focused on showing a desperate woman how she CAN make pregnancy and motherhood work (without the deceit). They give actual help, information, and access to REAL resources.
    There are some honest, kind and truly helpful clinics not driven by a religious agenda. Most regrettably though the majority of the 2,500 Crisis Pregnancy Centers are affiliated with the conservative christian and Catholic anti-abortion movement and are funded by some of the more aggressive and less scrupulous anti-abortion organizations.

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    Re: Debunking the "men don't get to control my body" nonsense argument

    Quote Originally Posted by Crusader13 View Post
    This was recently bought up in another thread, but I thought it deserved its own as a separate issue.

    A common pro-choice argument, especially from women, is that a man's opinion doesn't count. It's along the lines of "why is someone with a penis telling me what I can and can't do with my vagina?!" or (more sensibly) - "this is a woman's health issue - men don't get a say!".

    In truth, this is merely a hysteric appeal to sexism and self-victimization. For a start, the Left can't even define what a woman is (or is not). In theory, I could choose to identify as a woman until the end of this post, so that must mean my opinion is validated. Crazy.

    Second, this would be no different to other groups playing the same card. Should only gun owners get a say on gun laws? Should only religious people get a say on religious discrimination laws? Should we ban women from becoming prostate or penal doctors, or contributing to medical journals about these male-exclusive conditions? Of course, this would be asinine. It is no different to say men should not get a say on abortion. It's unfounded nonsense.

    Lastly, and most importantly - if we polled all of the women in the world, the overwhelming majority would be against abortion anyway. Admittedly, this is because of the huge populace in ultra-Conservative or traditional societies, such as Africa, the Middle East, Indigenous tribes etc. But even if we just stick to the U.S, there are no big differences in views on abortion between men and women. In other words, women are just as likely to oppose abortion as men are.

    In fact, women are sometimes more likely to oppose abortion than men are. Sources are here, here, and here. So when men oppose abortion, they are not doing so from a position of privilege or because their penis is misinforming them about women's issues. Women often have the exact same opposition to abortion so clearly it's a valid one.
    I'm a dude. IMO, the more abortions the merrier. We need to normalize the procedure, make it as mundane as a tummy tuck or nose job.
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    Re: Debunking the "men don't get to control my body" nonsense argument

    Quote Originally Posted by Crusader13 View Post
    This was recently bought up in another thread, but I thought it deserved its own as a separate issue.

    A common pro-choice argument, especially from women, is that a man's opinion doesn't count. It's along the lines of "why is someone with a penis telling me what I can and can't do with my vagina?!" or (more sensibly) - "this is a woman's health issue - men don't get a say!".

    In truth, this is merely a hysteric appeal to sexism and self-victimization. For a start, the Left can't even define what a woman is (or is not). In theory, I could choose to identify as a woman until the end of this post, so that must mean my opinion is validated. Crazy.

    Second, this would be no different to other groups playing the same card. Should only gun owners get a say on gun laws? Should only religious people get a say on religious discrimination laws? Should we ban women from becoming prostate or penal doctors, or contributing to medical journals about these male-exclusive conditions? Of course, this would be asinine. It is no different to say men should not get a say on abortion. It's unfounded nonsense.

    Lastly, and most importantly - if we polled all of the women in the world, the overwhelming majority would be against abortion anyway. Admittedly, this is because of the huge populace in ultra-Conservative or traditional societies, such as Africa, the Middle East, Indigenous tribes etc. But even if we just stick to the U.S, there are no big differences in views on abortion between men and women. In other words, women are just as likely to oppose abortion as men are.

    In fact, women are sometimes more likely to oppose abortion than men are. Sources are here, here, and here. So when men oppose abortion, they are not doing so from a position of privilege or because their penis is misinforming them about women's issues. Women often have the exact same opposition to abortion so clearly it's a valid one.
    Truly the stupidest thing I’ve seen all day, and that includes reading one of mashmont’s posts.
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    Re: Debunking the "men don't get to control my body" nonsense argument

    The canard of the attack of "this is merely a hysteric appeal to sexism and self-victimization" to "my body, my choice" is nonsense.

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    Re: Debunking the "men don't get to control my body" nonsense argument

    Quote Originally Posted by weaver2 View Post
    What makes you think women need counseling? Women don't need male instruction about abortion. Women are fully aware that abortion ends a potential child and there are emotional pitfalls. The cc pregnancy "counseling" centers have been established by Catholics and evangelicals to put pressure on women to carry the pregnancy to term. They do not provide neutral, informative and helpful counseling.
    "Emotional pitfall" is very subjective. Some women can experience heartwrenching emotional pain for the rest of their lives. BTW, even though I don't think abortion is a political issue, there is nothing wrong with carrying a pregnancy to term. I'm a male, but I know how horrible I felt from holding my dog, while the vet euthanized her with an injection. I was a basket case for 2 days, and that was an animal!

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    Re: Debunking the "men don't get to control my body" nonsense argument

    Quote Originally Posted by Media_Truth View Post
    "Emotional pitfall" is very subjective. Some women can experience heartwrenching emotional pain for the rest of their lives. BTW, even though I don't think abortion is a political issue, there is nothing wrong with carrying a pregnancy to term. I'm a male, but I know how horrible I felt from holding my dog, while the vet euthanized her with an injection. I was a basket case for 2 days, and that was an animal!
    And yet you held you dog ,while the vet etthanized her an injection because you understood that was best option for you and her at the time.
    When it comes to matters of Reproductive health, Politicians and the religious dogma of another faith should never interfere with religious liberty of an individual or her faith.

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