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Planned Parenthood awarded $2M in lawsuit against hidden camera activists

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nota bene

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From The Hill:

A federal jury in San Francisco found that the anti-abortion group Center for Medical Progress and its president, David Daleiden, broke multiple state and federal laws when they secretly recorded and released videos of Planned Parenthood employees.

The jury awarded Planned Parenthood $2 million in damages, finding that Daleiden and his organization engaged in fraud, trespassing and illegal secret recording. Planned Parenthood awarded $2M in lawsuit against hidden camera activists | TheHill

This will be appealed: Thomas More Society Will Fight Multimillion Dollar RICO Judgment in David Daleiden’s Baby Body Parts Expose Trial | Thomas More Society
 
nota bene said:
From The Hill:

A federal jury in San Francisco found that the anti-abortion group Center for Medical Progress and its president, David Daleiden, broke multiple state and federal laws when they secretly recorded and released videos of Planned Parenthood employees.

The jury awarded Planned Parenthood $2 million in damages, finding that Daleiden and his organization engaged in fraud, trespassing and illegal secret recording. Planned Parenthood awarded $2M in lawsuit against hidden camera activists | TheHill

This will be appealed: Thomas More Society Will Fight Multimillion Dollar RICO Judgment in David Daleiden’s Baby Body Parts Expose Trial | Thomas More Society
Click to expand...

Congrats to the jury.
 
nota bene said:
From The Hill:

A federal jury in San Francisco found that the anti-abortion group Center for Medical Progress and its president, David Daleiden, broke multiple state and federal laws when they secretly recorded and released videos of Planned Parenthood employees.

The jury awarded Planned Parenthood $2 million in damages, finding that Daleiden and his organization engaged in fraud, trespassing and illegal secret recording. Planned Parenthood awarded $2M in lawsuit against hidden camera activists | TheHill

This will be appealed: Thomas More Society Will Fight Multimillion Dollar RICO Judgment in David Daleiden’s Baby Body Parts Expose Trial | Thomas More Society
Click to expand...

Lawyers will get richer

Are donations to the Thomas Moore Society a not for profit tax deductible in the US?
 
nota bene said:
From The Hill:

A federal jury in San Francisco found that the anti-abortion group Center for Medical Progress and its president, David Daleiden, broke multiple state and federal laws when they secretly recorded and released videos of Planned Parenthood employees.

The jury awarded Planned Parenthood $2 million in damages, finding that Daleiden and his organization engaged in fraud, trespassing and illegal secret recording. Planned Parenthood awarded $2M in lawsuit against hidden camera activists | TheHill

This will be appealed: Thomas More Society Will Fight Multimillion Dollar RICO Judgment in David Daleiden’s Baby Body Parts Expose Trial | Thomas More Society
Click to expand...

Works for me.
 
nota bene said:
From The Hill:

A federal jury in San Francisco found that the anti-abortion group Center for Medical Progress and its president, David Daleiden, broke multiple state and federal laws when they secretly recorded and released videos of Planned Parenthood employees.

The jury awarded Planned Parenthood $2 million in damages, finding that Daleiden and his organization engaged in fraud, trespassing and illegal secret recording. Planned Parenthood awarded $2M in lawsuit against hidden camera activists | TheHill

This will be appealed: Thomas More Society Will Fight Multimillion Dollar RICO Judgment in David Daleiden’s Baby Body Parts Expose Trial | Thomas More Society
Click to expand...

There is no point in rubbing Americas nose in its baby parts industry. Secrecy is best for society. But at the very least The mother should get a cut of the sale. Someone needs to read the contract the woman has to sign.
 
chuckiechan said:
There is no point in rubbing Americas nose in its baby parts industry. Secrecy is best for society. But at the very least The mother should get a cut of the sale. Someone needs to read the contract the woman has to sign.
Click to expand...

I'm just not able to be flippant about this. The casual and cavalier restaurant discussions are so horrifying, and yet some deny what was going on. The issue in this court trial was the legality of the recordings, not of the conversations themselves. And these are what they are. Appalling.
 
nota bene said:
I'm just not able to be flippant about this. The casual and cavalier restaurant discussions are so horrifying, and yet some deny what was going on. The issue in this court trial was the legality of the recordings, not of the conversations themselves. And these are what they are. Appalling.
Click to expand...

You have to understand this is California, leader of the race to the bottom of humanity. And yes, the mother should get paid. She’s not a cow giving milk. She is a human being paying to have her baby removed to be sold as tissue in the marketplace.
 
nota bene said:
From The Hill:

A federal jury in San Francisco found that the anti-abortion group Center for Medical Progress and its president, David Daleiden, broke multiple state and federal laws when they secretly recorded and released videos of Planned Parenthood employees.

The jury awarded Planned Parenthood $2 million in damages, finding that Daleiden and his organization engaged in fraud, trespassing and illegal secret recording. Planned Parenthood awarded $2M in lawsuit against hidden camera activists | TheHill

This will be appealed: Thomas More Society Will Fight Multimillion Dollar RICO Judgment in David Daleiden’s Baby Body Parts Expose Trial | Thomas More Society
Click to expand...

Excellent news. Always happy to see anti-abortion fanatics get slapped down like the rabid dogs they truly are.
 
nota bene said:
I'm just not able to be flippant about this. The casual and cavalier restaurant discussions are so horrifying, and yet some deny what was going on. The issue in this court trial was the legality of the recordings, not of the conversations themselves. And these are what they are. Appalling.
Click to expand...

One caveat: the edited and manipulated conversations. If I produce a video that says "I believe you" - when what was actually said was, "I don't believe you", but you edited out the negative parts, is that accurate? In this case statement was, "we don't sell body parts, that's illegal and immoral." It kinda makes a difference, don't you think?
 
U.S. Fifth Circuit of Appeals use of the videos: http://www.ca5.uscourts.gov/opinions/pub/17/17-50282-CV0.pdf

For those interested:

B. Undercover Videos and Ensuing Investigations, page 4

"Much of the evidentiary hearing consisted of review and analysis of clips from the CMP videos. The agency focused on evidence that PPGC had violated federal regulations relating to fetal tissue research by altering abortion procedures for research purposes or allowing the researchers themselves to be involved in performing abortions to harvest their preferred tissue samples." See bottom of page 7/top of page 8

The court refers to the plaintiffs' witnesses' "self-serving testimony about their videotaped statements, while asymmetrically refusing to consider OIG’s post-termination evidence," page 17.

See 2. Arbitrary and Capricious Review page 22.

[Bolding mine below]:

In any event, there is no question that the OIG here made factual findings after viewing the videos and related evidence. On the basis of the administrative record—not the post hoc justifications offered by plaintiffs’ witnesses in the district court—the OIG determined that video discussions “centered on clinic processes and tissue packaging rather than the abortion procedure itself; the video featured repeated discussion about the position of the fetus in the uterus, the risk to the patient, and the patient’s pain tolerance.” The OIG further concluded, based on the videos, that the Provider Plaintiffs at a minimum violated federal standards regarding fetal tissue research and standards of medical ethics by allowing doctors to alter abortion procedures to retrieve tissue for research purposes or allowing the researchers themselves to perform the procedures. The plaintiffs’ briefing with regard to the substance of the discussions contained in the videos (as opposed to their trial witnesses’ post hoc justifications) is curiously silent. See bottom of page 27/top of page 28.
 
nota bene said:
I'm just not able to be flippant about this. The casual and cavalier restaurant discussions are so horrifying, and yet some deny what was going on. The issue in this court trial was the legality of the recordings, not of the conversations themselves. And these are what they are. Appalling.
Click to expand...

So you think the altered video tapes were cut in a way that lead to an accurate view?

BTW, wasn't this legally investigated and it was clearly found to be no evidence of sale ….only transactions for the "shipping and handling" (so to speak)

If you have any evidence that there was actual sale and not just fees for handling of tissue - I am very open to hearing what you have.

Also....I am curious. Do you rail against IVF centers this hard? How many embryos have been discarded as a normal part of the process? And with all the talk of some posters about eugenics...many embryos are discarded during genetic screenings. Where is the fight on those issues?
 
Tanngrisnir said:
Excellent news. Always happy to see anti-abortion fanatics get slapped down like the rabid dogs they truly are.
Click to expand...

The funny thing is that I respect their position of when they believe life begins and how they value the fetus as having the same or similar rights to the woman. I may not agree, but I can respect it.

What I do not respect is the lies. I do not respect the sites like LifeSiteNews that on a regular basis post information that has been proven to be false or from people who are paid bounties for their information. I do not respect individuals like Abby Johnson that has lied so many times about her service with Planned Parenthood that it makes my head spin.

I do not respect putting out there heavily edited video that skews the information within the video.

What is wrong with presenting the truth in a straightforward and honest manner?

I have always said that the sensationalist comments, slut shaming, and fingerwagging and such will never make a huge difference in abortion rates. It ignores the TRUTH. Women do not have abortions because of trivial inconveniences They have an abortion mostly because they have real life fears. Yeah being pregnant and not being able to support yourself or lacking proper health care is inconvenient. Can be pretty friggen scary as well!

That is why I think the BEST way (the way that the rabid pro-lifers rarely stress) to decrease abortion is improving the safety, affordability, and accessibility of the most effective contraceptives. Currently the group most at risk for abortion - too rich for Medicaid too poor for insurance - the working poor do not qualify for low or no cost long term contraception. The price tag of 800 to 1000 dollars means rent doesn't get paid.

It is easier to prevent an abortion via long term contraception than prevent an abortion with a woman who is already stressed and worried about how being pregnant could lead to unemployment or underemployment or housing insecurity.
 
nota bene said:
I'm just not able to be flippant about this. The casual and cavalier restaurant discussions are so horrifying, and yet some deny what was going on. The issue in this court trial was the legality of the recordings, not of the conversations themselves. And these are what they are. Appalling.
Click to expand...

/Thread

The lawsuit win and award (that I agree is an appeal in the making) only speaks to the method and legality of the recordings but the findings are not removed from the debate at all.

We still get to have a conversation on Planned Parenthood intentions, even in the absence of an actual monetary exchange between Planned Parenthood and those taking the recordings.
 
chuckiechan said:
There is no point in rubbing Americas nose in its baby parts industry. Secrecy is best for society. But at the very least The mother should get a cut of the sale. Someone needs to read the contract the woman has to sign.
Click to expand...

There is no "baby parts industry". Good grief.
 
chuckiechan said:
You have to understand this is California, leader of the race to the bottom of humanity. And yes, the mother should get paid. She’s not a cow giving milk. She is a human being paying to have her baby removed to be sold as tissue in the marketplace.
Click to expand...

Stop lying. No tissue is being sold. Do people who donate organs get paid? No. Then why should women who donate fetal tissue get paid?
 
chuckiechan said:
There is no point in rubbing Americas nose in its baby parts industry. Secrecy is best for society. But at the very least The mother should get a cut of the sale. Someone needs to read the contract the woman has to sign.
Click to expand...

tenor.gif
 
OrphanSlug said:
/Thread

The lawsuit win and award (that I agree is an appeal in the making) only speaks to the method and legality of the recordings but the findings are not removed from the debate at all.

We still get to have a conversation on Planned Parenthood intentions, even in the absence of an actual monetary exchange between Planned Parenthood and those taking the recordings.
Click to expand...

Its just a warning to others not to mess with Planned Parenthood. The state of California has their back.
 
year2late said:
So you think the altered video tapes were cut in a way that lead to an accurate view?

BTW, wasn't this legally investigated and it was clearly found to be no evidence of sale ….only transactions for the "shipping and handling" (so to speak)

If you have any evidence that there was actual sale and not just fees for handling of tissue - I am very open to hearing what you have.

Also....I am curious. Do you rail against IVF centers this hard? How many embryos have been discarded as a normal part of the process? And with all the talk of some posters about eugenics...many embryos are discarded during genetic screenings. Where is the fight on those issues?
Click to expand...

The issue I was identifying was the utility of the videos in court. They were used in court.

As for your purity test, I reject it as the red herring/whataboutism it is. If you begin a thread on IVF, perhaps I will participate in it or on one whose topic is eugenics. Or not. These aren’t the topic of this thread, and the discarding of embryos during genetic screening is not comparable to tissue procurement and/or sales following abortion.
 
It is difficult for some people, when they have definitive and adamant views on a subject, to approach any aspect of it with any level of objectivity. Such is often the case with abortion. In such a circumstance, it is often advisable to refrain from commenting on the subject lest those biases become manifest. There are a number of topics on the forum that fall into this category, yet... the same people will post the same things over and over again. That is not debate, in my view, and it clogs up the actual discussion.
 
nota bene said:
The issue I was identifying was the utility of the videos in court. They were used in court.
Click to expand...
Where did you identify this issue? I missed it. I'd like to follow up on that point, if you can point me to it. Thanks.
 
posted by nota bene: In any event, there is no question that the OIG (Office of the Inspector General of CA) here made factual findings after viewing the videos and related evidence. .....The OIG further concluded, based on the videos, that the Provider Plaintiffs at a minimum violated federal standards regarding fetal tissue research and standards of medical ethics by allowing doctors to alter abortion procedures to retrieve tissue for research purposes or allowing the researchers themselves to perform the procedures.
Click to expand...

NWRatCon said:
You could at least have quoted from a reliable source. ;)
Click to expand...

Some background on Daleiden and his organization Center for Medical Progress from the House Committee on Oversight and Reform, chm, Elijah Cummings.
(Planned Parenthood: Fact v. Fiction | House Committee on Oversight and Reform)

Claim:
Daleiden runs a non-profit biomedical organization.
• “The Center for Medical Progressis a non-profit organization dedicated to informing and educating both the lay public and the scientific community about the latest advances in regenerative medicine cell-based therapies, and related disciplines.”[34]
Facts:
Daleiden created the Center for Medical Progress in 2013 with the sole purpose of entrapping Planned Parenthood.
• Daleiden began working with anti-abortion extremist Troy Newman in 2012 on a plan to “infiltrate Planned Parenthood.” According to Newman, they planned to create “alternate identities” and “[a]lternate companies,” and they called themselves the Center for Medical Progress because “t is one of these vague-sounding names, but it could mean many things.” [35]
• In materials submitted with Daleiden’s 2013 application for 501(c)(3) tax-exempt status, the “pecific purpose” of the Center for Medical Progress is described as follows: “to monitor and report on medical ethics and advances.”[36]
• Daleiden listed on his application for tax-exempt status the Center’s website which described itself as “a non-profit organization dedicated to informing and educating both the lay public and the scientific community about the latest advances in regenerative medicine.”[37]
• The IRS granted Daleiden’s request for tax-exempt status as a “bioengineering or biomedicine” charitable organization based on the misleading information he provided.[38]
• Daleiden pledged in his application for tax-exempt status not to “attempt to influence legislation.” Accompanying materials stated that “[n]o substantial part of the activities of the corporation shall consist of carrying on propaganda, or otherwise attempting to influence legislation.”[39]
• The Center is now engaged in a full-fledged lobbying effort to pass legislation to withhold federal funds from Planned Parenthood.[40]

Daleiden is a liar. He's dishonest. He's willing to break laws that get in his way. He claims he is exempt from laws because he is an investigative reporter.
Claim:
Daleiden’s activities were appropriate because he is an investigative journalist.
• “The goal of this project—which was a two and a half year investigative journalism study—was to really clearly document and illustrate for the public exactly how Planned Parenthood harvests and sells aborted baby parts.”[41]
Facts:
Daleiden’s tactics are potentially criminal—not the actions of a responsible investigative journalist.
• Daleiden never indicated he was a “journalist” until he released undercover videos and faced questions about the legality of his actions. Fox News reported that the tactics of Daleiden and his associates “would probably get them fired in most newsrooms.”[42]
• Daleiden and his associates apparently filed official paperwork with the State of California to create a sham tissue procurement company called BioMax Procurement Services LLC.[43]
• Daleiden and his associates apparently used fake identification to pose as representatives from BioMax—reportedly even going so far as to assume the identity of a former high school classmate of Daleiden’s.[44]
• Daleiden secretly recorded Planned Parenthood personnel and other individuals over the course of three years without their consent and in possible violation of state invasion of privacy laws.[45]

All of these facts are referenced. The references are given at the end of the report from the House Committee on Oversight and Reform (Planned Parenthood: Fact v. Fiction | House Committee on Oversight and Reform

in addition to the California court case and the House committee findings Texas and 23 other states conducted investigations into Planned Parenthood and declared Daleiden's videos to be highly edited and his accusation to be lies.
 
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