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Thread: “The abortion rate was lower ... where more women live under liberal abortion laws.”

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    “The abortion rate was lower ... where more women live under liberal abortion laws.”

    Interesting opinion piece.

    Here is the fact that everyone debating abortion should know: there is no association between its legality and its incidence. In other words, banning abortion does not stop the practice; it merely makes it more dangerous.

    The abortion debate is presented as a conflict between the rights of foetuses and the rights of women. Enhance one, both sides sometimes appear to agree, and you suppress the other. But once you grasp the fact that legalising womens reproductive rights does not raise the incidence of abortions, only one issue remains to be debated: should they be legal and safe or illegal and dangerous? Hmm tough question.

    There might be no causal relationship between reproductive choice and the incidence of abortion, but there is a strong correlation: an inverse one. As the Lancets most recent survey of global rates and trends notes: The abortion rate was lower ... where more women live under liberal abortion laws.
    Who’s driving high abortion rates? It’s the religious right | George Monbiot | Opinion | The Guardian

    This article inforces what I have been saying all along. Availablity ,financial accessibility , and safety improvements to contraception (especially long term forms) are a huge key in greatly reducing abortion rates. Similar plans for long term contraception for men would make that number drop even further.

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    Re: “The abortion rate was lower ... where more women live under liberal abortion laws.”

    Very interesting article.

    Fortunately, they wont be able to make having an abortion illegal in America. Even if they limit the procedure in certain states, there will be states that provide it. And lots of donor $$ taken from those states to help the women that need to travel.


    But yes...good confirmation that shows that making abortion illegal only punishes women, driving them to other locations and more dangerous procedures, and doesnt protect the unborn significantly more. OTOH sadly, I'm pretty sure that's just fine with a great number of pro-life supporters.
    Quote Originally Posted by code1211 View Post
    This seems less like palliative care and more like a last meal.
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    You can think that I am stupid all you want. It won't stop me from being racist.
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    Parrots of the Caribbean For Abortion!
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    A murderer putting a bullet through someone's brain is a medical procedure too.

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    Re: “The abortion rate was lower ... where more women live under liberal abortion laws.”

    LOL, what do I post all the time?

    Young people have sex, whatever their elders say – they always have, and always will. Those with the least information and the least access to birth control are the most likely to suffer unintended pregnancies. And what greater incentive could there be for terminating a pregnancy than a culture in which reproduction out of wedlock is a mortal sin?

    Who’s driving high abortion rates? It’s the religious right | George Monbiot | Opinion | The Guardian
    IMO In general, the religious right really is just more interested in punishing women who's behavior they disapprove of, rather than actually protecting the unborn. And this article reinforces that observation.
    Last edited by Lursa; 07-19-19 at 10:54 PM.
    Quote Originally Posted by code1211 View Post
    This seems less like palliative care and more like a last meal.
    Quote Originally Posted by Wan View Post
    You can think that I am stupid all you want. It won't stop me from being racist.
    Quote Originally Posted by Angel View Post
    Parrots of the Caribbean For Abortion!
    Quote Originally Posted by applejuicefool View Post
    A murderer putting a bullet through someone's brain is a medical procedure too.

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    Re: “The abortion rate was lower ... where more women live under liberal abortion laws.”

    Quote Originally Posted by Lursa View Post
    LOL, what do I post all the time?



    IMO In general, the religious right really is just more interested in punishing women who's behavior they disapprove of, rather than actually protecting the unborn. And this article reinforces that observation.
    And from that same article....

    Facts – who needs ’em? Across the red states of the US, legislators have been merrily passing laws that make abortion clinics impossible to run while denying children effective sex education. In Texas, thanks to restrictive new statutes, over half the clinics have closed since 2013. But women are still obliged to visit three times before receiving treatment: in some cases this means travelling 1,000 miles or more. Unsurprisingly, 7% of those seeking medical help have already attempted their own solutions.

    The only reason why this has not caused an epidemic of abdominal trauma is the widespread availability, through unlicensed sales, of abortion drugs such as misoprostol and mifepristone. They’re unsafe when used without professional advice, but not as unsafe as coat hangers and household chemicals.
    I have been saying this for years. If for some fluke reason RVW is overturned abortions will still occur - and possibly increase. Abortion pills will become widely available. And the places where abortion clinics were nowhere in sight....well a drug pusher will be in sight - and more than happy to pick up the slack.

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    Re: “The abortion rate was lower ... where more women live under liberal abortion laws.”

    Today the US has one the lowest abortion rates of countries with legal abortions even though in many Countries in Europe limit abortions to the first trimester.

    The rate in the United States in 2014 is lower than Sweden, Norway, Denmark , France, the United Kingdom and Canada.

    (Please note * The following chart only lists legal abortions.)

    Percentage of pregnancies aborted by country (listed by percentage)
    When it comes to matters of Reproductive health, Politicians and the religious dogma of another faith should never interfere with religious liberty of an individual or her faith.

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    Re: “The abortion rate was lower ... where more women live under liberal abortion laws.”

    Quote Originally Posted by minnie616 View Post
    Today the US has one the lowest abortion rates of countries with legal abortions even though in many Countries in Europe limit abortions to the first trimester.

    The rate in the United States in 2014 is lower than Sweden, Norway, Denmark , France, the United Kingdom and Canada.

    (Please note * The following chart only lists legal abortions.)

    Percentage of pregnancies aborted by country (listed by percentage)
    Thanks Minnie.

    Should abortions become illegal in this country...I think actual numbers of abortions will increase. We already have many on the pro-life side calling many forms of contraception "abortofacient" which in the atmosphere that allowed abortion to be made illegal...how far away from illegality could those methods be?

    The fact is that people have been having sex both in and outside of marriage without desire to procreate for eons. Taking away a methods of contraception will of course lead to more abortions (whether legal or illegal). In fact putting a woman under time pressure (if she is going black market abortion pills) may push her to abort without having time to think how things could work out if she became pregnant - leading to even more abortions.

    I think it would come to pass that it will be easier to obtain abortion in a post legal abortion world. Today abortion facilities are not in close proximity to many Americans....but I will bet there are drug pushers much, much closer (hint ask high schoolers) Will they be safer? Well, no. But pregnant women will risk this because they do not have abortions for trivial inconvenience. The abort because of fear for how they will support themselves before and after pregnancy. The fear job and housing loss. They fear inability to reach out of poverty. They fear inability to support their born children. They fear lack of decent medical care. Those inconveniences are not trivial.

    Yeah, do away with Planned Parenthood and "abortofacient" drugs and make abortion illegal. See how it works out for your cause.

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    Re: “The abortion rate was lower ... where more women live under liberal abortion laws.”

    Quote Originally Posted by year2late View Post
    Thanks Minnie.

    Should abortions become illegal in this country...I think actual numbers of abortions will increase. We already have many on the pro-life side calling many forms of contraception "abortofacient" which in the atmosphere that allowed abortion to be made illegal...how far away from illegality could those methods be?

    The fact is that people have been having sex both in and outside of marriage without desire to procreate for eons. Taking away a methods of contraception will of course lead to more abortions (whether legal or illegal). In fact putting a woman under time pressure (if she is going black market abortion pills) may push her to abort without having time to think how things could work out if she became pregnant - leading to even more abortions.

    I think it would come to pass that it will be easier to obtain abortion in a post legal abortion world. Today abortion facilities are not in close proximity to many Americans....but I will bet there are drug pushers much, much closer (hint ask high schoolers) Will they be safer? Well, no. But pregnant women will risk this because they do not have abortions for trivial inconvenience. The abort because of fear for how they will support themselves before and after pregnancy. The fear job and housing loss. They fear inability to reach out of poverty. They fear inability to support their born children. They fear lack of decent medical care. Those inconveniences are not trivial.

    Yeah, do away with Planned Parenthood and "abortofacient" drugs and make abortion illegal. See how it works out for your cause.
    The Christian Right is intensely interested in controlling abortion. Should they succeeded in getting Roe v Wade overturned abortion will go underground and control will be impossible. Anyone could become an abortion provider. There will be someone ready to perform an abortion, at any time in the pregnancy, in every city and town in the US. The horrors of Dr. Gosnell's clinic will be multiplied a thousand fold.

    If controlled and regulated abortion is you goal you better be campaigning to keep it legal not trying to ban it.

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    Re: “The abortion rate was lower ... where more women live under liberal abortion laws.”

    Quote Originally Posted by weaver2 View Post
    The Christian Right is intensely interested in controlling abortion. Should they succeeded in getting Roe v Wade overturned abortion will go underground and control will be impossible. Anyone could become an abortion provider. There will be someone ready to perform an abortion, at any time in the pregnancy, in every city and town in the US. The horrors of Dr. Gosnell's clinic will be multiplied a thousand fold.

    If controlled and regulated abortion is you goal you better be campaigning to keep it legal not trying to ban it.
    I think it will be easier than that. The abortion pills will be available .....the feds will spend billions trying to play whack a mole with pushers providing these pills. Abortions will be cheaper, more available...but less safe. All these little towns without a Planned Parenthood or other abortion clinic.....they will have a drug pusher happy to provide for the woman in need. I have no doubt that men will take advantage of this as well...to dose their unsuspecting knocked up girlfriends.

    Since these pills are only supposed to be used up to 9 weeks....my guess is that many women will jump the gun and take the pills before they really have had time to see a way to stay pregnant.

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    Re: “The abortion rate was lower ... where more women live under liberal abortion laws.”

    Quote Originally Posted by weaver2 View Post
    The Christian Right is intensely interested in controlling abortion. Should they succeeded in getting Roe v Wade overturned abortion will go underground and control will be impossible. Anyone could become an abortion provider. There will be someone ready to perform an abortion, at any time in the pregnancy, in every city and town in the US. The horrors of Dr. Gosnell's clinic will be multiplied a thousand fold.

    If controlled and regulated abortion is you goal you better be campaigning to keep it legal not trying to ban it.
    I think it will be easier than that. The abortion pills will be available .....the feds will spend billions trying to play whack a mole with pushers providing these pills. Abortions will be cheaper, more available...but less safe. All these little towns without a Planned Parenthood or other abortion clinic.....they will have a drug pusher happy to provide for the woman in need. I have no doubt that men will take advantage of this as well...to dose their unsuspecting knocked up girlfriends.

    Since these pills are only supposed to be used up to 9 weeks....my guess is that many women will jump the gun and take the pills before they really have had time to see a way to stay pregnant.

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