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[W: 594] A great question for pro abortion types

Re: A great question for pro abortion types

Logical1 said:
The question is-----------if the baby aborted is not human, why are organs being harvested from them. That doesnt seem to compute.

Any logical comments?
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It's human.

It's not "a human".

And even if it were "a human", killing it would STILL be ethical.
 
Re: A great question for pro abortion types

Gaius46 said:
When a fetus becomes human is subject to lots of debate and generates much more heat than light. From my standpoint the question is irrelevant. You simply cannot force a woman to use her body to support a fetus, whether human or not, anymore than you can force her to donate an organ or take a bullet for someone.
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Nope, fallacious logic there. Of course you can force her. SHE started it.
 
Re: A great question for pro abortion types

smallvoice said:
Nope, fallacious logic there. Of course you can force her. SHE started it.
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Of course? You say that like it’s a self evident truth. I see no “of course” here. What I do see is a lack of a cogent refutation of my argument.

So she had sex. So what? Why does that give you the right to control her body?
 
Re: A great question for pro abortion types

smallvoice said:
Nope, fallacious logic there. Of course you can force her. SHE started it.
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Where is that covered in the Constitution? The use of force without due process to violate someone's bodily sovereignty? Not to mention the violation of her other Constitutional rights?
 
Re: A great question for pro abortion types

Gaius46 said:
Of course? You say that like it’s a self evident truth. I see no “of course” here. What I do see is a lack of a cogent refutation of my argument.

So she had sex. So what? Why does that give you the right to control her body?
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This seems to be a pattern.
 
Re: A great question for pro abortion types

Logical1 said:
The question is-----------if the baby aborted is not human, why are organs being harvested from them. That doesnt seem to compute.

Any logical comments?
Click to expand...

Due to a shortage of donors, intense research is being done to use animal organs, most specifically from pigs and their hearts. It is claimed the threshold has been broken, but is not sufficiently proven yet.

If it becomes possible, will you claim pigs are human and all pork products must be outlawed as cannibalism?

No one - not one person - disputes that a homo sapien fetus is a homo sapien fetus.

Do you claim turning off artificial support for someone who is brain dead is 1st degree murder?
 
Re: A great question for pro abortion types

No, but it REQUIRES that she accept the outcome of her choice.
 
Re: A great question for pro abortion types

smallvoice said:
No, but it REQUIRES that she accept the outcome of her choice.
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Who says?

Obviously, that's not true, since the govt does not force that on women.
 
Re: A great question for pro abortion types

smallvoice said:
No, but it REQUIRES that she accept the outcome of her choice.
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The most common outcome of an elective abortion is the feeling of relief.

In cases where the pregnancy was wanted and something went terribly medically wrong of course grief would most likely be the outcome. Grief because the parents had looked forward to a healthy addition to their family which was not possible due to medical problem.
 
Re: A great question for pro abortion types

smallvoice said:
Sorry, I'm not giving Biology lessons.
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Who the **** asked you to?
Had difficulty understanding the simple question. Have someone with basic reading skills explain it to you.
 
Re: A great question for pro abortion types

No thanks, I have that covered. I'm not so sure about you.
 
Re: A great question for pro abortion types

smallvoice said:
No, but it REQUIRES that she accept the outcome of her choice.
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Seriously? Think about that for a minute. Almost everything we do comes with potential outcomes we don’t like and yet we don’t tell people they can’t deal realized undesirable outcomes.

I ride motorcycles. I accept the risk inherent in riding them. Accepting the risk does not mean I can’t get treatment for road rash if I fall while riding.
 
Re: A great question for pro abortion types

So she is responsible for carrying it to term, or forever be branded a murderer. HER choice.
 
Re: A great question for pro abortion types

smallvoice said:
So she is responsible for carrying it to term, or forever be branded a murderer. HER choice.
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Or of not listening to religious fanatics tell her what she is. Also her choice.
 
Re: A great question for pro abortion types

Hamish Howl said:
Or of not listening to religious fanatics tell her what she is. Also her choice.
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What if religion has NOTHING to do with it (and 99.99% of my position doesn't)? It's ETHICS, something you Socialists know NOTHING about.
If she "chooses" she can kill it. Not a speck of ethics in that choice, but that's what you understand and embrace.
 
Re: A great question for pro abortion types

smallvoice said:
What if religion has NOTHING to do with it (and 99.99% of my position doesn't)? It's ETHICS, something you Socialists know NOTHING about.
If she "chooses" she can kill it. Not a speck of ethics in that choice, but that's what you understand and embrace.
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How do you know there is not a speck of ethics in that choice?

So.. my patient has a rare genetic issue that can get inherited by their children. IF they inherit the gene.. sometimes the baby can make it to almost full term. but they will need to be taken by cesarean and will be on breathing tubes feeding tube, etc.. and have basically no chance of survival beyond a few days or maybe a weak or to with extra ordinary measure being taken by the hospital. She had one child go through that.

To her it was horrible watching her child suffer like that.. knowing only pain. She has stated that she would never want to put another child through that. So.. she has determined that when she tries for her next child, she will get early genetic testing.. and if the baby is positive.. she will have an abortion. To spare the baby the pain and suffering.

Why do you think you know better than she does whats best for her child?
 
Re: A great question for pro abortion types

jaeger19 said:
How do you know there is not a speck of ethics in that choice?

So.. my patient has a rare genetic issue that can get inherited by their children. IF they inherit the gene.. sometimes the baby can make it to almost full term. but they will need to be taken by cesarean and will be on breathing tubes feeding tube, etc.. and have basically no chance of survival beyond a few days or maybe a weak or to with extra ordinary measure being taken by the hospital. She had one child go through that.

To her it was horrible watching her child suffer like that.. knowing only pain. She has stated that she would never want to put another child through that. So.. she has determined that when she tries for her next child, she will get early genetic testing.. and if the baby is positive.. she will have an abortion. To spare the baby the pain and suffering.

Why do you think you know better than she does whats best for her child?
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I have NEVER said word one about being anti-abortion in all instances. In fact, when the life (not life-style) of the mother or child are in danger, or a situation (although rare) as you have described occurs, there is no question that an abortion should occur. THAT'S ethical.
 
Re: A great question for pro abortion types

smallvoice said:
What if religion has NOTHING to do with it (and 99.99% of my position doesn't)? It's ETHICS, something you Socialists know NOTHING about.
If she "chooses" she can kill it. Not a speck of ethics in that choice, but that's what you understand and embrace.
Click to expand...

Just because your ethics are different than mine doesn't mean I don't have any. It's just that you and I define things differently.

For example, when you die, nobody can use any of your organs unless you have consented, even if doing so would keep someone alive.

So according to your ethics, women have one less right than a corpse.
 
Re: A great question for pro abortion types

Hamish Howl said:
Just because your ethics are different than mine doesn't mean I don't have any. It's just that you and I define things differently.

For example, when you die, nobody can use any of your organs unless you have consented, even if doing so would keep someone alive.

So according to your ethics, women have one less right than a corpse.
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So you publish that you know nothing about ethics. Fine. You clearly are confused about what I believe.
 
Re: A great question for pro abortion types

smallvoice said:
What if religion has NOTHING to do with it (and 99.99% of my position doesn't)? It's ETHICS, something you Socialists know NOTHING about.
If she "chooses" she can kill it. Not a speck of ethics in that choice, but that's what you understand and embrace.
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And yet, you've never been able to articulate a single argument beyond, 'but it kills a baby!!!!' :roll:...displaying only emotion, innaccuracy, and an atrocious view of women.

And never being able to directly address facts on the issue. Like this, the ethics of acting responsibly with regards to pregnancy:

--There's nothing responsible about having a kid you cant afford and expecting tax payers to take up that burden with public assistance.

--There's nothing responsible about having a kid you arent emotionally prepared to have and believe you'll abuse or neglect.

--There's nothing responsible about having a kid if you know you wont stop drinking, smoking, doing drugs, etc that will damage the unborn.

--There's nothing responsible about remaining pregnant and dropping out of high school or college or missing work and not fulfilling your potential in society.

--There's nothing responsible about remaining pregnant/having a child and not being able to fulfill your other commitments and obligations to family, dependents, employer, church, community, society.

--There's nothing responsible about having a kid and giving it up for adoption when there are already over 100,000 kids in America waiting to be adopted. It means one less waiting will find a home.​

IMO it's completely 'unethical' to encourage a woman to have a kid just to give it up for adoption when there are already so many waiting, hoping, and actually harms those that get ignored because of new infants being added to that pool.

There are many angles to discuss abortion ethics here, this ^^ is just one. But why pursue the others when you cant even argue this one? Do you have any counter-argument here?
 
Re: A great question for pro abortion types

smallvoice said:
So you publish that you know nothing about ethics. Fine. You clearly are confused about what I believe.
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You know, there are better things for me to read than people just making things up.

Good day.
 
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