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What is the most realistic/pragmatic way to significantly decrease abortion rates?

year2late said:
Making abortion illegal.

Telling people that abortion is morally wrong.

Demanding that people abstain unless they are willing to accept the consequences of becoming pregnant.

Picketing Abortion Clinics

Improving physical and financial access tp high quality long term birth control.

Turning an unwanted pregnancy to a wanted one with assurances of job/medical/housing security.


I will be curious as to why you believe your choice is the most realistic and pragmatic.
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If you are pro-choice, can you identify at all with people that are pro-life because they believe abortion is murder?
 
maquiscat said:
History. Abortion has been steadily on the decline since 1980 or so. Being legal is working.

Although I will say that those last two are still worthy goals, and can be accomplished without needed to make abortion illegal. Picketing remains protected under 1st amendment.
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Are you pro-choice and believe abortion is murder? Can you explain how you reconcile the two beliefs?
 
Angel said:
There is none. It would require the moral rehabilitation of America. We'd have to turn back the clock to a pre-Sixties moral climate. To the Forties probably. Narcissism would have to be rooted out. Stupidity rolled back. None of this is going to happen.

The genie is out of the bottle.
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If the fetus cannot live alone without its host the mother, then with what logic are pro lifers saying the baby's rights should trump the mother’s rights?
 
FinnFox said:
Use CONDOMS.
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If you are pro-life, and you find out that your baby is going to be born severely sick or deformed, Is there any possibility you would consider having an abortion, possibly even for the child’s sake?
 
maquiscat said:
I did note that all that was a worthy goals towards the effort of reducing abortion. You just took what he said and expanded it greatly on that particular point.

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Why do people not believe that abortion kills a person, and that person has a right to live if conceived, what if the person being aborted was them?
 
prometeus said:
Education, education, education, affordable contraception, affordable healthcare before, during and after pregnancies for mother and child, good education and economic opportunities for children.
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What are the best pro arguments for abortion?
 
year2late said:
Long term contraception has been the most helpful so far, but for the folks that are too rich for Medicaid and too poor for insurance or self pay...it is too pricey. And frankly those that are too rich for Medicaid and too poor for insurance are probably the most likely to consider abortion.
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Once China had strict one child policy, there were millions abortions, and frustration within the citizens. Nowadays they allowed to have two, are Chinese people interested in more than one child anymore?
 
If America focussed more on economic issues and less on social issues, most of you would be so much better off.
 
AmIsraelHai said:
If you are pro-life, and you find out that your baby is going to be born severely sick or deformed, Is there any possibility you would consider having an abortion, possibly even for the child’s sake?
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Sure. Abortion causes trauma to mother, but for unborn child abortion isn't bad thing at all. By using condoms you can reduce situations where you need to consider abortion, because it's not always about being severely sick or deformed. Also there should be easy way to give child away to foster family as first option when you can't keep child and abortion isn't option (whatever reason is).
 
minnie616 said:
There were an estimated 800,000 abortions per year ( even though they were illegal ,) in the early 1930s in the United States.

.....
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COTO said:
Ehh... source? View attachment 67256319.
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From Wiki
By the 1930s, licensed physicians performed an estimated 800,000 abortions a year.[26]

Boyer, Paul S., ed. (2006). The Oxford companion to United States history. Oxford: Oxford Univ. Press. p. 3. ISBN 978-0-19-508209-8


Abortion in the United States - Wikipedia
 
year2late said:
What is the most realistic/pragmatic way to significantly decrease abortion rates?
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Improve social-economic opportunity as this is the primary reason women seek abortion in the first place.

Also, eliminate the ban on men under 30 from getting a vasectomy if they haven't already begotten children; stop requiring men to have their wive's written permission to get a vasectomy; help spread awareness of how minimally invasive vasectomies are and that there's a reversible version now; offer a tax incentive to have a vasectomy, beyond the cost of the procedure.
 
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COTO said:
Ehh... source? View attachment 67256319
....
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I would also like to point out that the mid 19th century abortion rates suggest between 20 to 25 percent of all pregnancies in the United States during that era ended in abortion.

Despite campaigns to end the practice of abortion, abortifacient advertising was highly effective, though less so across the Atlantic. Contemporary estimates of mid-19th century abortion rates suggest between 20-25% of all pregnancies in the United States during that era ended in abortion.[11]
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Abortion in the United States - Wikipedia

By 2015 the percentage of pregnancies aborted in the UNited States were less than 19 percent.

That it’s less than Denmark, Sweden, France, United Kingdom, or Canada.

Percentage of pregnancies aborted by country (listed by percentage)
 
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Angel said:
There is none.
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Even though I just gave the perfect solution. You truly do not know anything about this topic. Take your bible and go home, actually read it for once.
 
AmIsraelHai said:
What is the moral defense of abortion?
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From the Religious Coaliation for Reproductive Choice:

Our Religious beliefs drive our advocacy position


Each woman’s complex and personal choices

Our religious principles: Compassion for the complex choices each individual may confront and the impact of these choices on families.

Our advocacy position: The decisions to become a parent, when and under what circumstances are deeply personal. These matters are best left to a woman to discern for herself in consultation with her family, her faith and others she may bring into the conversation
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Read more:

The Moral Case – Religious Coalition for Reproductive Choice
 
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<alt>doxygen said:
It was in one of your threads, but it's a needle in a haystack unless I can think of a keyword.
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No needle in that haystack. I don't believe contraception is immoral and therefore wouldn't say it. Your hobbyhorse is bucking, I'm afraid.
 
AmIsraelHai said:
If the fetus cannot live alone without its host the mother, then with what logic are pro lifers saying the baby's rights should trump the mother’s rights?
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I don't know what other pro0lifers are saying, but I'm not about trumping any rights.
 
Wayne Jr said:
Even though I just gave the perfect solution. You truly do not know anything about this topic. Take your bible and go home, actually read it for once.
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My Bible? Do you make it a practice not knowing what you're talking about or is this the exception that proves the rule?
 
AmIsraelHai said:
Are you pro-choice and believe abortion is murder? Can you explain how you reconcile the two beliefs?
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I'd like you to first explain how you came to that conclusion. I am not going to say whether you are wrong or right yet.

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AmIsraelHai said:
Once China had strict one child policy, there were millions abortions, and frustration within the citizens. Nowadays they allowed to have two, are Chinese people interested in more than one child anymore?
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The Chinese issue stems not over a matter.of population, as far as the citizens' frustration goes, but over their clinging to the need to have a male child. The one child law caused much strife because of that, not because of the mandated abortions.

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Wayne Jr said:
Improve social-economic opportunity as this is the primary reason women seek abortion in the first place.

Also, eliminate the ban on men under 30 from getting a vasectomy if they haven't already begotten children; stop requiring men to have their wive's written permission to get a vasectomy; help spread awareness of how minimally invasive vasectomies are and that there's a reversible version now; offer a tax incentive to have a vasectomy, beyond the cost of the procedure.
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Interesting that you did not also suggest eliminating the ban on women getting tubal ligations before 30. Why is that?

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AmIsraelHai said:
If you are pro-choice, can you identify at all with people that are pro-life because they believe abortion is murder?
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I respect that they have that belief.

I cannot identify with them applying that belief to someone else to the point of diminishing the rights of a born person.
 
Wayne Jr said:
Improve social-economic opportunity as this is the primary reason women seek abortion in the first place.

Also, eliminate the ban on men under 30 from getting a vasectomy if they haven't already begotten children; stop requiring men to have their wive's written permission to get a vasectomy; help spread awareness of how minimally invasive vasectomies are and that there's a reversible version now; offer a tax incentive to have a vasectomy, beyond the cost of the procedure.
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Actually not so much. The working poor are not trying to improve their socioeconomic opportunity! They are trying to preserve what little they have. In fact a person who is part of the working poor is already housing and job insecure. She is trying to maintain what little she has.
 
minnie616 said:
From Wiki
By the 1930s, licensed physicians performed an estimated 800,000 abortions a year.[26]

Boyer, Paul S., ed. (2006). The Oxford companion to United States history. Oxford: Oxford Univ. Press. p. 3. ISBN 978-0-19-508209-8

Abortion in the United States - Wikipedia
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:shock:

You could have made good money off me in that bet.

ibid.: "At times during the one hundred years when abortion was illegal, police allowed its practice to continue undisturbed; at times it was repressed. Throughout the period, many women continued to procure abortions despite the risks [of abortion techniques used at the time], and juries often refused to convict abortionists, indicating continued public acceptance of the practice. During the 1930's, abortion clinics run by licensed physicians operated quite openly, contributing to an estimated 800,000 abortions a year."

Hence not only was abortion a de facto legal practice, the 1930's appeared to be more socially tolerant of abortion than we are today, which is no small feat. 800,000 abortions in 1930 scales by population to ~2.12 million abortions in 2019.

A longstanding social evil, apparently. :(

Thanks for providing the reference.
 
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