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A conundrum; what if every abortion clinician quit?

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Crusader13

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What if there were no more qualified doctors and nurses willing to perform abortions? Like they all just suddenly quit and refused to work.

The State would have to do one of two things; either force the woman to stay pregnant, or force the doctors to perform the abortions. Both would be a violation of the right to choose what happens to your body. Coat Hanger abortions would likely become the norm and the pro-choice people hate the thought of women being resorted to that.

How would you solve this conundrum?
 
There would no longer be legal abortions, which would make many Conservatives giddy at the prospect of getting to put women on death row, women who had been found out that they had had non legal abortions.

Abortions wouldn't stop, they would just go off the grid again.

No doubt there would be upticks in contraceptive applications.
 
Crusader13 said:
What if there were no more qualified doctors and nurses willing to perform abortions? Like they all just suddenly quit and refused to work.

The State would have to do one of two things; either force the woman to stay pregnant, or force the doctors to perform the abortions. Both would be a violation of the right to choose what happens to your body. Coat Hanger abortions would likely become the norm and the pro-choice people hate the thought of women being resorted to that.

How would you solve this conundrum?
Click to expand...

Call Dr. Kervorkian in to counsel women of their options to possibly end their lives with dignity if they simply cannot live with a new born baby they helped create through having sex for pleasure.
 
Crusader13 said:
What if there were no more qualified doctors and nurses willing to perform abortions? Like they all just suddenly quit and refused to work.

The State would have to do one of two things; either force the woman to stay pregnant, or force the doctors to perform the abortions. Both would be a violation of the right to choose what happens to your body. Coat Hanger abortions would likely become the norm and the pro-choice people hate the thought of women being resorted to that.

How would you solve this conundrum?
Click to expand...

Only pro-choice would hate to see cost hanger abortions become the norm? So that's what you pro-lifers want?
 
Crusader13 said:
What if there were no more qualified doctors and nurses willing to perform abortions? Like they all just suddenly quit and refused to work.

The State would have to do one of two things; either force the woman to stay pregnant, or force the doctors to perform the abortions. Both would be a violation of the right to choose what happens to your body. Coat Hanger abortions would likely become the norm and the pro-choice people hate the thought of women being resorted to that.

How would you solve this conundrum?
Click to expand...

Red:
There is a third option: provide the requisite training to people who (1) are not doctors and nurses and (2) are willing to perform abortions.
 
marke said:
Call Dr. Kervorkian in to counsel women of their options to possibly end their lives with dignity if they simply cannot live with a new born baby they helped create through having sex for pleasure.
Click to expand...

Dr. Jack Kervorkian is dead.

Question for you, though, should the men who had sex with these women, who then have abortions, be charged with aiding and abetting murder since they fail to protect the lives of their unborn children?

Shouldn't they also be given the Dr. Kevorkian exit to "end their lives with dignity" if they refuse to care for, monetarily and help to raise physically, the child they helped create through having sex for pleasure?

Seems fair to me, two to tango, two to pay the piper!
 
LouC said:
Dr. Jack Kervorkian is dead.

Question for you, though, should the men who had sex with these women, who then have abortions, be charged with aiding and abetting murder since they fail to protect the lives of their unborn children?

Shouldn't they also be given the Dr. Kevorkian exit to "end their lives with dignity" if they refuse to care for, monetarily and help to raise physically, the child they helped create through having sex for pleasure?

Seems fair to me, two to tango, two to pay the piper!
Click to expand...

That's a good point. However men are already forced to pay for child support if the woman keeps the baby, so they're already being coerced into coughing up for their part of the mistake. I support that. While there would definitely need to be a discussion around deterring deceitful men, ultimately its the woman committing the murder so it's her fault for the most part. Being lied to doesn't excuse breaking law.

If abortions were illegal and the woman had one, she's at fault. You can't blame the guy who knocked her up because how could he possibly know she would abort? He couldn't.
 
I have said this for several years now.

Make abortions illegal....I contend that abortions might even happen more frequently.

All of a sudden the abortion pills would become the new drug of drug pushers. It could fill the void as marijuana becomes legal. Drug pushers are clearly in thousands more places than Planned Parenthood. The abortion "market" would become larger. Hell, I bet you a nickel that there would be women wanting to maintain the pregnancy that would be "dosed" by disgruntled boyfriends.

Yes, abortions would be less safe for the pregnant woman, but pregnant women are frequently in desperate situations.

If pro-lifers really want to figure out a solution (vastly decreasing the numbers of abortions) they need to understand that having an abortion is usually not about pregnancy being "inconvenient" . Most women who chose abortion are already struggling to care for a child at home. Most women who chose abortion are poor or working poor....struggling to make ends meet. Most of these women have substandard or no health insurance. If poor, but not meeting normal financial guidelines...they will be cycled onto medicaid. Medicaid buys them basic pregnancy care at places that accept medicaid. Long waits for exam and testing at county clinics. So for a simple appointment they may have to give up an entire day of work - when they are already struggling to make ends meet.

Pregnancy is risky business. I was expected to have an easy pregnancy. By the time all was said and done I had several serious complications and surgery not related to those complications. I was off work nearly six months. It was the FACT that I had a doctor that had the time to know me and see subtle signs that I am positive would have been missed in a rushed clinic situation. I likely have functioning kidneys today because he caught the signs early. What also helped was that I had financial resources (initially)to take the time off of work. When all was said and done.....I was robbing peter to pay paul to maintain my COBRA. I was lucky I had a job (and seniority) to come back to - my employer was well within their rights to terminate my employment after 12 weeks. I had the luxury to be able to be heavily in debt to maintain my pregnancy/health.

I may be personally against abortion....but I will not chose for another woman....who may have to make decisions based on her ability to support herself and born children during pregnancy. I will not make decisions for a woman that knows she has substandard access to medical care if anything should go wrong. It is beyond naive and narrow minded to make believe that women chose abortion for trivial reasons.
 
LouC said:
Dr. Jack Kervorkian is dead.
Click to expand...

Kervorkian is dead and in hell. Thank God.

Question for you, though, should the men who had sex with these women, who then have abortions, be charged with aiding and abetting murder since they fail to protect the lives of their unborn children?
Click to expand...

That is a tricky question now that ungodly men have made it legal to butcher babies in the womb. Of course both husband and wife share guilt when they both conspire to murder one of God's innocent ones, but so also do all those who participated in the process which led to the ungodly legalization of the bloody butchery in the first place.

Shouldn't they also be given the Dr. Kevorkian exit to "end their lives with dignity" if they refuse to care for, monetarily and help to raise physically, the child they helped create through having sex for pleasure?

Seems fair to me, two to tango, two to pay the piper!
Click to expand...

Unrepentant murderers will not have to kill themselves. God will do it for them if he finds them guilty of rebellion when He judges them in the end.
 
Crusader13 said:
What if there were no more qualified doctors and nurses willing to perform abortions? Like they all just suddenly quit and refused to work.

The State would have to do one of two things; either force the woman to stay pregnant, or force the doctors to perform the abortions. Both would be a violation of the right to choose what happens to your body. Coat Hanger abortions would likely become the norm and the pro-choice people hate the thought of women being resorted to that.

How would you solve this conundrum?
Click to expand...

Why would they do that?

Drs are not forced to perform abortions now. They do so because as medical professionals, they believe that safe abortion is in their patients' and society's best interests.

btw, there are pills available that also initiate abortions and no Drs are needed. They are recommended tho, since as you point out, abortion can be dangerous and having a Dr available for consultation for complications is ethical and responsible.
 
marke said:
Unrepentant murderers will not have to kill themselves. God will do it for them if he finds them guilty of rebellion when He judges them in the end.
Click to expand...

Abortion is not murder. My god is pro choice.
 
Crusader13 said:
What if there were no more qualified doctors and nurses willing to perform abortions? Like they all just suddenly quit and refused to work.

The State would have to do one of two things; either force the woman to stay pregnant, or force the doctors to perform the abortions. Both would be a violation of the right to choose what happens to your body. Coat Hanger abortions would likely become the norm and the pro-choice people hate the thought of women being resorted to that.

How would you solve this conundrum?
Click to expand...
You are running off a false premise. The lack of a medical professional to perform the procedure is in no way the government forcing women to stay pregnant. A person's right to something exists even if no one else provides it. We would still.have a right to bear arms even if no one produced any weapons.

Interestingly, I've seen a similar premise used when Obamacare came out and someone asked what if all doctors quit. This was alongside a story of less people going into medical school and more doctors retiring.

Sent from my Z982 using Tapatalk
 
Xelor said:
Red:
There is a third option: provide the requisite training to people who (1) are not doctors and nurses and (2) are willing to perform abortions.
Click to expand...
I believe that the premise is supposed to be that no one wants to be an abortion provider, even if they might want an abortion themselves at sometime.

Sent from my Z982 using Tapatalk
 
Scrabaholic said:
S/he is? Well, the god of the Bible sure appears to be. Look at all the babies he killed.
Click to expand...

Shhh! You better not let God hear you criticizing Him like that. He has a tendency of being stirred to anger by blasphemy.
 
marke said:
Ironic! Coincidental! The god of this world is also pro infanticide.
Click to expand...

Huh? What the hell are you talking about now?
 
year2late said:
I may be personally against abortion....but I will not chose for another woman....who may have to make decisions based on her ability to support herself and born children during pregnancy.
Click to expand...

I find this really problematic thinking. You recognize that abortion is wrong, yet you spend paragraphs trying to create sympathy for those who have them. I'd be willing to bet that most people who commit murder are doing so because they have no other choice either. They're desperate...no food, no money, debt collector is going to take their thumbs, I need to be accepted into this gang so I can make a life for myself on these streets. Tough yes, but that doesn't excuse moral deprivation. There is no excuse for ending an innocent life, especially when your poor choices are the reason that life is there.

Perhaps most women being forced into an abortion should realize that the choices they tend to make in life are the wrong ones. Not having an abortion could be the perfect place to start changing that.
 
Crusader13 said:
What if there were no more qualified doctors and nurses willing to perform abortions? Like they all just suddenly quit and refused to work.

The State would have to do one of two things; either force the woman to stay pregnant, or force the doctors to perform the abortions. Both would be a violation of the right to choose what happens to your body. Coat Hanger abortions would likely become the norm and the pro-choice people hate the thought of women being resorted to that.

How would you solve this conundrum?
Click to expand...

I don't see the conundrum. The only solution to women giving themselves abortions is for someone else to give them abortions. If there is no one else, then those who want abortions will do it themselves. You can't get rid of both.
 
Crusader13 said:
I find this really problematic thinking. You recognize that abortion is wrong, yet you spend paragraphs trying to create sympathy for those who have them. I'd be willing to bet that most people who commit murder are doing so because they have no other choice either. They're desperate...no food, no money, debt collector is going to take their thumbs, I need to be accepted into this gang so I can make a life for myself on these streets. Tough yes, but that doesn't excuse moral deprivation. There is no excuse for ending an innocent life, especially when your poor choices are the reason that life is there.

Perhaps most women being forced into an abortion should realize that the choices they tend to make in life are the wrong ones. Not having an abortion could be the perfect place to start changing that.
Click to expand...

Interesting that you make this judgement and do not know why I think it is wrong. :)
 
year2late said:
Interesting that you make this judgement and do not know why I think it is wrong. :)
Click to expand...

The limitations in thinking on the OPs part are pretty obvious.

It's like saying: I believe that divorce is acceptable. Would I have one? Probably not but it would depend on the circumstances. In general, people get divorces because they believe it is necessary for the better and more secure future of the individuals in the family involved.

I cant tell another woman or man that their decision is wrong. I dont know that, I'm not in their shoes.

Just like with abortion. Would I get one? I dont think so but it would have depended on my circumstances in life at the time.
 
Lursa said:
The limitations in thinking on the OPs part are pretty obvious.

It's like saying: I believe that divorce is acceptable. Would I have one? Probably not but it would depend on the circumstances. In general, people get divorces because they believe it is necessary for the better and more secure future of the individuals in the family involved.

I cant tell another woman or man that their decision is wrong. I dont know that, I'm not in their shoes.

Just like with abortion. Would I get one? I dont think so but it would have depended on my circumstances in life at the time.
Click to expand...
Pragmatism at its finest ��
 
Crusader13 said:
What if there were no more qualified doctors and nurses willing to perform abortions? Like they all just suddenly quit and refused to work.

The State would have to do one of two things; either force the woman to stay pregnant, or force the doctors to perform the abortions. Both would be a violation of the right to choose what happens to your body. Coat Hanger abortions would likely become the norm and the pro-choice people hate the thought of women being resorted to that.

How would you solve this conundrum?
Click to expand...

Since many doctors and nurses, those who currently provide abortion care, sympathize with women and want to help them, it is unlikely that all would stop at once. It would be possible to provide incentives to encourage more to provide services, i.e. better working conditions keeping protesters away from clinics, higher pay to compensate for the high risks providers endure. It would be simple enough to train additional providers for basic early term abortions since the Jane Collective taught women how to do abortions when they were illegal.
 
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