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Does a woman have a right...

Lursa said:
I'm almost embarrassed to have to type this out for you, but you do realize that the more birth control is used, the fewer abortions occur?
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Liberals are 100% right when they suggest that birth control and condoms should be available to all secondary students.

There is no use hiding one's head in the sand about what our children are doing.
 
TheParser said:
Liberals are 100% right when they suggest that birth control and condoms should be available to all secondary students.

There is no use hiding one's head in the sand about what our children are doing.
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Know what else liberals are right about that you ought to support? Heavy government subsidies for child care. For many young women becoming a single mother is a sentence to years in poverty. Free or very cheap child care would be the first step away from welfare.
 
ttwtt78640 said:
According to the SCOTUS, the right to privacy.
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So why isn't the right to privacy violated when other procedures, such as trepanning (sp?), are banned?
 
Scrabaholic said:
Abortion is termination of pregnancy. It's impossible to have an abortion if you are not pregnant.
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The question is not whether she can have an abortion, but if she still has the right to an abortion?
 
soylentgreen said:
It would depend on how a person wants to present the issue of abortion. By claiming it a right you make the mistake of naming it a legal issue. Abortion should not be a matter of law because it is a medical issue, not a legal one. The discussion about whether to have an abortion is one that should be held between a woman and her doctor, not a woman and her lawyer.

There are two basic tenets of abortion that if not agreed to then the conversation cannot progress.
First is that abortion is not a right, it is a decision.
Secondly only the pregnant woman has a right to make that decision.

The question to be asked is not does she have a right to an abortion. Instead it should be does a woman have the right to make her own decisions.
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There are plenty of decisions that we are not allowed to make by law. Driving while intoxicated, or with vision problems. What is the difference?
 
code1211 said:
Out of curiosity, what is this woman going to abort if she's not pregnant?
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The questions isn't can she get one, but does she have the right to one?
 
CFI302 said:
Does that woman who chose not to get one and can't afford to support that child have a right to demand those she told to butt out of her body pay for it?
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This is actually off topic. The right to an abortion and whether or not others should pay for it are separate questions.
 
CFI302 said:
It's not a different matter when the choice not to do something is on the same level as the choice to do it. This thread is about choice and abortion. Those results are part of a choice not to have one.

It's also not the responsibility for those unrelated to the situation to pay for the sins of those parents.

It's poor public policy to force those that were told to butt out of a choice, whatever that choice may be, to pay for it when the one telling them to butt out doesn't like the result. Taxpayers are the ATM for people making bad choices.
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Actually the thread is about rights, specifically whether or not they exist if what they cover can't be done. An alternate example could be do you have a right to bear arms if you have no arms(weapons)
 
CFI302 said:
Are you saying that the woman choosing not to have an abortion isn't part of what you claim is her right to decide? Since the woman demanding someone else be forced to support the kid(s) SHE chose to have as part of what you claim is a right, it's as much a part of the discussion because it couldn't take place without her choice.
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The results of what happens when a woman chooses not to have an abortion is separate to whether she has the right to choose. She could have the right to choose, but the government does not necessarily have an obligation to aid her. Remember there are many factors even now under current law where she might not be eligible for any kind of public assistance. Odds of that are irrelevant.


I've heard the argument that the children shouldn't pay for the sins of parent(s). You claim to be a Libertarian yet you have no problem with the government forcing those of us that didn't "sin" to pay for sins we didn't commit.
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Ad hoc. There has been nothing said in this thread that indicates such is their position. While I support the right of a woman to have an abortion, it does not automatically follow that I support the "social safety net" programs currently in place.
 
maquiscat said:
Actually the thread is about rights, specifically whether or not they exist if what they cover can't be done. An alternate example could be do you have a right to bear arms if you have no arms(weapons)
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Your right to bear arms isn't dependent upon whether or not you own guns.
 
maquiscat said:
Do you have to have an abortion to have a right to one?

Also it's the right to bear arms. Despite the common use of the 2nd to cover firearms, it is not limited to that as written.
Sent from my Z982 using Tapatalk
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No, you do not. Just like I have a right to free speech even when I choose to remain silent.

I also have the right to buy a Rolls-Royce. I just do not have the money
 
CFI302 said:
Your right to bear arms isn't dependent upon whether or not you own guns.
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So then is the right to an abortion dependant upon whether or not you're pregnant?
 
maquiscat said:
There are plenty of decisions that we are not allowed to make by law. Driving while intoxicated, or with vision problems. What is the difference?
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The difference would be that the actions you refer to will cause harm to others. Where as a decision made about abortion is one that concerns only the pregnant woman.
Abortion is a medical procedure, not as you suggest an impulsive and stupid thing to do by associating it with your examples.
Only anti abortionists make abortion a rights issue. It is not. It is a medical issue. The right that should be discussed is the right to self determination. One that anti abortionist will not discuss because they reserve that right for themselves and deny it to others.
 
maquiscat said:
The questions isn't can she get one, but does she have the right to one?
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Under current law, that option is guaranteed for her.

Is this a right? Like the unalienable kind?

I'm not sure this action is a right endowed upon her by her creator. Under the laws of nature, survival of the fittest dictates. She definitely higher on the food chain than her unborn child.
 
code1211 said:
Is this a right? Like the unalienable kind?
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Tangent: inalienable rights do not exist, because we can PROVE that every right can be forcibly taken from you or willingly given up. The right to abortion is a legal right and we will lose it if we don't defend it.
 
maquiscat said:
So then is the right to an abortion dependant upon whether or not you're pregnant?
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No such right to an abortion exist in the Constitution. I can look at the Constitution and read where the right to bear arms exist. Can you show me the word abortion in the Constitution?
 
Wayne Jr said:
Tangent: inalienable rights do not exist, because we can PROVE that every right can be forcibly taken from you or willingly given up. The right to abortion is a legal right and we will lose it if we don't defend it.
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In the society of the USA, we hold these truths to be self evident: That all men are created equal. That they are endowed by their creator with certain unalienable rights. That among these rights are life, liberty and the pursuit of happiness.

This is THE foundational doctrine of our United States Culture.

The Constitution codifies the existence of these rights.

In the case of abortion, assuming an endowing creator exists to endow rights, for a woman to exercise her option to have an abortion, the right to life endowed by the creator to the unborn child is erased.

Does a person have a right to erase the divinely endowed rights of another at a personal caprice for personal advantage when the other thereby becomes a blameless victim?
 
code1211 said:
In the society of the USA, we hold these truths to be self evident: That all men are created equal. That they are endowed by their creator with certain unalienable rights. That among these rights are life, liberty and the pursuit of happiness.

This is THE foundational doctrine of our United States Culture.

The Constitution codifies the existence of these rights.

In the case of abortion, assuming an endowing creator exists to endow rights, for a woman to exercise her option to have an abortion, the right to life endowed by the creator to the unborn child is erased.

Does a person have a right to erase the divinely endowed rights of another at a personal caprice for personal advantage when the other thereby becomes a blameless victim?
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How amusing that you so openly set standards for others that you then do not follow yourself.

In your post # 69
No such right to an abortion exist in the Constitution. I can look at the Constitution and read where the right to bear arms exist. Can you show me the word abortion in the Constitution?
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Yet in this post you make your own interpretation.

In turn can you show where in the constitution the right to life is a guaranteed unalienable right? Because execution of criminals still does happen in america. Or liberty and then explain prisons. And just how and where in the constitution is pursuit of happiness written. After all you demand the word abortion be written in the constitution for it to be a right so fair is fair show me the words pursuit of happiness in the constitution.

You are not giving an argument against abortion by misinterpreting the constitution to suite yourself. You are just demonstrating your own hypocrisy of setting one standard for yourself and another for anyone else.
 
CFI302 said:
No such right to an abortion exist in the Constitution. I can look at the Constitution and read where the right to bear arms exist. Can you show me the word abortion in the Constitution?
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Can you show me the word unborn in the Constitution?
 
code1211 said:
In the society of the USA, we hold these truths to be self evident: That all men are created equal. That they are endowed by their creator with certain unalienable rights. That among these rights are life, liberty and the pursuit of happiness.

This is THE foundational doctrine of our United States Culture.

The Constitution codifies the existence of these rights.

In the case of abortion, assuming an endowing creator exists to endow rights, for a woman to exercise her option to have an abortion, the right to life endowed by the creator to the unborn child is erased.

Does a person have a right to erase the divinely endowed rights of another at a personal caprice for personal advantage when the other thereby becomes a blameless victim?
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The unborn have no rights
 
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