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Thread: Michelle Obama's Miscarriage

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    Michelle Obama's Miscarriage

    One of the big reasons why the story about Michelle Obama revealing her miscarriage is so important(among others) is that it's important for women to realize how commonplace miscarriages are and one of the big side effects of attempting to ban abortion is. Too many women think that they would never have an abortion and they would never dream of doing that to their baby. But bans on abortion don't just impact women who want to have an abortion. They impact all women everywhere.

    If Abortion is banned it doesn't disappear. It gets pushed into the black market. It gets pushed into dark alleyways. There are a million different ways that woman can cause an intentional miscarriage to prevent a pregnancy she doesn't want. Drugs, alcohol, falling down the stairs...

    Currently, in the United States, 1/3 of all pregnancies end in a miscarriage. A natural one. One that is not intentional. For the women who have them, it is tragic and traumatizing. If Abortion is banned how are we going to tell the difference between intentional miscarriages and unintentional ones? If Abortion is Murder then every single solitary miscarriage that happens in the United States is going to require a homicide investigation in which the woman's body is a crime scene and she is the prime suspect.

    Think about that for a minute. It doesn't matter if you wanted the miscarriage or not we can't just take your word for it. All the women who intentionally caused their miscarriage will claim it was an accident too. As a result, every woman's miscarriage will need to be treated with the seriousness that a murder investigation requires. Police are going to have to know what you put in your body recently. They're going to have to know as soon as you knew you were pregnant. If you go to your doctor, your doctor will have to report the pregnancy to the police the same way they would if someone came in with a gunshot wound. If you buy a pregnancy test at the local drug store the pharmacist will have to notify the authorities.

    Every woman will need to have these intimate details made a matter of public record. Before you even have a baby bump, before you even tell your friends and family. This is the post-Roe vs Wade world. That's why the ruling came down to a right to privacy. The degree of government intrusion in the most personal part of your life would have to be absolutely astounding in order to have any hope of making an abortion ban enforceable.

    Every woman who thinks she would never want an abortion needs to understand this. Every woman who thinks aborting your child is horrible needs to understand the grass is not as green as it looks on the other side of the fence before it's too late.
    Obstruction of Justice also applies to overt coercion of court or government officials via the means of threats or actual physical harm and also applying to deliberate sedition against a court official to undermine the appearance of legitimate authority.

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    Re: Michelle Obama's Miscarriage

    In most cases, the same procedure used to clean up after a miscarriage is used to perform an abortion. Do we want to take away the safety of these procedures? Who determines if the procedure is for a miscarriage or an abortion since the same procedure is used?
    "Let us neither express, nor cherish, any harsh feeling towards any citizen who, by his vote, has differed with us. Let us at all times remember that all American citizens are brothers of a common country, and should dwell together in the bonds of fraternal feeling." - Abraham Lincoln

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    Re: Michelle Obama's Miscarriage

    Quote Originally Posted by MrWonka View Post
    One of the big reasons why the story about Michelle Obama revealing her miscarriage is so important(among others) is that it's important for women to realize how commonplace miscarriages are and one of the big side effects of attempting to ban abortion is. Too many women think that they would never have an abortion and they would never dream of doing that to their baby. But bans on abortion don't just impact women who want to have an abortion. They impact all women everywhere.

    If Abortion is banned it doesn't disappear. It gets pushed into the black market. It gets pushed into dark alleyways. There are a million different ways that woman can cause an intentional miscarriage to prevent a pregnancy she doesn't want. Drugs, alcohol, falling down the stairs...

    Currently, in the United States, 1/3 of all pregnancies end in a miscarriage. A natural one. One that is not intentional. For the women who have them, it is tragic and traumatizing. If Abortion is banned how are we going to tell the difference between intentional miscarriages and unintentional ones? If Abortion is Murder then every single solitary miscarriage that happens in the United States is going to require a homicide investigation in which the woman's body is a crime scene and she is the prime suspect.

    Think about that for a minute. It doesn't matter if you wanted the miscarriage or not we can't just take your word for it. All the women who intentionally caused their miscarriage will claim it was an accident too. As a result, every woman's miscarriage will need to be treated with the seriousness that a murder investigation requires. Police are going to have to know what you put in your body recently. They're going to have to know as soon as you knew you were pregnant. If you go to your doctor, your doctor will have to report the pregnancy to the police the same way they would if someone came in with a gunshot wound. If you buy a pregnancy test at the local drug store the pharmacist will have to notify the authorities.

    Every woman will need to have these intimate details made a matter of public record. Before you even have a baby bump, before you even tell your friends and family. This is the post-Roe vs Wade world. That's why the ruling came down to a right to privacy. The degree of government intrusion in the most personal part of your life would have to be absolutely astounding in order to have any hope of making an abortion ban enforceable.

    Every woman who thinks she would never want an abortion needs to understand this. Every woman who thinks aborting your child is horrible needs to understand the grass is not as green as it looks on the other side of the fence before it's too late.
    Perhaps we could look at this from a historical precedent. By that I mean we should ask: How were miscarriages treated in states and jurisdictions where it was illegal to obtain an abortion prior to the passage of Roe v. Wade? Were women who suffered from miscarriages regularly criminally prosecuted for having killed their unborn children?
    Last edited by Felis Leo; 11-16-18 at 01:42 PM.
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    Re: Michelle Obama's Miscarriage

    Tis why I love how many Anti-Choice people also happen to be people that think of themselves as Small Government Conservatives.

    Just small enough to get up a woman’s vagina.

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    Re: Michelle Obama's Miscarriage

    Quote Originally Posted by Jetboogieman View Post
    Tis why I love how many Anti-Choice people also happen to be people that think of themselves as Small Government Conservatives.

    Just small enough to get up a woman’s vagina.
    Well, even if I disagree with them, I understand that if one believes abortion is a form of homicide, that is one of the few places government has a say. If one believes that a government's only role is to protect the life, liberty and property of its people, there is no one more vulnerable than the unborn.
    Itís in the small things that the rot starts. Do the wrong thing once, itís easier to do it again. Do the individualistic thing once, it is easy to do it again.

    Fiat justitia, et pereat mundus

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    Re: Michelle Obama's Miscarriage

    Quote Originally Posted by Felis Leo View Post
    Perhaps we could look at this from a historical precedent. By that I mean we should ask: How were miscarriages treated in states and jurisdictions where it was illegal to obtain an abortion prior to the passage of Roe v. Wade? Were women who suffered from miscarriages regularly criminally prosecuted for having killed their fetuses?
    No, in the past authorities had no ability to enforce anti-abortion laws. That's the point. Abortions still happened. Abortions didn't start happening when Roe v Wade happened. All that happened was that they became safer. In the past about the only way that authorities could enforce an anti-abortion law was if the father of the child ratted out the woman.
    Obstruction of Justice also applies to overt coercion of court or government officials via the means of threats or actual physical harm and also applying to deliberate sedition against a court official to undermine the appearance of legitimate authority.

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    Re: Michelle Obama's Miscarriage

    Quote Originally Posted by Felis Leo View Post
    Well, even if I disagree with them, I understand that if one believes abortion is a form of homicide, that is one of the few places government has a say. If one believes that a government's only role is to protect the life, liberty, and property of its people, there is no one more vulnerable than the unborn.
    Really? That's weird because the 2nd Amendment gives people the right to protect their own life, liberty, and property with lethal force. There is no piece of property that more obviously belongs to a person than their own body. Yet all these small government, 2nd Amendment enthusiasts sure do change their tune when it comes to a woman's body. It's almost as if most of them live without any fear whatsoever of their body being invaded by an embryo.
    Obstruction of Justice also applies to overt coercion of court or government officials via the means of threats or actual physical harm and also applying to deliberate sedition against a court official to undermine the appearance of legitimate authority.

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    Re: Michelle Obama's Miscarriage

    Quote Originally Posted by Felis Leo View Post
    Perhaps we could look at this from a historical precedent. By that I mean we should ask: How were miscarriages treated in states and jurisdictions where it was illegal to obtain an abortion prior to the passage of Roe v. Wade? Were women who suffered from miscarriages regularly criminally prosecuted for having killed their unborn children?
    Previously, abortion was not illegal in the US.

    And what is the point of making abortion illegal if there's no intention of enforcing that law?
    Quote Originally Posted by code1211 View Post
    This seems less like palliative care and more like a last meal.
    Quote Originally Posted by Wan View Post
    You can think that I am stupid all you want. It won't stop me from being racist.
    Quote Originally Posted by Angel View Post
    Parrots of the Caribbean For Abortion!
    Quote Originally Posted by applejuicefool View Post
    A murderer putting a bullet through someone's brain is a medical procedure too.

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    Re: Michelle Obama's Miscarriage

    Quote Originally Posted by Felis Leo View Post
    Well, even if I disagree with them, I understand that if one believes abortion is a form of homicide, that is one of the few places government has a say. If one believes that a government's only role is to protect the life, liberty and property of its people, there is no one more vulnerable than the unborn.
    It is homicide.

    Not all homicide is illegal or unjustified.

    Is the govt more tasked with protecting the life, liberty, and property of the unborn or women? Both cannot be protected equally.
    Quote Originally Posted by code1211 View Post
    This seems less like palliative care and more like a last meal.
    Quote Originally Posted by Wan View Post
    You can think that I am stupid all you want. It won't stop me from being racist.
    Quote Originally Posted by Angel View Post
    Parrots of the Caribbean For Abortion!
    Quote Originally Posted by applejuicefool View Post
    A murderer putting a bullet through someone's brain is a medical procedure too.

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    Re: Michelle Obama's Miscarriage

    Quote Originally Posted by MrWonka View Post

    Currently, in the United States, 1/3 of all pregnancies end in a miscarriage. A natural one. One that is not intentional. For the women who have them, it is tragic and traumatizing. If Abortion is banned how are we going to tell the difference between intentional miscarriages and unintentional ones? If Abortion is Murder then every single solitary miscarriage that happens in the United States is going to require a homicide investigation in which the woman's body is a crime scene and she is the prime suspect.

    Think about that for a minute. It doesn't matter if you wanted the miscarriage or not we can't just take your word for it. All the women who intentionally caused their miscarriage will claim it was an accident too. As a result, every woman's miscarriage will need to be treated with the seriousness that a murder investigation requires. Police are going to have to know what you put in your body recently. They're going to have to know as soon as you knew you were pregnant. If you go to your doctor, your doctor will have to report the pregnancy to the police the same way they would if someone came in with a gunshot wound. If you buy a pregnancy test at the local drug store the pharmacist will have to notify the authorities.

    Every woman will need to have these intimate details made a matter of public record. Before you even have a baby bump, before you even tell your friends and family. This is the post-Roe vs Wade world. That's why the ruling came down to a right to privacy. The degree of government intrusion in the most personal part of your life would have to be absolutely astounding in order to have any hope of making an abortion ban enforceable.
    .
    Yes, this is key.

    Thank you.

    Also key is that if abortion were made illegal, women that did not want to keep a pregnancy would just not go to Drs.

    Today, it's simple and inexpensive to verify a pregnancy with over-the-counter tests. They are very accurate.

    If a woman suspected a pregnancy, she'd just go get one, and then order the drugs that cause the fertilized eggs to be released and flushed down the toilet. If necessary, the black market for those drugs would expand as needed.
    Last edited by Lursa; 11-16-18 at 01:57 PM.
    Quote Originally Posted by code1211 View Post
    This seems less like palliative care and more like a last meal.
    Quote Originally Posted by Wan View Post
    You can think that I am stupid all you want. It won't stop me from being racist.
    Quote Originally Posted by Angel View Post
    Parrots of the Caribbean For Abortion!
    Quote Originally Posted by applejuicefool View Post
    A murderer putting a bullet through someone's brain is a medical procedure too.

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