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Should People Be Punished For Opposing Abortion?

Back up your craziness. I get that there may be a few kooks out there talking about such things - but hell - you diminish every argument you may have by lying.
What exactly did I lie about?

- The "person v human" argument does not hold up on a global scale.

- The "person v human" argument does get lost in translation in several languages

- Political correctness is a form of fascism, and it is not limited to the fringe left wingers. If you honestly do not believe that then please read the title of this thread again.



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The argument that every abortion is justified because the word human and the phrase human being does not appear in the in the u.s. constitution is a flawed one.
Who made that argument? Can you quote it?

Another flawed argument that doesn't hold up on a global scale is the argument that the words human, person, and human being are separate and uniquely different things. There are several languages in the world that do not recognize this trio as separate words. For example in Russian there is only one word for human, person, and human being. That word is chelovek. So in Russian your argument literally translates into "a chelovek, is not a chelovek, or chelovek".
The question is how are those terms defined.
 
The argument that every abortion is justified because the word human and the phrase human being does not appear in the in the u.s. constitution is a flawed one.
YOUR MERE UNSUPPORTED CLAIM IS STILL WORTHLESS WITHOUT EVIDENCE. Evidence of a flaw, that is. Meanwhile, although it is actually a valid argument, it is not the best argument. The best argument notes the Facts that unborn humans commit multiple types of assault upon their hostesses, none of which would be tolerable if one adult did it to another adult, and so abortion is, legitimately, self-defense from those assaults.

As i pointed out earlier many countries in the world with legal abortion use specific references to inalienable human rights.
THAT'S THEIR PROBLEM, NOT OURS HERE IN THE USA.

You can call that hypocritical all you want
FACTS ARE FACTS. If they claim human rights are inalienable and also allow abortion of unborn humans, then that is a double-standard and qualifies as hypocrisy. But we don't have that problem here in the USA.

but the fact remains that your argument does not hold up to any sort of global standard.
WHO CARES WHAT IDIOCIES THE REST OF THE WORLD DOES? Over here in the USA we have an intelligent and fair and Fact-based and non-Hypocritical set of rules regarding rights and abortions. Why should we change that to something Stupidly Prejudiced, Stupidly Hypocritical, and otherwise idiotic/nonsensical? Are you going to jump off a cliff just because lots of other folks do?

Another flawed argument that doesn't hold up on a global scale is the argument that the words human, person, and human being are separate and uniquely different things.
IGNORANTLY FALSE. Facts are Facts. It is possible for human entities (like hydatidiform moles) to fail to qualify as persons, and it is possible for non-human entities (like intelligent extraterrestrials) to qualify as persons. Such things would be impossible if "human" always/only equated with "person".

There are several languages in the world that do not recognize this trio as separate words.
WE ARE NOT RESPONSIBLE FOR THE STUPID PREJUDICES OF OTHER HUMAN CULTURES. Remember that the Nazis only considered a small subset of humans to fully qualify as persons. Everyone else was something lesser. All you are doing here is pointing out that other cultures are basically doing the same thing (though perhaps not quite as extreme). How is any of that better than a Universe-wide inclusive definition of "person" (which nevertheless excludes ordinary-animal-class entities)?

Political Correctness is absolutely a form of fascism, and in this day and age the left is far more fascistic then the right.
YOUR EXAMPLES ARE EXTREMIST. I'm quite sure I could find similar extreme examples of right-wing fascism. But the only one that matters here, in the Abortion Forum, is their promotion of enslavement of women who don't want to stay pregnant.

ALSO, MOST OF THOSE EXAMPLES ARE RELATED TO IGNORANCE. They often involve Denying of Objectively Verifiable Facts and the embracing of idiotic unproved nonsensical claims. So, should someone who is ignorant of cars be allowed to drive one? What would you tell that person when he or she complains about being punished because of ignorance?

I don't know about you, but I read 1984 and it scared the crap out of me, and I don't want to live in a country in which the thought police are a real thing
KNOWLEDGE IS POWER. Not ignorance. So start learning the Facts you are currently denying!
 
What exactly did I lie about?

- The "person v human" argument does not hold up on a global scale.

- The "person v human" argument does get lost in translation in several languages

- Political correctness is a form of fascism, and it is not limited to the fringe left wingers. If you honestly do not believe that then please read the title of this thread again.



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You indicated that the left (broadbrush)wants punishable offenses for the items you listed.I want you to back up your claim
 
1. Who made that argument? Can you quote it?

2.The question is how are those terms defined.

1. The Roe v Wade argument in a nutshell

A.) A fetus is human, but it is not a person. A person and a human are two different things.

B.) The U.S. Constitution offers no protection of "human rights". The constitution only protects the rights of a "person". The word human is not mentioned in the U.S. Constitution.

This argument does hold true within the confines of the United States. However, as I stated before; there are several English speaking countries in the world that allow one form of abortion or another, and that have governing doctrines that specifically use the term "human rights". All of which make some mention of a right to life. In Ireland right to life is a fundamental "human right" defined as "the right to die of natural causes". In Belize the right to life is categorized among the other natural rights in which "all members of the human family are endowed with by their creator".

So when you apply the Roe v Wade argument on a global scale. The lack of the phrase "human rights" in a countries governing doctrine as it pertains to abortion becomes irrelevant. Which then shifts the argument away from the exact verbiage of our constitution, but rather the intent of framers. Which is subject to a wide array of interpretation.

2. You and I have had this argument several times. Words mean things, context and syntax matter. I don't think we need to start posting long definitions of words and how those words are directly linked to thought patterns and categorizes.



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I am not talking about "freedom of speech", I am talking more about people and groups being punished for opposing abortion. Should people be denied a position or government funding because they oppose abortion? Is opposing abortion as "bad" as being a white supremacist.

I will give some recent examples:

Proposed new Secretary of State (apparently) opposes abortion and several senators think that should disqualify him from being Secretary of State: Senator Jeanne Shaheen



Kamala Harris and other Dems have expressed similar concerns.

Controversial Writer Kevin Williamson was fired by the Atlantic for making anti-abortion comments. Kevin has many issues though it was not until he made these anti-abortion comments that he was fired: Kevin Williamson Explains What Happened at the Atlantic

In Canada, Prime Minister Trudeau (or his puppet masters) requires every group who gets funding for a summer jobs program sign an attestation which says they support abortion: Editorial | The Trudeau government is over-reaching on abortion and summer jobs


I myself support abortion, though I realize it is a complex issue. I do not think people should be punished for opposing it.

Nah....just shoot them

**** free speech, rights all that ****. Just shoot
 
It's a moot point what kafir "respect" - if their inferior beliefs and cultural "values" contradict divine law, then they need to be corrected by their betters.


Kafir "facts" don't matter - "facts" are decided by societies, therefore what kafi call "facts" are irrelevent since they are liars and damned and need to be to changed to reflect what is revealed to be fact via divine revelation.

Kafir "morality" is no different from that of feral beasts or dogs, and they can't be expected to govern themselves. Only those who acknowledge God can be considered "free" to make their own decisions.

Unicornio, The Almighty Magnificently Beneficial and Loving deity I worship disagrees with your points completely.

cba9b88f-4b94-11e7-96c0-c79d83d631f8.png
 
......

According to the left:

- pro life should be a punishable offense

- climate change skepticism should be a punishable offense

- anything remotely homophobic, racist, sexist, or islamaphobic should be a punishable offense

- being openly Christian should be a punishable offense

- being pro 2nd amendment should be a punishable offense

Back up your craziness. I get that there may be a few kooks out there talking about such things - but hell - you diminish every argument you may have by lying.

What exactly did I lie about?

- The "person v human" argument does not hold up on a global scale.

- The "person v human" argument does get lost in translation in several languages

- Political correctness is a form of fascism, and it is not limited to the fringe left wingers. If you honestly do not believe that then please read the title of this thread again.



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I snipped from your post in question.

All that I ask is that you back up the "punishable offense" statements.

Your are broadbrush painting the left with these accusations...you must have some links to indicate your statements are accurate.
 
1. The Roe v Wade argument in a nutshell

A.) A fetus is human, but it is not a person. A person and a human are two different things.

B.) The U.S. Constitution offers no protection of "human rights". The constitution only protects the rights of a "person". The word human is not mentioned in the U.S. Constitution.

This argument does hold true within the confines of the United States. However, as I stated before; there are several English speaking countries in the world that allow one form of abortion or another, and that have governing doctrines that specifically use the term "human rights". All of which make some mention of a right to life. In Ireland right to life is a fundamental "human right" defined as "the right to die of natural causes". In Belize the right to life is categorized among the other natural rights in which "all members of the human family are endowed with by their creator".

So when you apply the Roe v Wade argument on a global scale. The lack of the phrase "human rights" in a countries governing doctrine as it pertains to abortion becomes irrelevant. Which then shifts the argument away from the exact verbiage of our constitution, but rather the intent of framers. Which is subject to a wide array of interpretation.

2. You and I have had this argument several times. Words mean things, context and syntax matter. I don't think we need to start posting long definitions of words and how those words are directly linked to thought patterns and categorizes.



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When you are in Rome you do as the Romans do.
 
I as a person should be able to oppose whatever I want in my personal life, as long as I follow the rules/laws that my employer set forth.
 
I as a person should be able to oppose whatever I want in my personal life, as long as I follow the rules/laws that my employer set forth.

"I as a person"?

Are there non-persons posting here? :lol:
 
"I as a person"?

Are there non-persons posting here? :lol:

Yes there are bots here. Plus some want companies to be able to vote. Next will be companies running for office.
 
Yes there are bots here. Plus some want companies to be able to vote. Next will be companies running for office.

Which posters are bots?
 
Not unless they shoot up an abortion clinic.
 
So you think intimidating females should be legal?

No, I'm pro-women's rights. Maybe I was too glib; but freedom of speech is vital. Now, if you're talking about Faux clinics set up specifically to steer women away from making a choice of their own, that should not be allowed.
 
No, I'm pro-women's rights. Maybe I was too glib; but freedom of speech is vital. Now, if you're talking about Faux clinics set up specifically to steer women away from making a choice of their own, that should not be allowed.

No clinics stop women from making their own choice...
 
Are opter outers intimidating females?

Clearly. The threat is "abort or suffer financial ruin because society does not hold me responsible for my actions". It's a very real time-pressure threat and it's an existential threat in lauding horribly unjust patriarchy.
 
Which posters are bots?

Well I'm not about to go though every poster here but if you think there are no bots that's fine, you win again. I happen to know otherwise. Try being a mod of a site and you'll soon find out how prevalent something's are.
 
Clearly. The threat is "abort or suffer financial ruin because society does not hold me responsible for my actions". It's a very real time-pressure threat and it's an existential threat in lauding horribly unjust patriarchy.

That is why I also offered the very equitable option of repayment.
 
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