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The Right To Life

AYSM said:
So far it seems to be a no show as far as intelligent conversation but that seems to not be uncommon regarding the issue...perhaps we can hope someone will show who is qualified?
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What determines "qualified" for this topic?
 
OP too long, wandered all over. Didnt read it.

Blogs belong somewhere else.
 
It’s all about social capital. In other words, adult women, who are personable and visible everywhere, forming an important part of the society, etc., obviously possess more “social capital” than an impersonable unborn baby. Therefore, it is not a question of morality, but of social capital, that society unjustly places the interests of adult women to not be “burdened” with having to give birth and raise a baby over and above the interest of the unborn baby to simply live. The legalization of abortion is therefore merely a testament to the fact that social capital outweighs basic decency in the contemporary world. Sad but true.
 
Cherub786 said:
It’s all about social capital. In other words, adult women, who are personable and visible everywhere, forming an important part of the society, etc., obviously possess more “social capital” than an impersonable unborn baby. Therefore, it is not a question of morality, but of social capital, that society unjustly places the interests of adult women to not be “burdened” with having to give birth and raise a baby over and above the interest of the unborn baby to simply live. The legalization of abortion is therefore merely a testament to the fact that social capital outweighs basic decency in the contemporary world. Sad but true.
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Social Capital? No... it is indecent to enslave a woman to involuntary servitude against her wish. It is disgusting actually. Any man that favours it doesn't care about his mother and hates his daughters... or worse. Has no daughter and is a oppressive controlling male.
 
Bodhisattva said:
Social Capital? No... it is indecent to enslave a woman to involuntary servitude against her wish. It is disgusting actually. Any man that favours it doesn't care about his mother and hates his daughters... or worse. Has no daughter and is a oppressive controlling male.
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LOL @ involuntary servitude. Since when is raising a child considered slavery? Such a depressing view you have. I would hope most women don't share this view of yours.
 
Cherub786 said:
LOL @ involuntary servitude. Since when is raising a child considered slavery? Such a depressing view you have. I would hope most women don't share this view of yours.
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Most of consider being forced to be pregnant involuntary...

Seems like a basic fact butthere are some that think oppression s funny.
 
Bodhisattva said:
Most of consider being forced to be pregnant involuntary...

Seems like a basic fact butthere are some that think oppression s funny.
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How is a woman forced to be pregnant other than if she was raped?
 
Cherub786 said:
LOL @ involuntary servitude. Since when is raising a child considered slavery? Such a depressing view you have. I would hope most women don't share this view of yours.
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Bod was not talking about raising a child. He was talking about forcing by law a woman to continue an unwanted pregnancy.
Not allowing the woman the choice of an early legal abortion is the essence of involuntary servitude/slavery.

Held to a fate against her will.
Deprived of the right to get out of the situation.
Unable to refuse the work involved.
Receiving no compensation.
That's the very essence of slavery.
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Author: Kent Pitman
 
Cherub786 said:
How is a woman forced to be pregnant other than if she was raped?
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If she wants to abort and is not allowed to... pretty ****ing simple.
 
minnie616 said:
Bod was talking about raising a child. He was talking about forcing by law a woman to continue an unwanted pregnancy.
Not allowing the woman the choice an early legal abortion is the essence of involuntary servitude/slavery.


Author: Kent Pitman
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If the pregnancy is unwanted why did she choose to get pregnant in the first place? To me this just sounds like justifying irresponsibility and punishing an innocent life for the mistake of an adult woman. Such selfishness is despicable. As I said, the only reason “pro-choice” has become normalized is because women as a segment of society have a lot more social capital than unborn babies. If unborn babies had the opportunity to protest, makes their voices heard, carry placards in demonstrations, demand their “right to live” etc. society would have a very different and frankly balanced view of the matter. But at present it is skewed.
 
Cherub786 said:

If the pregnancy is unwanted why did she choose to get pregnant in the first place? To me this just sounds like justifying irresponsibility and punishing an innocent life for the mistake of an adult woman. Such selfishness is despicable. As I said, the only reason “pro-choice” has become normalized is because women as a segment of society have a lot more social capital than unborn babies. If unborn babies had the opportunity to protest, makes their voices heard, carry placards in demonstrations, demand their “right to live” etc. society would have a very different and frankly balanced view of the matter. But at present it is skewed.
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Choose? Do you know anything about real life?
 
Bodhisattva said:
It is a volunteer fire brigade...



Is asking question not an attempt to make sense of it where you come from?



Possibly the issue is not the two who cant make sense of a nonsensical topic.
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Thank you for your service.

Asking is the approach I would take.

Perhaps but maybe we can do better.
 
This is perhaps among one of the top 10 strangest threads in the abortion forum - ever.

Who opened the Wackado gate this morning?

In other news, brrrrr. A rather chilly, rainy morning in Kennebunkport, Maine this morning.
 
Bodhisattva said:
No.

When were aliens introduced to the discussion?

Aliens. Earthquakes. Mexicans. World travel.

I thought we were talking about abortion?
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So are you pro-choice?

Aliens? I believe it was in the post you quoted...how about you let that term slide for the time being if it's an issue...the jury will disregard that comment.

Yes...it's actually about a persons position on abortion...and then some.

Earthquakes and Mexican's I thought I made it clear to disregard them for now...as to World Travel...I'm not sure why you brought that up but I'd imagine the thought might have come to you since you are...half way around the world in New Zealand...lucky you.

My parents loved it and considered moving there but mom and dad were just rich retired folks who wouldn't contribute to the work force so there was something about they'd have to bring the kids with...didn't play much attention to it then...please take it as a side note and not relevant...was just sayin'
 
Bodhisattva said:
What determines "qualified" for this topic?
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To have an intelligent conversation?

Regardless of topic I'd submit the qualifications are relatively the same...I prefer to start with someone who has a position and an open mind...someone who doesn't take too long to ask for clarification on confusing comments rather than resort to...well...lame attacks and such...to go further on this perhaps there's a more appropriate forum?

Note to self...try and keep OP simple.
 
Lursa said:
OP too long, wandered all over. Didnt read it.

Blogs belong somewhere else.
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Yeah...we got that figured out.

I've thought about going with blogging but this seems to be working...perhaps if I keep practicing I'll get better.

In the mean time, we're at a simple point now so, join in if you wish and shorten the OP to "Are you pro-choice, "pro-life" or do you not take a side?
 
minnie616 said:
Bod was not talking about raising a child. He was talking about forcing by law a woman to continue an unwanted pregnancy.
Not allowing the woman the choice of an early legal abortion is the essence of involuntary servitude/slavery.


Author: Kent Pitman
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Thanks for the clarification.
 
Elvira said:
Not really...lol...what do Mexicans and pro-lifers have in common? Nothing that I know of...:confused:
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Many/most Mexicans are Catholic? Is abortion illegal in Mexico as it s in Ireland?

I'm pro choice - and hope the choice will be for birth control.
 
Removable Mind said:
This is perhaps among one of the top 10 strangest threads in the abortion forum - ever.

Who opened the Wackado gate this morning?

In other news, brrrrr. A rather chilly, rainy morning in Kennebunkport, Maine this morning.
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Good morning, it's been said that how my mind works is one of God's little mysteries...the jury is still out...genius or insane?

:lol:

I wish I had qualified for top ten on DP but, I'll try harder...in the mean time...I'm trying to start it over in a way for anyone who wishes to partake.

If you have a side and wish to join in are you pro-choice, "pro-life" or other?
 
Sweden said:
Many/most Mexicans are Catholic? Is abortion illegal in Mexico as it s in Ireland?

I'm pro choice - and hope the choice will be for birth control.
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From the State Department in 2006:

According to the Government's 2000 census, approximately 88 percent of respondents identified themselves as at least nominally Roman Catholic. https://www.state.gov/j/drl/rls/irf/2006/71467.htm

From Wiki: "Abortion in Mexico is a controversial issue. Its legal status varies by state. The procedure is offered on request to any woman with up to twelve weeks into a pregnancy in Mexico City, but is severely restricted in most states." https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Abortion_in_Mexico
 
Cherub786 said:

If the pregnancy is unwanted why did she choose to get pregnant in the first place? To me this just sounds like justifying irresponsibility and punishing an innocent life for the mistake of an adult woman. Such selfishness is despicable. As I said, the only reason “pro-choice” has become normalized is because women as a segment of society have a lot more social capital than unborn babies. If unborn babies had the opportunity to protest, makes their voices heard, carry placards in demonstrations, demand their “right to live” etc. society would have a very different and frankly balanced view of the matter. But at present it is skewed.
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Women do not choose to become pregnant with an unwanted pregnancy.

Over 65 percent of US women of childbearing years use artifical birth control consistently during the months/years they do not want to be pregnant and that's not including the women who cannot become pregnant due to a medical problem or a medical procedure.

Unfortualy , there is no current method of artifical birth control that is 100 percent fail proof.

Long term birth control is close but unless a woman's health insurance will cover the cost the upfront cost is usually between $800 to $1000.
 
There is a remedy...keep your legs together if an unwanted pregnancy repulses you so...
 
Elvira said:
There is a remedy...keep your legs together if an unwanted pregnancy repulses you so...
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Ahhhh.....another slut shamer.

That is helpful.

I am personally against abortion, but hells bells if I am going to make that decision for another woman.

Slut shaming is just not pragmatic. If you actually want to see the numbers of abortions drastically reduced there are ways that could actually be helpful.

Advocate for accessibility and availability of long term birth control options for those most at risk for abortion. The working poor - to rich for Medicaid....to poor for insurance. Like Minnie said, these methods can cost $800-$1000 upfront. about twice the cost of an abortion. Long term birth control options take forgetfulness and misapplication out of the equation for the woman. I would also like to see long term options open up for men.

The other pragmatic option is to help turn an unwanted pregnancy into a wanted one. Show the woman what resources are out there for her to support and nurture her family with safety and security for at least 18 years.

But slut shaming? Seriously?

And frankly.....pregnancy likely does not repulse them. The idea of being pregnant without adequate resources is freaking scary. I should have had an easy pregnancy. Good age, great health, decent resources, good job. I was off nearly 6 months due to several serious complications and surgery unrelated to the complications. I was lucky I kept my job. I ended up 10s of thousands in debt. I kept my place to live because I had credit enough to live on. Even back then (24 years ago) my cobra was over 800 dollars a month. that was almost the amount of my rent. Took me years to dig myself out of the financial hole that was caused by my pregnancy with complications. Now...if I had been working poor? I likely would end up evicted and living in unsafe situations because of the complications. And if you happen to look at stats, most of the women who chose abortion already have a child at home they are struggling to care for. So if that woman was forced to gestate....she would be dragging her born child into that situation as well.

But go ahead and slut shame. Tell women to keep their legs shut. How is that working out as a path to decrease abortions.

BTW....I hear a lot of slut shaming. Where is the "stud shaming"?:lamo
 
Cherub786 said:
If the pregnancy is unwanted why did she choose to get pregnant in the first place?
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Women who do not want to be pregnant do not choose to conceive. JFC.



To me this just sounds like justifying irresponsibility
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Irresponsibility would be birthing a child one cannot or will not care for, or pawning it off on others to raise.


and punishing an innocent life for the mistake of an adult woman.
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You cannot "punish" something that is not sentient and has no concept of doing wrong or being punished.



Such selfishness is despicable.
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Subjective opinion. My subjective opinion says it is despicable to want to force women to gestate and give birth against their will. It's also selfish, trying to impose *your* ethics on her.
 
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