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Oregon is giving free "abortions" for all

year2late said:
People pay for taxes all the time for things they are morally opposed to.

War for instance..

Blood transfusions for instance.

Do people navigate their way around paying taxes for war and blood transfusions?

Tell me how.

Thanks bucky!
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Thanks for comparing terrorists and our enemies with babies.

More proof that you liberals have animosity towards babies in the womb. We go to war because our enemies want to kill us. Babies don't want to kill us.
 
Bucky said:
Thanks for comparing terrorists and our enemies with babies.

More proof that you liberals have animosity towards babies in the womb. We go to war because our enemies want to kill us. Babies don't want to kill us.
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Posting nothing but ridiculous lies and twisted nonsense really REALLY helps your cause. Keep it up.
Your so full of "WINNING".
 
Dragonfly said:
Posting nothing but ridiculous lies and twisted nonsense really REALLY helps your cause. Keep it up.
Your so full of "WINNING".
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Hey, you guys support killing babies with down syndrome.
 
Bucky said:
Thanks for comparing terrorists and our enemies with babies.

More proof that you liberals have animosity towards babies in the womb. We go to war because our enemies want to kill us. Babies don't want to kill us.
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The comparison was only in you brain,

My taxes went to support a war I wanted to have nothing to do with, Nothing. I knew that there was no clear goal. I knew that destabilizing of that regime would leave us in a quagmire of epic proportions. Hell, many in GWB inner circle knew the same and told HWB not to continue into Iraq after Kuwait for that very reason. I was compleely opposed to the war because I believed it would inevitably destabilize and cause widespread death , maiming and destruction.

Turns out my belief was beyond accurate. Iraq became the ideal training/breeding ground for terrorists.

I am comparing using tax dollars for one thing that one believes is absolutely wrong to something I believe is absolutely wrong.

I have no animosity for a fetus. But while the fetus is totally dependent on the physiology of the woman, it is her choice what to do with her body.

On the other hand....once a baby is born....I think that the person should have access what it needs for its health and well being....even if it means more tax.

My preference is to prevent unwanted pregnancy in the first place. I would like to see long term birth control be as accessible and available as possible. Does that make me an enemy a potential fetus?:lamo

Not my state. Not my decision. But I do not have a problem with theirs. I hope they offer free or low cost long term contraception to low income individuals to prevent further abortions.
 
Bucky said:
Oregon abortion law funds procedures for illegal immigrants | Fox News

Absolutely absurd. Free abortions with no deductibles or co-payments. Not only will more lives be killed, but taxpayers and insurance companies will be funding this monstrosity of legislation.

*Increase the cost of health care
*Increase the number of deaths
*Force people against their religious beliefs and principles.

Oregonians, I apologize.
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Good, health care shouldnt be excluded from health insurance simply because some peoples feelings disagree with it.
With that said there are financial restriction laws on the books that this my push the limits of or violate (i honestly dont know), if thats the case then this bill must be repealed or the best cases change those financial laws because they are stupid.


*facts to prove these claims please, thanks!
:popcorn2:
 
Bucky said:
I don't support abortion or illegal immigration. Why should I be forced to pay taxes supporting both??
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Why should I be forced to pay taxes for roads, schools and welfare?
 
GEIxBattleRifle said:
Why should I be forced to pay taxes for roads, schools and welfare?
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Those are things we carry a shared interest/risk in. I am having a debate with jonny5 in the healthcare forum about paying for that:

jonny5 said:
Thats nonsense, Bucky. I pay for my own healthcare. Why should I pay for others? When did the states agree for their taxes to be used to fund healthcare?
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jonny5 said:
Nope, cant support anything that forces me to pay for other peoples stuff other what we agreed to in the constitution. Feel free pay for other peoples stuff on your own.
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The problem people need to understand is that abortion isn't healthcare. The ONLY way you can argue that abortion is healthcare is if you can argue me that saving the mother's life requires killing the baby.
 
Tanngrisnir said:
I think roads and bridges are the devil's handiwork! Why should I be forced to pay taxes for them!?!?!?
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Good roads and bridges are necessary to save lives. Abortion doesn't do that!
 
year2late said:
The comparison was only in you brain,

My taxes went to support a war I wanted to have nothing to do with, Nothing. I knew that there was no clear goal. I knew that destabilizing of that regime would leave us in a quagmire of epic proportions. Hell, many in GWB inner circle knew the same and told HWB not to continue into Iraq after Kuwait for that very reason. I was compleely opposed to the war because I believed it would inevitably destabilize and cause widespread death , maiming and destruction.

Turns out my belief was beyond accurate. Iraq became the ideal training/breeding ground for terrorists.

I am comparing using tax dollars for one thing that one believes is absolutely wrong to something I believe is absolutely wrong.

I have no animosity for a fetus. But while the fetus is totally dependent on the physiology of the woman, it is her choice what to do with her body.

On the other hand....once a baby is born....I think that the person should have access what it needs for its health and well being....even if it means more tax.

My preference is to prevent unwanted pregnancy in the first place. I would like to see long term birth control be as accessible and available as possible. Does that make me an enemy a potential fetus?:lamo

Not my state. Not my decision. But I do not have a problem with theirs. I hope they offer free or low cost long term contraception to low income individuals to prevent further abortions.
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FYI, your money isn't going towards a "war," it is going towards national security and a strong defense. This post smells of partisan hackery. Did you object when Clinton was using using our troops to globally expand democracy in Africa? Ya, didn't think so.
 
Bucky said:
FYI, your money isn't going towards a "war," it is going towards national security and a strong defense. This post smells of partisan hackery. Did you object when Clinton was using using our troops to globally expand democracy in Africa? Ya, didn't think so.
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Partisan hackary? Sounds like the Iraq war.
 
Dragonfly said:
It was? How so? Where's the "question"? Not even a question mark for punctuation.

Here's the complete and unedited post:




Care to explain a bit more what you were actually trying to say?
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You honestly don't see it do you?

Though I don't think I need to explain anything, given either using a question mark or a pause at the end can mean the same. Though it is much harder to get such things across in script then it is by actually saying it.
 
prometeus said:
How do you come up with this retarded crap?
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Well seeing as late term has been so colorfully called "Euthanizing Children" by some of the clinics down in Mexico. I tend to find the idea of a woman so late in her term that the baby could actually survive outside, getting an abortion a rather abominable thing.
 
Bucky said:
I don't support abortion or illegal immigration. Why should I be forced to pay taxes supporting both??
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You don't get to decide where your taxes go. You get to vote for whoever agrees with you and that's it. Don't like it? Suck it up, buttercup.
Yeesh. You want a referendum every time taxes are spent?
 
Bucky said:
The problem people need to understand is that abortion isn't healthcare. The ONLY way you can argue that abortion is healthcare is if you can argue me that saving the mother's life requires killing the baby.
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Pregnancy is condition that has inherent risk.

People that choose abortion frequently have substandard access to medical care, are barely able to make ends meet. Loss of a paycheck could be the difference between paying rent and potential eviction. It could mean inability to pay phone bills, utilities and such. If you think substandard access and marginal employment do not increase risk in pregnancy....you are dead wrong.

I was right age, right health, good steady job, good social support. I chose to remain pregnant. I ended up with several major complications...and unrelated to those complications I needed a C-section. I was off work almost 6 months - FMLA lasts 12 weeks. Luckily my job was kept open for me. Most women would not be so lucky, Pregnancy causes risk on many levels. I was young and healthy and got away with my life....and my kidneys. I had good access to great medical care. I did not have to decide whether to skip a doctor's appointment in order to get an extra shift to pay rent. I have several medical issues due to my pregnancy that are still apparent over 20 years later.

So, pardon me if I roll my eyes when you say abortion isn't about health care. Abortion will clearly prevent all of the complications I suffered....ALL OF THEM. Would have prevented my kidney damage, vascular damage, and major surgery.

I can not and will not assume to answer for another person what he or she should be willing to risk.
 
Oborosen said:
You honestly don't see it do you?

Though I don't think I need to explain anything, given either using a question mark or a pause at the end can mean the same. Though it is much harder to get such things across in script then it is by actually saying it.
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:roll:


So actually say it. Explain exactly what you were attempting to say.
 
Dragonfly said:
:roll:


So actually say it. Explain exactly what you were attempting to say.
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IF THE MAJORITY OF THOSE ACTUALLY TURNED OUT TO BE LATE TERM ABORTIONS, THAT WOULD REALLY BE ****ED UP........

Was that clear enough?
 
Oborosen said:
IF THE MAJORITY OF THOSE ACTUALLY TURNED OUT TO BE LATE TERM ABORTIONS, THAT WOULD REALLY BE ****ED UP........

Was that clear enough?
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One thing's for sure. It's about as stupid as it can get.

So my original response to your lame post stands. You obviously don't let FACTS cloud your perspective.
 
Dragonfly said:
One thing's for sure. It's about as stupid as it can get.

So my original response to your lame post stands. You obviously don't let FACTS cloud your perspective.
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That's why I said if, I didn't say they were a majority.
 
Oborosen said:
IF THE MAJORITY OF THOSE ACTUALLY TURNED OUT TO BE LATE TERM ABORTIONS, THAT WOULD REALLY BE ****ED UP........

Was that clear enough?
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I think you are being clear....it is hard for many of us to even understand why you would think this is even the remotest of possibilities. It is an oddly messed up thing to say that totally ignores reality.
 
Bucky said:
Those are things we carry a shared interest/risk in. I am having a debate with jonny5 in the healthcare forum about paying for that:





The problem people need to understand is that abortion isn't healthcare. The ONLY way you can argue that abortion is healthcare is if you can argue me that saving the mother's life requires killing the baby.
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My argument has always been that we should only pay for the things we use or consent to pay for. We all agreed to pay for national defense, for example. We never agreed to pay for abortion. That is the person having the procedures responsibility. If youre talking about emergency services, thats a tougher debate. Its certainly not a national issue though. Youre state or local area can decide that for themselves.
 
jonny5 said:
My argument has always been that we should only pay for the things we use or consent to pay for. We all agreed to pay for national defense, for example. We never agreed to pay for abortion. That is the person having the procedures responsibility. If youre talking about emergency services, thats a tougher debate. Its certainly not a national issue though. Youre state or local area can decide that for themselves.
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Spoken like a true libertarian.;)
 
year2late said:
Spoken like a true libertarian.;)
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He's actually right.

But I do not appreciate you hijacking my thread regarding the Iraq War. Invading Iraq was an appropriate response given the horrific terrorist attacks against our country. Remember Saddam Hussein and his regime had WMDs. He likely hid them very well or transferred them to one of his friends.

Regardless, we were making good progress in Iraq until Barry Obama waved the white surrender flag and announced our plans to our enemies. IMO it was shameful to do that. When he became president he started an apology campaign groveling and kissing the feet of our enemies. He operated on weakness which is no suprise.
 
jonny5 said:
My argument has always been that we should only pay for the things we use or consent to pay for. We all agreed to pay for national defense, for example. We never agreed to pay for abortion. That is the person having the procedures responsibility. If youre talking about emergency services, thats a tougher debate. Its certainly not a national issue though. Youre state or local area can decide that for themselves.
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I would agree abortion should be seperated from health care. I think however for issues like cancer, we have a shared interest in paying for that.
 
Bucky said:
I don't support abortion or illegal immigration. Why should I be forced to pay taxes supporting both??
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Bucky said:
He's actually right.

But I do not appreciate you hijacking my thread regarding the Iraq War. Invading Iraq was an appropriate response given the horrific terrorist attacks against our country. Remember Saddam Hussein and his regime had WMDs. He likely hid them very well or transferred them to one of his friends.

Regardless, we were making good progress in Iraq until Barry Obama waved the white surrender flag and announced our plans to our enemies. IMO it was shameful to do that. When he became president he started an apology campaign groveling and kissing the feet of our enemies. He operated on weakness which is no suprise.
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If you consider what I did to be "hijacking" , then you hijacked your own thread. You took the thread down a path about paying taxes for things we do not agree with. And now you are butt hurt because I expanded on YOUR line of thinking.

Fact of the matter is as tax payers we pay for things we may be morally against. We can attempt to elect officials that that will respect out POV but nobody will ever be completely happy...so the best we can do is to live out own lives in a way that respects our personal morality.

And back to the matter at hand. Oregon elected officials that have allowed this to happen. Since this is a state and not a federal issue, I have to wonder what the voters of Oregon feel. I also have to wonder if abortion rates will stay about the same or drastically increase.

I will hope that they also will be financially helping out lower income women who wish to avoid abortion with assistance with the most effective contraception (long term forms).
 
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