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Pregnancy Is the "Silver Lining" of Rape[W:170]

Re: Pregnancy Is the "Silver Lining" of Rape

blarg said:
why would abortion make you a scum bag or a psycho?
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Killing other innocent human beings in cold blood, in direct violation of their human rights?

Gee.

Don't worry, even though you have no respect for others, if someone were to commit a premeditated homicide on you, I'd still want their ass in prison forever.
 
Re: Pregnancy Is the "Silver Lining" of Rape

JayDubya said:
Killing other innocent human beings in cold blood, in direct violation of their human rights?

Gee.

Don't worry, even though you have no respect for others, if someone were to commit a premeditated homicide on you, I'd still want their ass in prison forever.
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why give human rights to that kind of human?
 
Re: Pregnancy Is the "Silver Lining" of Rape

blarg said:
why give human rights to that kind of human?
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Nice bigotry.

Human rights aren't "given."

They have them because they are human beings.
 
Re: Pregnancy Is the "Silver Lining" of Rape

JayDubya said:
Nice bigotry.

Human rights aren't "given."

They have them because they are human beings.
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we made them up becase we dont want people ****ing us over becase of are thoughts and feelings fetuses dont seem to have those like we do

things we eat seem to have more going on in that department
 
Re: Pregnancy Is the "Silver Lining" of Rape

blarg said:
we made them up becase we dont want people ****ing us over becase of are thoughts and feelings fetuses dont seem to have those like we do

things we eat seem to have more going on in that department
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By that standard it would be okay to eat newborns.

:shrug:

No, that's dumb, they're human.
 
Re: Pregnancy Is the "Silver Lining" of Rape

JayDubya said:
By that standard it would be okay to eat newborns.

:shrug:

No, that's dumb, they're human.
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ya i know they are human im trying to get you to explain why thats important

well it would be worng to eat the brains but why would it be ok to eat something else wiht the same kind of thoughts and feelings and not a new born

its unpleasant becase they are human but your not giving me a clear moral reaosn other then saying human over and over

its unpleasant to force women to carry a fetus to

so keep going please
 
Re: Pregnancy Is the "Silver Lining" of Rape

So, we're off and running on yet another thread about abortion.
It's murder, I tell you, murder!
No, no, it's just a bunch of cells!

The issue is whether a pregnancy that is the result of a rape is a "silver lining" of that rape. Is a baby always a great blessing regardless of the circumstances of the conception?
 
Re: Pregnancy Is the "Silver Lining" of Rape

Dittohead not! said:
So, we're off and running on yet another thread about abortion.
It's murder, I tell you, murder!
No, no, it's just a bunch of cells!

The issue is whether a pregnancy that is the result of a rape is a "silver lining" of that rape. Is a baby always a great blessing regardless of the circumstances of the conception?
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i guess that would depend on how you feel about it so not always for every one but always for everyone for this politician it would seem
 
Re: Pregnancy Is the "Silver Lining" of Rape

Dittohead not! said:
So, we're off and running on yet another thread about abortion.
It's murder, I tell you, murder!
No, no, it's just a bunch of cells!

The issue is whether a pregnancy that is the result of a rape is a "silver lining" of that rape. Is a baby always a great blessing regardless of the circumstances of the conception?
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The state rep you quoted and appear comfortable maligning was asserting that a human being created in rape still has the same value as any other.

I know some folks disagree, clearly, but theirs (clearly yours) is not a morally defensible view.
 
Re: Pregnancy Is the "Silver Lining" of Rape

JayDubya said:
The state rep you quoted and appear comfortable maligning was asserting that a human being created in rape still has the same value as any other.

I know some folks disagree, clearly, but theirs (clearly yours) is not a morally defensible view.
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why is it not defensible?
 
Re: Pregnancy Is the "Silver Lining" of Rape

JayDubya said:
The state rep you quoted and appear comfortable maligning was asserting that a human being created in rape still has the same value as any other.

I know some folks disagree, clearly, but theirs (clearly yours) is not a morally defensible view.
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She was asserting that a pregnancy started by rape was a blessing.

and you think that's a morally defensible view, really?
 
Re: Pregnancy Is the "Silver Lining" of Rape

Dittohead not! said:
She was asserting that a pregnancy started by rape was a blessing.

and you think that's a morally defensible view, really?
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She was asserting that every kid is a blessing, because she truly believes that. I don't think anyone or anything is a literal "blessing," but I agree wholeheartedly with the basic underlying concept that humans have intrinsic value and just because your dad is a douchebag rapist does not mean the kid has no value.

Her view is inclusive and supporting equality.

Your view is repugnant inequality.

Yes, hers is moral. Yours is not.
 
Re: Pregnancy Is the "Silver Lining" of Rape

JayDubya said:
She was asserting that every kid is a blessing, because she truly believes that. I don't think anyone or anything is a literal "blessing," but I agree wholeheartedly with the basic underlying concept that humans have intrinsic value and just because your dad is a douchebag rapist does not mean the kid has no value.

Her view is inclusive and supporting equality.

Your view is repugnant inequality.

Yes, hers is moral. Yours is not.
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Then by all means let's bring back the good old days when there was no effective birth control and most women had five to ten, sometimes more, babies. Add that to modern medicine that can reduce child mortality way below what it was 200 years ago, and let's see what happens to the human population.
 
Re: Pregnancy Is the "Silver Lining" of Rape

Dittohead not! said:
Then by all means let's bring back the good old days when there was no effective birth control and most women had five to ten, sometimes more, babies. Add that to modern medicine that can reduce child mortality way below what it was 200 years ago, and let's see what happens to the human population.
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Population levels?

:shrug:

Why are you getting all macro? I suspect because in addition to not caring about individual human rights very much, you're also some kind of malthusian environmentalist type.

In which case, boy, is your "lean" ever wrong.

Regardless, your comments about birth control and population are an absolute non-sequitur, having nothing to do with the topic at hand.
 
Re: Pregnancy Is the "Silver Lining" of Rape

JayDubya said:
Population levels?

:shrug:

Why are you getting all macro? I suspect because in addition to not caring about individual human rights very much, you're also some kind of malthusian environmentalist type.

In which case, boy, is your "lean" ever wrong.

Regardless, your comments about birth control and population are an absolute non-sequitur, having nothing to do with the topic at hand.
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So, now we've come full circle, as usual.

If every kid is a blessing, then it follows every couple needs as many blessings as possible. That leads inevitably to what you're calling "all macro." It's not possible to separate the macro from the micro, not on this issue.

The issue at hand is not abortion, never was abortion. The issue is that a pregnancy is or isn't a "silver lining" to the act of rape. "Look, you were raped, that must be terrible, but at least now you're pregnant! What a great thing that is, aren't you glad you were raped? Otherwise, you wouldn't have the chance to become a mother. Now, go out and be fruitful and replenish the Earth, maybe get raped again and produce yet another child that you must take care of on your own." See if you can remain mentally stable.

What hogwash.
 
Re: Pregnancy Is the "Silver Lining" of Rape

Actually inherent to the metaphor is the acknowledgment that rape is bad.

The kid of course is blameless, innocent, could indeed be loved and is as worthy of love and basic human rights as anyone else.

They are not, as you clearly believe, just human trash to be thrown away because their fathers are evil men.
 
Re: Pregnancy Is the "Silver Lining" of Rape

JayDubya said:
I mean what else would you have people say or think?
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Abort the fetus and make a casserole?





Maybe the silly woman should think long enough to realize that not everyone thinks that a few growing cells = a "person". Maybe she should think for a half a second and realize that someone who is raped is rather unlikely to count a resulting pregnancy as some kind of blessing, because not everyone is that lost in religious delusion.
 
Re: Pregnancy Is the "Silver Lining" of Rape

This is one of those time where if you are a Republican or self-professed conservative, take a deep breath, and say, look, sometimes the right just gets it completely bat****, crazy wrong. Don't defend this woman out of some party pride. Suck it up. Admit it. There is nothing redeemable about her comments. Nothing.
 
Re: Pregnancy Is the "Silver Lining" of Rape

Mr Person said:
Abort the fetus and make a casserole?
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Well I suppose they theoretically could say that if they were stupid and trashy.


Maybe the silly woman should think long enough to realize that not everyone thinks that a few growing cells = a "person".
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I'm sure she's aware morons and bigots exist. That's why personhood laws need to be inclusive like this, not exclusive.

Maybe she should think for a half a second and realize that someone who is raped is rather unlikely to count a resulting pregnancy as some kind of blessing, because not everyone is that lost in religious delusion.
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:shrug:

The comments in their entirety have a clear, thoughtful, and morally valid meaning.

She put more thought into her words than you did in dismissing them without understanding.
 
Re: Pregnancy Is the "Silver Lining" of Rape

ibelsd said:
This is one of those time where if you are a Republican or self-professed conservative, take a deep breath, and say, look, sometimes the right just gets it completely bat****, crazy wrong. Don't defend this woman out of some party pride. Suck it up. Admit it. There is nothing redeemable about her comments. Nothing.
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There is nothing wrong with her comments.

Nothing.
 
Re: Pregnancy Is the "Silver Lining" of Rape

JayDubya said:
There is nothing wrong with her comments.

Nothing.
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I hope you one day you get married and that you and your wife are treated to a brand new silver lining... Yup, nothing wrong with that.



P.S. I am making a rhetorical point, not legitimately hoping your future wife gets raped. I just want to clarify as that'd be a truly horrible thing no matter your position on the topic.
 
Re: Pregnancy Is the "Silver Lining" of Rape

ibelsd said:
I hope you one day you get married and that you and your wife are treated to a brand new silver lining... Yup, nothing wrong with that.



P.S. I am making a rhetorical point, not legitimately hoping your future wife gets raped. I just want to clarify as that'd be a truly horrible thing no matter your position on the topic.
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That postscript does nothing to reduce the horror of what you said.

I am married and we do have a kid and while I am an atheist and thus wouldn't call her a "blessing," I love my kiddo to pieces. She wasn't planned and we weren't financially ready but so ****ing what, here she was, so we took care of her and loved her. It's what you do.

Considering events in my wife's past she would be horrified if she were to log into her account and read that garbage, but no worries, she long since stopped reading posts here thanks in part to noting the high volume of douchebaggery.

Incidentally, she is agnostic, she introduced and converted me to libertarianism, and yeah, were something like that to ever somehow happen, we already discussed long ago what we would do. Neither of us would dream of killing a kid for our own personal benefit.

Though once again the odds of that happening are nil given the smoking hole she would render into the head of any fool who tried... her accuracy with her pistol is pretty impressive.
 
Re: Pregnancy Is the "Silver Lining" of Rape

JayDubya said:
That postscript does nothing to reduce the horror of what you said.

I am married and we do have a kid and while I am an atheist and thus wouldn't call her a "blessing," I love my kiddo to pieces. She wasn't planned and we weren't financially ready but so ****ing what, here she was, so we took care of her and loved her. It's what you do.

Considering events in my wife's past she would be horrified if she were to log into her account and read that garbage, but no worries, she long since stopped reading posts here thanks in part to noting the high volume of douchebaggery.

Incidentally, she is agnostic, she introduced and converted me to libertarianism, and yeah, were something like that to ever somehow happen, we already discussed long ago what we would do. Neither of us would dream of killing a kid for our own personal benefit.

Though once again the odds of that happening are nil given the smoking hole she would render into the head of any fool who tried... her accuracy with her pistol is pretty impressive.
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Your perfectly reasonable reaction underscores my point. Calling a pregnancy by rape a silver lining is absurd.
 
Re: Pregnancy Is the "Silver Lining" of Rape

ibelsd said:
Your perfectly reasonable reaction underscores my point. Calling a pregnancy by rape a silver lining is absurd.
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The state rep's statement in context is not absurd in the least, nor worthy of even a bit of ire.

She insulted no one. She wished nothing which is negative on anyone. She asserted the universal dignity and value of human life, and is trying to do what government is supposed to do, protect innocent humans against aggressive violence.

In this, at least, as I know nothing else about her, she is absolutely commendable.


Actually I take that back. I know from this recording she is a hospice nurse.
 
Re: Pregnancy Is the "Silver Lining" of Rape

JayDubya said:
The state rep's statement in context is not absurd in the least, nor worthy of even a bit of ire.

She insulted no one. She wished nothing which is negative on anyone. She asserted the universal dignity and value of human life, and is trying to do what government is supposed to do, protect innocent humans against aggressive violence.

In this, at least, as I know nothing else about her, she is absolutely commendable.


Actually I take that back. I know from this recording she is a hospice nurse.
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Check. So, when someone wishes this "blessing" on you, it is deuchbaggery, but when someone calls it a "blessing" to others it is commendable. At the very least, it is just insensitive. The optics are terrible. I am not anti-abortion. I just recognize that when some government official comes out and makes a statement like this, it is ridiculous. It reeks of ultra-ideological pomposity. You just don't say it. I am not entirely unsympathetic to her position even. If someone thinks abortion is murder, then how the pregnancy occurred is irrelevant which is the sort of the point she is making. However, when put in terms of, the pregnancy is a silver lining... uh... no. That is just creepy religious fundamentalism expressed in the creepiest terms.

Let's put this another way. You are taking the position that her words were commendable because her assertion is reasonable. However, you called my word choice an example of deuchbaggery, ignoring the specific point I was trying to make. I ask for consistency. Is the assertion more important than how it is expressed or is the form of expression more important? Should this be true for a public official or should they be striving for a higher standard of communication?
 
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