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40 Days for Life campaign begins today[W:127]

Re: 40 Days for Life campaign begins today

If you're against abortion, don't have one.

If you're against rape, just don't rape anyone.
 
Re: 40 Days for Life campaign begins today

Off topic. There are threads dedicated to that topic, this isn't one of them.

Is it? Both parties mixed the ingredients for a cake and both made a cake. Your argument is that the woman can opt-out even if she made a cake, so logically the man can too. You however don't believe such a thing, so your argument is at best inconsistent.
 
Re: 40 Days for Life campaign begins today

https://40daysforlife.com/mission/

As always, this entire endeavor a religious based quest. Go figure. :roll:

Stop trying to force your religious beliefs on others.

If you're against abortion, don't have one.
Most pro-choice people don't have abortions either.

After that, shut up and move along.
Your religion is your Constitutional right, but I also have the Constitutional right NOT follow your beck and call.

This thread would have been better placed in the "Religious Discussion" forum.

I didn't begin this thread to initiate a discussion on religion but, rather, to announce the beginning of the current 40 Days for Life campaign for anyone who might not know about it and might wish to participate.
 
Re: 40 Days for Life campaign begins today

Is it? Both parties mixed the ingredients for a cake and both made a cake. Your argument is that the woman can opt-out even if she made a cake, so logically the man can too. You however don't believe such a thing, so your argument is at best inconsistent.

The topic of the thread is the 40 days for life campaign.

Please show where I have said the man shouldn't be able to opt out.
 
Re: 40 Days for Life campaign begins today

I don't identity as pro-choice because I find the arguments they present to be vile.
REALLY? The very simplest pro-choice argument is this: "Abortion should be legal because in this day-and-age there is no valid reason to make it illegal." What's vile about that?
 
Re: 40 Days for Life campaign begins today

REALLY? The very simplest pro-choice argument is this: "Abortion should be legal because in this day-and-age there is no valid reason to make it illegal." What's vile about that?

a) Pretending that preventing the killing of innocent human beings is not a valid reason

b) The barbarism of this day and age that you wish to perpetuate
 
Re: 40 Days for Life campaign begins today

Is it? Both parties mixed the ingredients for a cake and both made a cake.
BAD ANALOGY. An ovum outweighs a sperm by easily 70,000 times, which means the woman provides almost all the ingredients for the cake, plus the kitchen in which the baking is done. You are implying an equality that simply doesn't exist.
 
Re: 40 Days for Life campaign begins today

a) Pretending that preventing the killing of innocent human beings
STANDARD STUPID LIE; the unborn are neither "innocent" nor "beings", and I've presented to you the proof of those facts numerous times. Why do you keep Ignoring Facts and Lying?

b) The barbarism of this day and age that you wish to perpetuate
THERE IS BARBARISM IS KILLING PERSONS, BUT NOT NECESSARILY IN KILLING MINDLESS ANIMALS. There can be barbarism in how one goes about killing a mindless animal, which is why I've recommended that the very first step in any abortion procedure should be to cut the nerve-lacking umbilical cord, and wait about 30 seconds for the brain to first shut down from lack of oxygen, and then 10 more minutes for it to die, totally painlessly, from lack of oxygen.
 
Re: 40 Days for Life campaign begins today

BAD ANALOGY. An ovum outweighs a sperm by easily 70,000 times, which means the woman provides almost all the ingredients for the cake, plus the kitchen in which the baking is done. You are implying an equality that simply doesn't exist.

I wasn't paying much attention to who added more to the equation since it doesn't matter to my argument.
 
Re: 40 Days for Life campaign begins today

THERE IS BARBARISM IS KILLING PERSONS, BUT NOT NECESSARILY IN KILLING MINDLESS ANIMALS.

There is barbarism in your misanthropy calling human beings mere "mindless animals."
 
Re: 40 Days for Life campaign begins today

I wasn't paying much attention to who added more to the equation since it doesn't matter to my argument.
OKAY. We both know that what actually matters is the incredible degree of stupidity exhibited by the man, who expects the woman to take all birth-control precautions while KNOWING that if a birth happens that he doesn't want, he will be on the hook for child support for 18 years. THAT STUPIDITY is why he must pay.

You do know there are other equivalent short-term stupidities with long sentences, like bank robbery....
 
Re: 40 Days for Life campaign begins today

There is barbarism in your misanthropy calling human beings
THEY DON'T QUALIFY AS "BEINGS". If you want to claim they do, let's see some evidence supporting that claim!

mere "mindless animals."
FACTS ARE FACTS. If you want to claim an unborn human, at the stage when most abortions are done, has a mind, let's see some evidence supporting that claim!
 
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Re: 40 Days for Life campaign begins today

OKAY. We both know that what actually matters is the incredible degree of stupidity exhibited by the man, who expects the woman to take all birth-control precautions while KNOWING that if a birth happens that he doesn't want, he will be on the hook for child support for 18 years. THAT STUPIDITY is why he must pay.

You do know there are other equivalent stupidities with long sentences, like bank robbery....

So is the woman stupid for getting pregnant when she didn't want a kid?
 
Re: 40 Days for Life campaign begins today

So is the woman stupid for getting pregnant when she didn't want a kid?
OF COURSE. Contraception is so much less expensive than abortion, after all (stupidity applies if contraception wasn't applied). And the pregnancy is hers, not the man's, entirely because of the enormous disparity in contributions toward it.
 
Re: 40 Days for Life campaign begins today

OF COURSE. Contraception is so much less expensive than abortion, after all (stupidity applies if contraception wasn't applied). And the pregnancy is hers, not the man's, entirely because of the enormous disparity in contributions toward it.

Wait a minute. Are you claiming that she has ownership of the pregnancy because she contributes more? Why would his contributions be voided out because she added more to it's creation? The only way the ownership argument works to void out the man is if you look at control over the pregnancy, but simply looking at contributions still leaves him with part ownership. Regardless of that side topic however, you just admitted that you're playing both sides of the coin with your argument. On one side you refuse to budge to allow choice because of stupidity and on the other you ignore stupidity and allow choice.
 
Re: 40 Days for Life campaign begins today

Again, you should read some of my other posts. I don't identity as pro-choice because I find the arguments they present to be vile.

You have essentially admitted to being anti choice in your response to an antichoicer:

I'm on your side, you know.
 
Re: 40 Days for Life campaign begins today

Wait a minute. Are you claiming that she has ownership of the pregnancy because she contributes more? Why would his contributions be voided out because she added more to it's creation?
HE ADDED SOME DNA THAT GOT COPIED VIA HER RESOURCES. Technically, the man could legitimately claim ownership of 1/2 the DNA of one single cell, because that is all his sperm actually contributed. When a human body typically contains trillions of cells, many of which are sloughed off each day, it should be obvious that the man's contribution is totally trivial.

The only way the ownership argument works to void out the man is if you look at control over the pregnancy, but simply looking at contributions still leaves him with part ownership.
SEE ABOVE.

Regardless of that side topic however, you just admitted that you're playing both sides of the coin with your argument.
NOPE; I'M SIMPLY LOOKING AT A BIGGER PICTURE. It has more factors than what you've so far brought to the table. Which is one reason, several messages ago, I specified "a birth happens that he doesn't want" instead of "a pregnancy happens that he doesn't want". He has no control over what the woman does with her pregnancy. He CAN influence her, however, by trying to convince her to get an abortion. Remember a movie called "Indecent Proposal"? It seems to me quite possible to convince a woman to abort, if the man pays her enough....

On one side you refuse to budge to allow choice because of stupidity and on the other you ignore stupidity and allow choice.
INACCURATE; On the one side the man loses choice about a pregnancy for reasons having nothing to do with stupidity (see 1st paragraph above). It is those same reasons that give the woman a choice, regardless of her own stupidity (she might be deliberately trapping the man, remember --and the man can be even more stupid to ignore that that possibility). Child support can only happen after a live birth --and about 1/6 of all confirmed pregnancies don't result in live births, even discounting the possibility of aborting. The man most definitely has plenty of opportunity to convince the woman to abort --if he doesn't even try, then isn't that tantamount to accepting a future ruling to pay child support?
 
Re: 40 Days for Life campaign begins today

If you make a cake on accident you still have a cake. It's best to know what you're doing so don't accidentally make a cake.

How does a person "accidentally make a cake"?

Sounds like you have zero idea of what baking entails.

So is the woman stupid for getting pregnant when she didn't want a kid?

Probably 99% of all sex occurs when the participants do not want a kid.
 
Re: 40 Days for Life campaign begins today

There is barbarism in your misanthropy calling human beings mere "mindless animals."

If the human does not have a mind then how is it inaccurate to call it a mindless animal?

OOoohhhh... feel the BURN JAydub... feel the BURRRNNNNN
 
Re: 40 Days for Life campaign begins today

How does a person "accidentally make a cake"?

Sounds like you have zero idea of what baking entails.

You're taking it a bit too literal. :lol: The point is that accidentally doing something doesn't make it something that didn't happen.

Probably 99% of all sex occurs when the participants do not want a kid.

I'm fully aware of that. So what? If the woman has some awareness of her cycle and doesn't let him finish in her vagina she won't get pregnant. Again, if you check off all the necessary boxes you're asking for trouble.
 
Re: 40 Days for Life campaign begins today

You're taking it a bit too literal. :lol: The point is that accidentally doing something doesn't make it not something that happened.

It is not like people accidentally carry around pre-made cake batter and then accidentally pour it into a baking dish and then accidentally put it into a pre-heated over and then accidentally take it out after the precise time is up!!! :lol:
 
Re: 40 Days for Life campaign begins today

HE ADDED SOME DNA THAT GOT COPIED VIA HER RESOURCES. Technically, the man could legitimately claim ownership of 1/2 the DNA of one single cell, because that is all his sperm actually contributed. When a human body typically contains trillions of cells, many of which are sloughed off each day, it should be obvious that the man's contribution is totally trivial.

So it's so trivial that you support imposing child support payments for it? Ok?


NOPE; I'M SIMPLY LOOKING AT A BIGGER PICTURE. It has more factors than what you've so far brought to the table. Which is one reason, several messages ago, I specified "a birth happens that he doesn't want" instead of "a pregnancy happens that he doesn't want". He has no control over what the woman does with her pregnancy. He CAN influence her, however, by trying to convince her to get an abortion. Remember a movie called "Indecent Proposal"? It seems to me quite possible to convince a woman to abort, if the man pays her enough....

I've never watched that movie, but from the looks of it the movie is not about abortion.

INACCURATE; On the one side the man loses choice about a pregnancy for reasons having nothing to do with stupidity (see 1st paragraph above). It is those same reasons that give the woman a choice, regardless of her own stupidity (she might be deliberately trapping the man, remember --and the man can be even more stupid to ignore that that possibility). Child support can only happen after a live birth --and about 1/6 of all confirmed pregnancies don't result in live births, even discounting the possibility of aborting. The man most definitely has plenty of opportunity to convince the woman to abort --if he doesn't even try, then isn't that tantamount to accepting a future ruling to pay child support?

Seriously? So the man has to try to convince her to abort in your mind? So it's somehow worse for the man to just allow her to decide on her own as he goes forward with his plans instead of bothering the **** out of her to get her to kill the kid? Jesus, it's like the we are living on different planets.
 
Re: 40 Days for Life campaign begins today

It is not like people accidentally carry around pre-made cake batter and then accidentally pour it into a baking dish and then accidentally put it into a pre-heated over and then accidentally take it out after the precise time is up!!! :lol:

Maybe they're sleep walking bakers. :2razz:
 
Re: 40 Days for Life campaign begins today

So it's so trivial that
THERE SHOULD BE NO QUESTION REGARDING OWNERSHIP OF A PREGNANCY. That's what I was talking about. Child support is another matter, involving a live birth --a months-later event.

you support imposing child support payments for it? Ok?
DON'T TRY TO MIX APPLES AND ORANGES. During a pregnancy one of the things that happens is that DNA gets copied vast numbers of times. In terms of Copyright Law, any data you possess you are free to make all the copies you want for your own purposes. (You simply are not allowed to sell the copies.) During pregnancy the unborn human is the "possessor" of DNA data in this situation, mostly-equal parts of which were provided by the man and the woman --and it is the unborn human that is making all those copies of the DNA. That has no effect on overall ownership of the pregnancy --the importance of this becomes apparent at birth, when the Law steps in and claims that the newborn human has right-to-life.

Now, knowing how helpless are newborn humans, the immediate question is, how can a newborn human possibly survive without assistance? Do you think that assistance is going to arrive from thin air?
DNA allows the biological parents to be positively identified. On what basis can anyone else be blamed for the existence of that need-for-assistance? Right-to-life, for the newborn human, essentially means assistance MUST be provided!

Which therefore leads to child-support. It Is Very Simple! And for a man who doesn't like that situation, it all starts with his own extreme stupidity --THAT is why he pays, as I explained elsewhere.

I've never watched that movie, but from the looks of it the movie is not about abortion.
It's about a man offering a couple a lot of money to let the man have sex with the wife of the couple. The "indecency" relates to rationalizations and hints of prostitution/pimping --but the point is, there are lots of things folks are willing to do for enough money.

Seriously? So the man has to try to convince her to abort in your mind?
ONLY IF HE WANTS TO AVOID CHILD-SUPPORT. And since the whole scenario here is all about a man not wanting to pay child-support, It Logically Follows that he should try to convince the woman to abort. (And in my personal opinion, any man to opposes abortion DESERVES to pay child-support, if he helps cause a birth he didn't want!)

So it's somehow worse for the man to just
I MADE NO SUCH CLAIM, regarding "better" or "worse" options. I simply laid the relevant Facts down plainly. He has no rational basis for claiming any significant degree of ownership of a pregnancy. The woman is free to abort or to try to carry the pregnancy to term. HE has the right to try to influence her decision. If a live birth happens, then with his DNA written all through the newborn human, who has right-to-life, the State assigns assistance-responsibilities. (He has one last option, to try to convince the woman to adopt-out the baby --which means some other couple will acquire all the assistance-responsibilities. But I think the chances of him succeeding at that are far lower than the chances of convincing her to abort.)

allow her to decide on her own as he goes forward with his plans
NOT WHAT I WAS TALKING ABOUT. Are you deliberately trying to twist what I said?

instead of bothering the **** out of her to get her to kill the kid?
ABORTION IS LEGAL, and getting one is entirely her choice. I'm simply following Facts and Logic where they lead.

Jesus, it's like the we are living on different planets.
THE PLANET OF THE IGNORANT --is that where you say you are living? Because I most certainly am not living there!
 
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Re: 40 Days for Life campaign begins today

THEY DON'T QUALIFY AS "BEINGS". If you want to claim they do, let's see some evidence supporting that claim!

They are beings; they exist. And they are human.
 
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