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Should abortion providers be given the death penalty?

blarg said:
after we imprison you for your bacon consumption

to be fair the pigs may very well have thoughts and feelings so i should probably not lump in the value of ther lives with that of fetuses
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No species of pig or boar has sapient members - pigs are property.

You comparing humans to pigs is disgusting but oh so typical of hate groups like yours.
 
JayDubya said:
No species of pig or boar has sapient members - pigs are property.

You comparing humans to pigs is disgusting but oh so typical of hate groups like yours.
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is a fetus sapient? has any ever achieved that status?

the pigs seem closer to having done so

you seem to be the one with hate

also very shaky reasoning

so you do seem rather disgusting but im sure you mean well dont we all
 
Abortion is not murder by your legal standards.

It is just the most vile and repulsive procedure a doctor can perform.

It is also what should never allow this country to claim high moral ground anytime anywhere, ISIS hell included.

BTW, I wonder how high a pile of 50 million of dead "fetuses" aborted since Roe would be?

Or, how long a line they would form is placed head-to-toes? Does 5 thousand miles seem reasonable?
 
legalimmigrant said:
Abortion is not murder by your legal standards.

It is just the most vile and repulsive procedure a doctor can perform.

It is also what should never allow this country to claim high moral ground anytime anywhere, ISIS hell included.

BTW, I wonder how high a pile of 50 million of dead "fetuses" aborted since Roe would be?

Or, how long a line they would form is placed head-to-toes? Does 5 thousand miles seem reasonable?
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who weer you talking to

and why cant we claim moral superiority to isis

a mother choosing to kill a human animal inside of her seems ok while murdering people for not following a religion seems oppressive and a violation of human rights and freedoms agisnt beings with wills of ther own
 
blarg said:
is a fetus sapient? has any ever achieved that status?
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Most of us who aren't killed do.

I'm not sure if you're trying to do a subtle metacommentary on that by roleplaying an exception or what your game is.

the pigs seem closer to having done so
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Oh good another one.

Newborns demonstrate less sapience than the animals we eat for food as well. So which is it, are you a peta "animal rights" shill or do you support infanticide too? Hell, why stop with infants? Why not the ability to do calculus?

you seem to be the one with hate
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I'm sure quite a lot of things seem ways that aren't so... to you.

Promoting equality and not limiting personhood from those whom some (like yourself) want to see dead for hateful, arbitrary reasons... You say that "seems hateful." Y'okay. :roll:
 
blarg said:
who weer you talking to

and why cant we claim moral superiority to isis

a mother choosing to kill a human animal inside of her seems ok while murdering people for not following a religion seems oppressive and a violation of human rights and freedoms agisnt beings with wills of ther own
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On a normalized moral scale ISIS is better.

They are uneducated primitive barbarians. You are educated, sensitive, enlightened, and a touchy-feely bunch - except when it comes to abortion.

When a wolf kills a sheep, it's normal. When you pet dog kills a sheep, it's not.

That's why.

That sentence "a mother choosing to kill a human animal inside of her seems ok" is the single, stupidest and most vile s*** I ever read.

Also, a woman who aborts is not a mother. She is a human bag or carrier of a "fetus".

A mother would give up her life to protect her baby inside or out. Human bags or sperm donors do not.
 
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Agreed. ISIS is better by the numbers than these pro-aborts and the institutions they support.
 
legalimmigrant said:
On a normalized moral scale ISIS is better.

They are uneducated primitive barbarians. You are educated, sensitive, enlightened, and a touchy-feely bunch - except when it comes to abortion.

When a wolf kills a sheep, it's normal. When you pet dog kills a sheep, it's not.

That's why.

That sentence "a mother choosing to kill a human animal inside of her seems ok" is the single, stupidest and most vile s*** I ever read.

And when I write "grow up" here, I get reprimanded.
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or your position on abortion is flawed

why is a fetus more then a human animal

your disgust seems stupid rather then convincing

your position seems vile

and not very mature
 
JayDubya said:
Agreed. ISIS is better by the numbers than these pro-aborts and the institutions they support.
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would be the case if abortion was murder you have yet to explain why that should be the case
 
blarg said:
would be the case if abortion was murder you have yet to explain why that should be the case
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Equality. Not treating some humans as property or worse for arbitrary reasons like their age.

A concept you can't grasp or don't value. Hence the quoted statement above.
 
JayDubya said:
Equality. Not treating some humans as property or worse for arbitrary reasons like their age.

A concept you can't grasp or don't value. Hence the quoted statement above.
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its only equality if a fetus has ever had sapience

unless you want to charge us for are pig slaughter

A concept you can't grasp or don't value. Hence the quoted statement above.
 
legalimmigrant said:
There is no such thing as a lesbian.

There are women who are just experimenting, desperate women in prisons, or so ugly men don't want them.

If a GQ cover guy with a six-pack - I mean his abdominals, not what's in his fridge - asked any one of them for a date, dinner and a roll in the sack in a five-star hotel, they would break their legs running - towards him.

Before you call me names, read this:

http://www.****e.org/cgi-bin/pooclub.cgi?p=chat&c=mike&i=lesbianism
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This has got to be one of the most ignorant and asinine posts I've read in my 4 years on this site.
 
legalimmigrant said:
There is no such thing as a lesbian.

There are women who are just experimenting, desperate women in prisons, or so ugly men don't want them.

If a GQ cover guy with a six-pack - I mean his abdominals, not what's in his fridge - asked any one of them for a date, dinner and a roll in the sack in a five-star hotel, they would break their legs running - towards him.

Before you call me names, read this:

http://www.****e.org/cgi-bin/pooclub.cgi?p=chat&c=mike&i=lesbianism
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Good gracious.

BTW, what was your link, it was blocked by my computer.
 
blarg said:
its only equality if a fetus has ever had sapience
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There you go saying dumb things again.

Answer the question posed to you are you a PETA animal rights person or do you approve of infanticide in addition to abortion?

Pick one.

Oh there is one more possibility, you're posting in bad faith. Feel free to identify if you're doing that too.
 
JayDubya said:
There you go saying dumb things again.

Answer the question posed to you are you a PETA animal rights person or do you approve of infanticide in addition to abortion?

Pick one.

Oh there is one more possibility, you're posting in bad faith. Feel free to identify if you're doing that too.
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There you go saying dumb things again.

i eat meat and am ok wiht legal abortion would be a hypocrite if i was against one and not the other

now back to the things that you say that are stupid

you bring up the point that pigs dont have sapience

when face with the fact that a fetus lacks that as well all you can do is run away and insult instead of constructing an intelligent counter argument

whats up with that?
 
JayDubya said:
There you go saying dumb things again.

Answer the question posed to you are you a PETA animal rights person or do you approve of infanticide in addition to abortion?

Pick one.

Oh there is one more possibility, you're posting in bad faith. Feel free to identify if you're doing that too.
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o sorry missed one of your repeat idiotic statements:3oops:

you should know by now im for an arbitrary cut off point when it comes to when you can terminate a human life to ensure an intelligent being is not harmed we have been over this

so before birth is as far as i go
 
blarg said:
you should know by now im for an arbitrary cut off point when it comes to when you can terminate a human life to ensure an intelligent being is not harmed we have been over this

so before birth is as far as i go
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We had a discussion also awhile back about this. Humans don't have any mental characteristics that separate them from ordinary animals until 18 months after birth when the mental capacity for self awareness kicks in. Even when having that, there are a handful of animals that can achieve that as well like most primate species, dolphins and elephants. Humans gain theory of mind aka the ''ability to mentally place self in someone elses shoes'' 3 years after birth. That's about the time they are truly a sapient being. Yeah that's right 3 years after birth. No other animals besides humans past a certain stage of development have that besides maybe the non human animals I mentioned since in order to have theory of mind, you must have the mental requirement for self awareness first. It's currently being researched on other non human animals. That's the time that rationality/sapience kicks in also which is a popular starting point for those who have debated the topic of personhood extensively for years into ET's AI's etc. It's either that or the ''sapient species'' ''rational nature'' line that pro lifers and those outside of the abortion debate use.

Of course you can make arguments for why newborns should be spared but not prenatal humans. Good luck with that one though without sounding too arbitrary about it.
 
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GEIxBattleRifle said:
We had a discussion also awhile back about this. Humans don't have any mental characteristics that separate them from ordinary animals until 18 months after birth when the mental capacity for self awareness kicks in. Even when having that, there are a handful of animals that can achieve that as well like most primate species, dolphins and elephants. Humans gain theory of mind aka the ''ability to mentally place self in someone elses shoes'' 3 years after birth. That's about the time they are truly a sapient being. Yeah that's right 3 years after birth. No other animals besides humans past a certain stage of development have that besides maybe the non human animals I mentioned since in order to have theory of mind, you must have the mental requirement for self awareness first. It's currently being researched on other non human animals. That's the time that rationality/sapience kicks in also which is a popular starting point for those who have debated the topic of personhood extensively for years into ET's AI's etc. It's either that or the ''sapient species'' ''rational nature'' line that pro lifers and those outside of the abortion debate use.

Of course you can make arguments for why newborns should be spared but not prenatal humans. Good luck with that one though without sounding too arbitrary about it.
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arbitrary is good it ensures a safety net
 
GEIxBattleRifle said:
We had a discussion also awhile back about this. Humans don't have any mental characteristics that separate them from ordinary animals until 18 months after birth when the mental capacity for self awareness kicks in. Even when having that, there are a handful of animals that can achieve that as well like most primate species, dolphins and elephants. Humans gain theory of mind aka the ''ability to mentally place self in someone elses shoes'' 3 years after birth. That's about the time they are truly a sapient being. Yeah that's right 3 years after birth. No other animals besides humans past a certain stage of development have that besides maybe the non human animals I mentioned since in order to have theory of mind, you must have the mental requirement for self awareness first. It's currently being researched on other non human animals. That's the time that rationality/sapience kicks in also which is a popular starting point for those who have debated the topic of personhood extensively for years into ET's AI's etc. It's either that or the ''sapient species'' ''rational nature'' line that pro lifers and those outside of the abortion debate use.

Of course you can make arguments for why newborns should be spared but not prenatal humans. Good luck with that one though without sounding too arbitrary about it.
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Good luck finding providers who would do post-natal abortions, let alone parents who would be down for that.

It's a simple biological fact that parent-infant bonding happens at birth, especially through vaginal delivery. Even though some parents are lousy, there are still hormonal drives at work that happen at birth which are gamechanging.

Your argument is purely intellectual and devoid of moral culpability. Have you ever held a baby before? Would you seriously be OK with post-natal abortions? Many mammalian species have completely helpless and innocent offspring, especially primates. Just because we can't have fully sentient relationships with them yet doesn't mean they aren't important to us. Obviously, or our species would be extinct. Just like how we tend to naturally give preference to pregnant women in dire situations.

None of this has anything to do with the legitimacy of abortion though, as we know it.
 
legalimmigrant said:
There is no such thing as a lesbian.

There are women who are just experimenting, desperate women in prisons, or so ugly men don't want them.

If a GQ cover guy with a six-pack - I mean his abdominals, not what's in his fridge - asked any one of them for a date, dinner and a roll in the sack in a five-star hotel, they would break their legs running - towards him.

Before you call me names, read this:

http://www.****e.org/cgi-bin/pooclub.cgi?p=chat&c=mike&i=lesbianism
Click to expand...

Your link doesn't work for me. What do the four asterisks in ****e stand for?

Never mind; I Googled and got lucky. The asterisks stand for a vulgarism that rhymes with "hit." Our word censor doesn't like this word even in a URL.

Funny stuff, though.
 
blarg said:
arbitrary is good it ensures a safety net
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It's good to give reasoning/arguments for the lines drawn regardless. If you draw the line at birth but personhood only starts once sapience/rationality kicks in then you should be able to give reasons for drawing the random line at birth as a "safety net" to spare the lives of newborns.

Most who been debating personhood for awhile into ETs and AIs and other categories mostly agree mental characteristics determines what a person is. It's mainly a fight over if having those characteristics now is what matters or just merely being the kind of entity that can acquire those characteristics is what matters.
 
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legalimmigrant said:
On a normalized moral scale ISIS is better.

They are uneducated primitive barbarians. You are educated, sensitive, enlightened, and a touchy-feely bunch - except when it comes to abortion.

When a wolf kills a sheep, it's normal. When you pet dog kills a sheep, it's not.

That's why.

That sentence "a mother choosing to kill a human animal inside of her seems ok" is the single, stupidest and most vile s*** I ever read.

Also, a woman who aborts is not a mother. She is a human bag or carrier of a "fetus".

A mother would give up her life to protect her baby inside or out. Human bags or sperm donors do not.
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JayDubya said:
Agreed. ISIS is better by the numbers than these pro-aborts and the institutions they support.
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:roll: :shock:

This is beyond ****ed up.

Your claiming ****ing ISIS is better than the US because we have abortion? Because that position is absolutely absurd.

I wouldn't be name calling if I were you.
 
nota bene said:
Your link doesn't work for me. What do the four asterisks in ****e stand for?

Never mind; I Googled and got lucky. The asterisks stand for a vulgarism that rhymes with "hit." Our word censor doesn't like this word even in a URL.

Funny stuff, though.
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I would somewhat concur. Being a lesbian isn't natural, it is a choice.
 
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legalimmigrant said:
There is no such thing as a lesbian.

There are women who are just experimenting, desperate women in prisons, or so ugly men don't want them.

If a GQ cover guy with a six-pack - I mean his abdominals, not what's in his fridge - asked any one of them for a date, dinner and a roll in the sack in a five-star hotel, they would break their legs running - towards him.

Before you call me names, read this:

http://www.****e.org/cgi-bin/pooclub.cgi?p=chat&c=mike&i=lesbianism
Click to expand...

Being a lesbian is like being a liberal. Often can be categorized as a fad or a phase. If not for a short period of time, you simply are....well,
 
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