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Thread: Forced pregnancy is enslavement.[W:607]

  1. #651
    Educator applejuicefool's Avatar
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    Re: I'm not pro-slavery. Are You?

    Quote Originally Posted by Removable Mind View Post
    After all this time...eons of post after post...still you can't provide a single reason, outside of matching DNA, for a reason to not abort. You can't show a single negative impact for millions of abortions that have been occurring for so many years I can't count them.
    This is a bald-faced lie. I have given you reason after reason after reason, and time and again you simply dismiss them with no meaningful answer.

    It's just more subjective moral opinion. Abortion isn't an opinion, it's a medical procedure.
    A murderer putting a bullet through someone's brain is a medical procedure too.

    It's a legal medical procedure.
    And, just like murder, it should be illegal.

    And if it isn't a legal medical procedure then all who seek an abortion won't be deterred by radical people who are obsessed with control other peoples lives no reasons that they can't back up.
    People break the law all the time.

    You reason so far...punish women who have sex is their crime IN YOUR COURT. That's it. And your sentence is a unwanted kid that if she can't care for, or abuses, or neglects, or WE THE TAXPAYERS often have to pay for.
    My court? I didn't know I was so fortunate to own one. I have repeatedly stated that I don't care what women do sexually. Here, I'll say this: Voluntary sex is a good thing. People should have as much sex as they want to, as long as no one gets killed. Your lies are unbecoming, RM.

    -AJF

  2. #652
    Educator applejuicefool's Avatar
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    Re: Forced pregnancy is enslavement.[W:607]

    Quote Originally Posted by Lursa View Post
    Good...what would those compelling interests be? What are some possibilities? What do you see as justifiable as "compelling?"
    The state has interest in its citizens. Unborn are organisms that will become its citizens if they don't die. Therefore the state has an interest in ensuring that unborn don't die.

    -AJF

  3. #653
    Educator applejuicefool's Avatar
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    Re: Forced pregnancy is enslavement.[W:607]

    Quote Originally Posted by Lursa View Post
    Perhaps the better analogy is....the person was wearing their seatbelt...but the seatbelt failed to keep them from dying or being injured. People frequently die or are seriously injured while wearing seatbelts.

    Otherwise I call bull**** and would like to see your sources for how frequently seatbelts 'fail.'
    Sorry, I am abandoning this analogy due to lack of clarity, unless someone can clearly and precisely lay out what everything in the car wreck side stands for in the sex/birth control/pregnancy side.

    To be exact, how do:
    * Driving
    * Riding in the car without driving
    * Seatbelts
    * Air bags
    * A collision
    * Seatbelt failure
    * Injury
    * Death

    relate to:
    * Sexual intercourse
    * The man
    * The woman
    * Birth control
    * Birth control failure
    * Pregnancy
    * The unborn child
    * Abortion
    * Childbirth

    Thank you.

    -AJF

  4. #654
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    Re: I'm not pro-slavery. Are You?

    Quote Originally Posted by WCH View Post
    the ending of a life by the hand of another person....murder.
    Nope....self-defense is not murder. Soldiers killing in war, not murder. Assisted suicide in Oregon, not murder.

    You have alot of problems distinguishing fact from fiction, dont you?
    Quote Originally Posted by COTO View Post
    Even if this were true (it's not), how many million years do you want to spread the infection over?
    RE: Italy's mortality rate
    Quote Originally Posted by Luther View Post
    Perhaps it because their population is so old(their own doing)?

  5. #655
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    Re: Forced pregnancy is enslavement.[W:607]

    Quote Originally Posted by applejuicefool View Post
    Sorry, I am abandoning this analogy due to lack of clarity, unless someone can clearly and precisely lay out what everything in the car wreck side stands for in the sex/birth control/pregnancy side.

    To be exact, how do:
    * Driving
    * Riding in the car without driving
    * Seatbelts
    * Air bags
    * A collision
    * Seatbelt failure
    * Injury
    * Death

    relate to:
    * Sexual intercourse
    * The man
    * The woman
    * Birth control
    * Birth control failure
    * Pregnancy
    * The unborn child
    * Abortion
    * Childbirth

    Thank you.

    -AJF
    Ha ha, of course you're "abandoning it" (Just picture 'finger quotes' instead of typed quotes, lololol)
    Quote Originally Posted by COTO View Post
    Even if this were true (it's not), how many million years do you want to spread the infection over?
    RE: Italy's mortality rate
    Quote Originally Posted by Luther View Post
    Perhaps it because their population is so old(their own doing)?

  6. #656
    Sage

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    Re: Forced pregnancy is enslavement.[W:607]

    Quote Originally Posted by applejuicefool View Post
    The Constitution can be amended, if necessary. That is a legal option. As I said, I have the right to work within the legal system as it exists to change it.

    -AJF
    But the overall majority of the public does not want to see Roe v. Wade appealed.

    And maybe one day we will learn pigs to fly, but it does not mean that the constitution on this will be amended in this day and age.

    For one, you need a 2/3 majority in both house and senate on this issue and whereas the house might go the way of the republicans, the US senate will most likely not.

    And even then, it is just as proposal, 75% of the states must ratify it to be become an actual amended constitution and with

    Hawaii
    Vermont
    Rhode Island
    New York
    New Jersey
    Massachusetts
    Maryland
    Illinois
    Delaware
    Connecticut
    California
    Oregon

    never going to agree to such an amendment and

    Colorado
    Washington
    New Mexico

    slowly or quickly going the same blue way (in statehood) there are not enough red states to make that amendment stick.

    But that is all a moot point because with democrats holding 44 seats in the senate and 2 polling with the democrats, this issue is never even going to get to ratification status.
    Bette Midler tweeted: At his rally, Trump complained about Parasite winning the Oscar. Iím more upset that a parasite won the White House.

  7. #657
    Sage

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    Re: I'm not pro-slavery. Are You?

    Quote Originally Posted by WCH View Post
    It's only legal because of Leftist
    progressivism's attempt at population control.
    Seriously? Seriously????

    Five of the seven justices that ruled in favour were appointed by Republican presidents.

  8. #658
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    Re: Forced pregnancy is enslavement.[W:607]

    Quote Originally Posted by applejuicefool View Post
    The state has interest in its citizens. Unborn are organisms that will become its citizens if they don't die. Therefore the state has an interest in ensuring that unborn don't die.

    -AJF
    The "state," the Supreme Court, knew that when it made it's decision. WHy would it reconsider...based on what? What are the compelling reasons? They CLEARLY did establish a time period after which they DID say the state COULD consider it in their best interests (and that varies from state to state). Why would the federal govt reconsider THAT? What would compel it to do so?
    Quote Originally Posted by COTO View Post
    Even if this were true (it's not), how many million years do you want to spread the infection over?
    RE: Italy's mortality rate
    Quote Originally Posted by Luther View Post
    Perhaps it because their population is so old(their own doing)?

  9. #659
    Educator applejuicefool's Avatar
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    Re: Forced pregnancy is enslavement.[W:607]

    Quote Originally Posted by Peter King View Post
    But nobody is performing a C-section on a 10 week old, even the idea that any doctor would do that is ludicrous. It however is legal to perform on abortion in a 10 week old fetus and the fetus that comes out of there is not alive, no matter how some president's law calls it.
    I believe the word I used was "if". I used this example to point out the ludicrous nature of "born" as the criteria for personhood.

    No, we grow after birth. We do not start developing lungs at age 10, we do not start having higher brainwaves at age 35. Growing is a lot different than going from a zygote to a fetus.
    We develop after birth. Our skull closes. Our eyesight improves. We get teeth. We lose teeth and get other teeth. We go through puberty. The way we learn new things changes - it's different for a young child and an adult. Men grow facial and body hair. Their voices change and deepen. Women begin to menstruate, then later in life they stop menstruating. Late in life, many men and fewer women begin to lose their hair. Sexual libido varies greatly over a human's lifetime. These are all examples of human *development*, not just growth, that happen over a lifetime after birth.

    And it does not change the fact that abortion is legal and that a fetus is not a person.
    You say these two things as if they have something to do with one another.

    Yes, humans have *the highest* brains, but many mammals have higher brains in the same way humans do, just not to the same extent. I would argue that there are some people with learning and developmental disorders who have less intelligence than some chimpanzees or orangutans, for example.

    Children's brains are less developed than adult brains; would you argue that children are less human than adults?
    Yes, I am going to go with that. It is a lot more logical than the zygote is a human being position of the pro-life groups. Except genetics there is nothing human in the zygote.
    Here is a human trait that all zygotes possess: The tendency to develop into a more mature human.

    Something with no functioning higher brain functions/something with only a brain stem does not have a "soul" (for lack of a better word for it), it is like a robot going through the motions. It looks like the lights are on but nobody is home.
    I asked you to show that adult humans have more of a soul than does an unborn human. You're attempting to show that an unborn has no soul; okay, that's one step. Now go ahead and show that an adult human *does*.

    And this is not about how smart someone is but whether or not a fetus is even capable of having higher brainwaves. A brain may have defects but would still be able to have higher brain waves. Before about week 22 there is no brain waves in the cortex.
    Why is this important? We know there *will* be if the unborn survives, because of that very human trait - development.

    It is called higher brain birth (as the opposite of brain death). Without brain birth there is not possibility of brain death.
    But there is the possibility of just good old, *actual* death. Which is what happens with every abortion. Here's a question for you, Peter: Of these two options, which do you find more objectionable?: 1. You will die, or 2. You will never have existed.

    -AJF

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    Re: I'm not pro-slavery. Are You?

    Quote Originally Posted by applejuicefool View Post
    Irrelevant. Is what I said true or untrue? Is 9 months a long time or a short time, relative to an average human lifespan?

    -AJF
    It can be an eternity for the woman who is pregnant.

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