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The more I think about it, the less it makes sense. Romney's tax plan.

code1211 said:
Romney explained it and it's ridiculously simple. He will give the Congress a suggestion on what he wants the results to be and a suggestion on the course he would like for them to take and then he will open the topic to debate and compromise.
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Weighty stuff indeed. You could do just that without a change in leadership by the way. Seems rather strange that the country braying about a boneheaded and utterly inept congress would elect an individual who's running on the principles of deferment to that very same bunch.
 
shiang said:
Source? Which loopholes? If they exist then those should be closed of course.
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Businesses rarely measure their success or progress against profitability anymore because they use accounting tricks to eliminate profits from the books. In the 90's, the measure called EBITDA came into fashion as it measures earnings before interest, tax and depreciation. Those are loopholes intended to direct actions.
 
Fisher said:
As to the OP, I do not recall the author ever embracing Romney's anything so it is a bit disingenuous to say it now makes less sense after further review.

There is no general consensus that we should tax money people have "banked" and not tax money being used by the private sector. There is no "corporate gains tax" that I am aware of.
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If a "corporate gain" is measured by the dividends paid to investors and by the value of the stock as it increases, then there is in fact a Corporate Gains Tax. Both of these are taxed.
 
Jonsa said:
really? interesting perspective there turtle. Perhaps you can tell us how you create less contradiction in your psyche. Lets start with equal rights as per the constitution moving on to individual liberty for women - last time I looked every women owned their own womb.

Ya know I dispise those people who wrap themselves up in the flag and the constitution and then immediately dismiss it when it doesn't cater to their myopic world view.
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"Owned their own womb" creates an interesting analogy.

A landlord owns the physical structure that he allows others to live in. This is a good parallel to a woman who owns the womb in which another lives. In this sense, she has no more right to terminate that life than a landlord would have to terminate the lives of those who reside in his property.
 
code1211 said:
Since the deal that was struck by Reagan and O'Neal to simplify the tax system was signed, the lying, cheating thieves in washington have added more an average of one loophole to the tax system every day.
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That would be 9,495 loopholes added in that time period. Any sourcing behind that claim? Also, if your staunchly opposed to excessive taxation, why call those who provide you a way out, Lying, cheating thieves?
 
Hare said:
Primary? Probably taking a small bite out of that deficit that's supposedly destroying the country. The best argument for a hike on upper tier earners would be the utter failure on the behalf of it's detractors to convey any argument whatsoever regarding prosperity and tax rates residing in the same zip code as they do currently, when compared to the remainder of our modern history.
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Well, that was free of any meaning whatsoever.

Does the Democrat party have any stated tax policy? We know for certain that they do not make any plan regarding spending, this is a thing called a budget, so they have no concept of what they are planning to spend. By this we know that they refuse to construct a rational course into the fiscal future.

If they don't know where they are trying to go or how they are planning to get there, it's a pretty good bet that they won't get there. Even Yogi Berra knew that.

You have presented the Democrat primary tax policy perfectly. It doesn't exist and is presented only by saying that we need to ignore the man behind the curtain.
 
code1211 said:
Is the measure of whether or not a tax system is fair only based on the notion that some have more than others so they need to be mined?
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Not really about fairness, it's more closely related to simple logic and arithmetic. Does it make more sense to impose a 4 percent tax hike on those with substantial reserves of wealth at their disposal, or try to squeeze a few percent out of those whose savings rates just recently climbed into the black?
 
Hare said:
Weighty stuff indeed. You could do just that without a change in leadership by the way. Seems rather strange that the country braying about a boneheaded and utterly inept congress would elect an individual who's running on the principles of deferment to that very same bunch.
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Which is what the Founders suggested in the Constitution.

Reading is Fundamental.
 
Hare said:
That would be 9,495 loopholes added in that time period. Any sourcing behind that claim? Also, if your staunchly opposed to excessive taxation, why call those who provide you a way out, Lying, cheating thieves?
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Jesse Jackson Jr is currently in the News because he is having trouble with his 2.5 million dollar Washington DC Home. Lyndon Johnson retired owning half of Texas. During the activities that led up to the mortgage meltdown, Dodd got a sweetheart deal on a property purchase deal.

Do you really think that our elected representatives are just the luckiest SOB's in the world when it comes to money or do you think that there is a line of lobbyists that are begging to bribe these prostitutes to do their bidding. Hint: If you have chosen the former, you're naive.
 
Hare said:
That would be 9,495 loopholes added in that time period. Any sourcing behind that claim? Also, if your staunchly opposed to excessive taxation, why call those who provide you a way out, Lying, cheating thieves?
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Twenty Years Later: The Tax Reform Act of 1986 | Tax Foundation

In the years since, however, rates have gradually risen and Congress has passed nearly 15,000 changes to the tax law. Many of the loopholes that disappeared two decades ago are back. Now, as then, politicians (including President Bush) are branding the income tax unfair and calling for reform. And now, as then, few expect it to happen.
 
code1211 said:
Well, that was free of any meaning whatsoever.

Does the Democrat party have any stated tax policy? '

We know for certain that they do not make any plan regarding spending, this is a thing called a budget, so they have no concept of what they are planning to spend.

If they don't know where they are trying to go or how they are planning to get there, it's a pretty good bet that they won't get there. Even Yogi Berra knew that.
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I'm sorry you feel that way.

Sure, haven't you been paying attention? A brief outline with some useful info. http://www.whitehouse.gov/sites/default/files/uploads/middleclassreport_7_24_2012.pdf

Sheesh, even a curious google user could label you a fool. The Budget | The White House

It seems as if Yogi Berra himself would have a better grasp on these very subjects.
 
Hare said:
Not really about fairness, it's more closely related to simple logic and arithmetic. Does it make more sense to impose a 4 percent tax hike on those with substantial reserves of wealth at their disposal, or try to squeeze a few percent out of those whose savings rates just recently climbed into the black?
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How is the admission price to buy a ticket to a movie set?
 
well, I don't know the particulars of his tax plans .... ( which is something politicians never seem to reveal until after the election)... but I understand the general them of it.

sounds to me like his plan is about widening the tax base and simplifying the code.

it's a good general theme, but without specifics I can't tell if it will work or not.
 
code1211 said:
Which is what the Founders suggested in the Constitution.

Reading is Fundamental.
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And here you are griping about lack of leadership while all the while suggesting passing the buck to a congress you label as thieves and crooks. Pretty silly stuff.
 
Hare said:
I'm sorry you feel that way.

Sure, haven't you been paying attention? A brief outline with some useful info. http://www.whitehouse.gov/sites/default/files/uploads/middleclassreport_7_24_2012.pdf

Sheesh, even a curious google user could label you a fool. The Budget | The White House

It seems as if Yogi Berra himself would have a better grasp on these very subjects.
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There has not been a budget passed by Congress in over three years. The thing you present as a White house Budget might as well be printed on rolls of absorbent tissue paper.

Obama claimed in the 2008 campaign that he would cut the deficit in half. He never approved a budget or pressed the sycophants in Congress to pass one. If he was not lying in his campaign, and who could think that, then his unwillingness to produce a budget and unify the American people behind his goals should lead us to suspect that the lack of a plan affects his ability to achieve his stated goals.
 
code1211 said:
Do you really think that our elected representatives are just the luckiest SOB's in the world when it comes to money or do you think that there is a line of lobbyists that are begging to bribe these prostitutes to do their bidding. Hint: If you have chosen the former, you're naive.
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There are indeed occurrences of "crony capitalism" (or whatever you would prefer to label such activities), but surely you realize that a myriad of these changes levied over the years aid you and your fellow average joe in evading taxes as well? It seems to me that folks who are strictly in opposition to any hints or whispers at tax hikes would be wildly supportive of such initiatives.
 
Thrilla said:
well, I don't know the particulars of his tax plans .... ( which is something politicians never seem to reveal until after the election)... but I understand the general them of it.

sounds to me like his plan is about widening the tax base and simplifying the code.

it's a good general theme, but without specifics I can't tell if it will work or not.
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It worked when Kennedy, Reagan, and Clinton did it.
 
Hare said:
And here you are griping about lack of leadership while all the while suggesting passing the buck to a congress you label as thieves and crooks. Pretty silly stuff.
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Is not the act of leadership based on leading? If the folks that you are given to accomplish a task will not follow your lead, you are not a leader. If compliance with your goals is achieved only by coercion, that is not leadership, it is dominance.

It is not difficult to recognize a leader. It is difficult to find one. We know with absolute certainty that Obama is not a leader.

We need someone who can define his vision and allow those with whom he works the latitude to strive toward creating the reality of that vision. That is what Romney proposes to do. It is what executives around the world through all of history have done.

Have you ever been charged with achieving a goal and having to do so by leading those around you? It's not an easy task.
 
TurtleDude said:
that seems to be the consensus only of people who don't pay much taxes and are envious of those who do
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so you think being rich and paying higher taxes is still a very nice position to be in, one that others wouldnt mind being in who pay high taxes and earn not much, and youre right. So lets drop the poor victimized multi-millionaire nonsense, eh? You could tax Mitt far, far, far higher than his measly 14% and he'd still be living in total luxury and want for nothing
 
Hare said:
There are indeed occurrences of "crony capitalism" (or whatever you would prefer to label such activities), but surely you realize that a myriad of these changes levied over the years aid you and your fellow average joe in evading taxes as well? It seems to me that folks who are strictly in opposition to any hints or whispers at tax hikes would be wildly supportive of such initiatives.
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I would prefer that the tax code define the amount I owe and how to send it in.

The tax code should allow the individual's taxes to be completed on one computer screen.
 
code1211 said:
If a "corporate gain" is measured by the dividends paid to investors and by the value of the stock as it increases, then there is in fact a Corporate Gains Tax. Both of these are taxed.
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Wouldn't that either be corporate income tax or capital gains tax, which are not treated as the same type of tax?
 
Panopticon said:
so you think being rich and paying higher taxes is still a very nice position to be in, one that others wouldnt mind being in who pay high taxes and earn not much, and youre right. So lets drop the poor victimized multi-millionaire nonsense, eh? You could tax Mitt far, far, far higher than his measly 14% and he'd still be living in total luxury and want for nothing
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You could take a gun and rob anybody at all.

What is the moral justification in this?
 
Fisher said:
Wouldn't that either be corporate income tax or capital gains tax, which are not treated as the same type of tax?
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I was asking if these are not the measure of a "corporate Gain". These are indeed taxed.
 
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