If Mitt Romney was serious.

tererun · Oct 12, 2012

Right now there are workers in Illinois being put out of their jobs because a company that Mitt Romney owns stock in, and it is a lot of stock, is outsourcing jobs to china. There is cheaper labor over there, and their american counterparts who are being laid off are being asked to train their chinese replacements. First, I know Mitt does not head bain anymore and cannot make decisions for them. Second, Mitt stands to make a lot of money off of this deal.

Now if mitt Romney is who he says he is, wouldn't he reach out to the decision makers and ask them to make a different decision and keep the american workers? I would have to imagine a large stockholder, who is also an old executive of the company, and a man running for the presidency of the US might hold a little sway in this decision. Right here, right now Mitt has a chance to make an effort to save real people's jobs in america. He has a chance to stop outsourcing and save american middle class families like he wants to as president. It is also a chance to show that he truly is on the side of american workers, and the american people. Nothing bad except for maybe a loss in profits from his stocks could come from asking them to stop this.

Now let me ask the romney supporters, why isn't he doing it? Why won't he even see these people. Why won't he even make a request on their behalf. Obama would.

jerry7 · Oct 12, 2012

Could you please supply a link?

tererun · Oct 12, 2012

The Ed Show

Sorry, I actually thought people would be familiar with this.

Mycroft · Oct 12, 2012

tererun said:
Right now there are workers in Illinois being put out of their jobs because a company that Mitt Romney owns stock in, and it is a lot of stock, is outsourcing jobs to china. There is cheaper labor over there, and their american counterparts who are being laid off are being asked to train their chinese replacements. First, I know Mitt does not head bain anymore and cannot make decisions for them. Second, Mitt stands to make a lot of money off of this deal.

Now if mitt Romney is who he says he is, wouldn't he reach out to the decision makers and ask them to make a different decision and keep the american workers? I would have to imagine a large stockholder, who is also an old executive of the company, and a man running for the presidency of the US might hold a little sway in this decision. Right here, right now Mitt has a chance to make an effort to save real people's jobs in america. He has a chance to stop outsourcing and save american middle class families like he wants to as president. It is also a chance to show that he truly is on the side of american workers, and the american people. Nothing bad except for maybe a loss in profits from his stocks could come from asking them to stop this.

Now let me ask the romney supporters, why isn't he doing it? Why won't he even see these people. Why won't he even make a request on their behalf. Obama would.

Because, unlike Obama, Romney has some class and won't pander to get a vote. He would rather deal with the source of the problem than make empty, meaningless gestures.

tererun · Oct 12, 2012

Mycroft said:
Because, unlike Obama, Romney has some class and won't pander to get a vote. He would rather deal with the source of the problem than make empty, meaningless gestures.

I do not think it would be an empty meaningless gesture. Romney holds a large amount of stock. He is an old executive of the company. He is the republican candidate for president. I think if that person asks you to do something you listen to them. And even if they don't it would be a great way for him to show he is doing everything for america that he can. If it is so cheap and easy to do and it would have such a great impact on his credibility which is suffering then why not do it? You are telling me he has so much integrity ghe is just going to take his check and screw all those people on any effort? That is the sort of integrity you are backing?

mike2810 · Oct 12, 2012

and if Obama and other "Tax the Rich" were serious they would write a check to the US Tres. for the additionals dollars they feel the rich should pay.

oh wait. Obama is following existing tax code. Unless you can show were Romney is breaking any laws your point is just political bias.

tererun · Oct 12, 2012

mike2810 said:
and if Obama and other "Tax the Rich" were serious they would write a check to the US Tres. for the additionals dollars they feel the rich should pay.

oh wait. Obama is following existing tax code. Unless you can show were Romney is breaking any laws your point is just political bias.

This is not political bias. I am not saying he is breaking any law. He is campaigning on the idea that he will do everything in his power to create 12 million jobs, and he cannot even ask his old company to not outsource these jobs? It is not against the law that he doesn't do that, it just goes against the entire idea of his campaign.

mike2810 · Oct 12, 2012

tererun said:
This is not political bias. I am not saying he is breaking any law. He is campaigning on the idea that he will do everything in his power to create 12 million jobs, and he cannot even ask his old company to not outsource these jobs? It is not against the law that he doesn't do that, it just goes against the entire idea of his campaign.

Obama, Pelosi, etc. could have paid the extra dollars these last four years. They are campaigning on the "rich" need to pay more. It goes against the entire idea of his campaign by not paying.

He could ask.. as Obama could pay more to the US Tres. I would not be surprised that Romney's stock is in some sort of trust and he is not managing it. Many politicians do that to avoid conflict of interest.

tererun · Oct 12, 2012

mike2810 said:
Obama, Pelosi, etc. could have paid the extra dollars these last four years. They are campaigning on the "rich" need to pay more. It goes against the entire idea of his campaign by not paying.

He could ask.. as Obama could pay more to the US Tres. I would not be surprised that Romney's stock is in some sort of trust and he is not managing it. Many politicians do that to avoid conflict of interest.

This has nothing to do with obama, please stop trying to derail this. This is about Romney and his integrity. If all you have here is an attack on Obama then take it to a thread where it belongs. This is about Romney and Romney alone and why he doesn't do such a simple easy thing that might help people, and would most certainly help his integrity concerns.

Mycroft · Oct 12, 2012

tererun said:
I do not think it would be an empty meaningless gesture. Romney holds a large amount of stock. He is an old executive of the company. He is the republican candidate for president. I think if that person asks you to do something you listen to them. And even if they don't it would be a great way for him to show he is doing everything for america that he can. If it is so cheap and easy to do and it would have such a great impact on his credibility which is suffering then why not do it? You are telling me he has so much integrity ghe is just going to take his check and screw all those people on any effort? That is the sort of integrity you are backing?

As a Republican candidate for President it isn't his place to insert himself into the private, lawful decisions of an American company...whether he used to be an executive of that company or not. And, yes...his credibility and integrity IS increased by not getting involved.

Look, you really shouldn't expect a Republican and conservative like Romney to employ the tactics of the Democrats and liberals...the tactics of sticking their noses into other people's business...the tactics of trying to tell others that "I know better than you".

tererun, if you really expect or suggest that Romney should do these things, then you really don't know anything about conservatives.

jerry7 · Oct 12, 2012

tererun said:
I do not think it would be an empty meaningless gesture. Romney holds a large amount of stock. He is an old executive of the company. He is the republican candidate for president. I think if that person asks you to do something you listen to them. And even if they don't it would be a great way for him to show he is doing everything for america that he can. If it is so cheap and easy to do and it would have such a great impact on his credibility which is suffering then why not do it? You are telling me he has so much integrity ghe is just going to take his check and screw all those people on any effort? That is the sort of integrity you are backing?

It's quite possible that Romney has requested what you suggested behind the scenes and been denied. Do you really think if he had any influence this move would be taking place in the middle of his campaign? Think about it for a minute. What you might not know is that Obama has a $100,000 invested in an Illinois retirement plan that owns shares in Sensata Technologies. Also one of Obama's biggest bundlers is Bain's managing director and chief investmnet officer, Jonathan Lavine. And Bain employees have contributed over $34,000 to Obama's campaign. So it appears that right now Obama probably has more influence with Bain regarding Sensata's move to China than Romney. I'm all in favor of keeping these jobs in the US and think taking down the US flag as described in the video was a disgrace but using it to attack Romney just doesn't smell right.
****************************************************************************************************************
For many sophisticated and wealthy investors, as well as for ordinary workers invested in pension funds, China is a part of any diversified investment strategy. President Obama, a former Illinois state senator, has as much as $100,000 in a state retirement plan that contains shares of Sensata Technologies, the same auto parts company controlled by Bain that is closing its Illinois factory.
http://www.nytimes.com/2012/10/10/u...maintains-china-ties.html?pagewanted=all&_r=0

tererun · Oct 13, 2012

Mycroft said:
As a Republican candidate for President it isn't his place to insert himself into the private, lawful decisions of an American company...whether he used to be an executive of that company or not. And, yes...his credibility and integrity IS increased by not getting involved.

He can do it. There is nothing stopping him from asking. There is nothing stopping him from making the pitch that it would be worthwhile to keep it open because when he is president he is going to make it worthwhile for them to hire american. I don't see where he can't do that. I don't even see where it wouldf make a difference. the government encourages companies to do stuff every day with tax incentives and grants. He is not threatening them, he is not even president right now so he is just a person and he could ask. You are way off base saying he has no place doing it. He is actually in the perfect place to do it.

Mycroft said:
Look, you really shouldn't expect a Republican and conservative like Romney to employ the tactics of the Democrats and liberals...the tactics of sticking their noses into other people's business...the tactics of trying to tell others that "I know better than you".

This is not about liberals, this is about him. He says he is trying to save the american workforce and keep manufacturing jobs here. Right now he is in an ideal position to do that on his own power without the title of president backing him up. He is supposed to be the noble guy looking out for the working class, and he is not. This is not a liberal position, this is his campaign position. This is Romney's position and he isn't doing what he says he is going to do.

Mycroft said:
tererun, if you really expect or suggest that Romney should do these things, then you really don't know anything about conservatives.

I would expect conservatives to live up to their boasts and when they say they are trying hard for the american worker I would expect them to at least request the company reconsider, or even just talk with the people and aknowledge they exist. he has done none of that. If what you are saying is true and i am not knowing something about conservatives it must mean that they do not mean a thing they say in their campaign. That is the only conclusion I can come up with from his actions.

tererun · Oct 13, 2012

jerry7 said:
It's quite possible that Romney has requested what you suggested behind the scenes and been denied. Do you really think if he had any influence this move would be taking place in the middle of his campaign? Think about it for a minute. What you might not know is that Obama has a $100,000 invested in an Illinois retirement plan that owns shares in Sensata Technologies. Also one of Obama's biggest bundlers is Bain's managing director and chief investmnet officer, Jonathan Lavine. And Bain employees have contributed over $34,000 to Obama's campaign. So it appears that right now Obama probably has more influence with Bain regarding Sensata's move to China than Romney. I'm all in favor of keeping these jobs in the US and think taking down the US flag as described in the video was a disgrace but using it to attack Romney just doesn't smell right.
****************************************************************************************************************
For many sophisticated and wealthy investors, as well as for ordinary workers invested in pension funds, China is a part of any diversified investment strategy. President Obama, a former Illinois state senator, has as much as $100,000 in a state retirement plan that contains shares of Sensata Technologies, the same auto parts company controlled by Bain that is closing its Illinois factory.
http://www.nytimes.com/2012/10/10/u...maintains-china-ties.html?pagewanted=all&_r=0

But he has not done anything. If he had we would have surely seen it. He would have made a big deal about trying to save those jobs. Why not do it for the public? It would only help them. This is not about obama, this is about Mitt, and how can anyone believe in him being the person who will look after the working middle class if he wont even ask his old company to do him a favor. You are trying to deflect this back on Obama, and that is not the issue. the issue is Mitt could do something and is not. If you want to argue about Obama not doing anything in this case make another thread and see how ridiculous you sound. We are talking about mitt romney and his claims right here, and why he cannot even do the smallest things that would mean a hell of a lot for those people and for his image. The only thing I see having any sort of threat is his bottom line and his bank account.

saveUS222 · Oct 13, 2012

I don't think cheap labor is the main factor... maybe it's because in the US the corporate tax rate is 39% and in China its 25%...

laska · Oct 13, 2012

The company likely has to move to China or close in order to stay competitive. If the company can produce goods cheaper in China it is likely better for consumers to move the jobs to China. It frees up inefficient labor to concentrate on creating wealth on something they are efficient at. We should have 0% corporate rates, 0% capital gains on ipo, have government single payer catastrophic health insurance to take health care costs from business, and companies would be moving to the USA because cost of doing business would be drastically lower. We really need free(subsidized) world class virtual university where people can download apps on world class job training plus a welfare program where those who lose their jobs can work on public works while they are acquiring new skills. This is politically incorrect but free trade and globalization raises living standards and is why those in poverty in this nation have big screens and cell phones.

jerry7 · Oct 13, 2012

tererun said:
But he has not done anything. If he had we would have surely seen it. He would have made a big deal about trying to save those jobs. Why not do it for the public? It would only help them. This is not about obama, this is about Mitt, and how can anyone believe in him being the person who will look after the working middle class if he wont even ask his old company to do him a favor. You are trying to deflect this back on Obama, and that is not the issue. the issue is Mitt could do something and is not. If you want to argue about Obama not doing anything in this case make another thread and see how ridiculous you sound. We are talking about mitt romney and his claims right here, and why he cannot even do the smallest things that would mean a hell of a lot for those people and for his image. The only thing I see having any sort of threat is his bottom line and his bank account.[/QUOT

If Romney had any influence with Bain this move would not be taking place in the middle of his campaign regardless of his opinion of the move. You are using the actions of Bain to attack Romney when Obama actually has more influence with Bain than Romney. And once again if Romney contacted Bain leadership you would never know. The plight of these workers has been seized on by the left to score political points which makes it about the election and makes Obama fair game whether you like it or not.

Mycroft · Oct 13, 2012

tererun said:
He can do it. There is nothing stopping him from asking. There is nothing stopping him from making the pitch that it would be worthwhile to keep it open because when he is president he is going to make it worthwhile for them to hire american. I don't see where he can't do that. I don't even see where it wouldf make a difference. the government encourages companies to do stuff every day with tax incentives and grants. He is not threatening them, he is not even president right now so he is just a person and he could ask. You are way off base saying he has no place doing it. He is actually in the perfect place to do it.

His whole policy is based on getting the government OUT of the business of influencing companies through tax incentives and grants. For him to throw his weight around in this issue would be counter to his stance.

This is not about liberals, this is about him. He says he is trying to save the american workforce and keep manufacturing jobs here. Right now he is in an ideal position to do that on his own power without the title of president backing him up. He is supposed to be the noble guy looking out for the working class, and he is not. This is not a liberal position, this is his campaign position. This is Romney's position and he isn't doing what he says he is going to do.

What you are suggesting is that he employ liberal tactics...because you think he should. Yes, he wants to increase jobs in America...but he wants to do it the conservative way, by getting the government out of the way, by enabling businesses to make their own decisions without government influence...or without his influence...or without liberal influence. He has his position, he has his plan on how to implement his position and none of that includes doing it YOUR way.

I would expect conservatives to live up to their boasts and when they say they are trying hard for the american worker I would expect them to at least request the company reconsider, or even just talk with the people and aknowledge they exist. he has done none of that. If what you are saying is true and i am not knowing something about conservatives it must mean that they do not mean a thing they say in their campaign. That is the only conclusion I can come up with from his actions.

As I said, he is doing it the conservative way...not the liberal way, as you want him to do.

Perhaps you would be better served by suggesting that Obama do what you think Romney should do. He's a liberal, he's very comfortable with telling people what HE thinks they should do and, for god's sakes...he's not just a candidate, he's a President. That should give him more influence, don't you think?

Aunt Spiker · Oct 13, 2012

You know - a lot of people own stock in companies that outsource their jobs.

- just pointing out it's not immoral.

So what do you want him to do - sell his stock? Ask them to stop? What would they say - what's their incentive? What's the reason for them to listen - because he'd sell his stock if they don't?

I'm not sure how I feel about the concept of him using such powers of coercion to secure some jobs in the US by trying to force a company to swing it's practice around this way.

tererun · Oct 13, 2012

laska said:
The company likely has to move to China or close in order to stay competitive. If the company can produce goods cheaper in China it is likely better for consumers to move the jobs to China. It frees up inefficient labor to concentrate on creating wealth on something they are efficient at. We should have 0% corporate rates, 0% capital gains on ipo, have government single payer catastrophic health insurance to take health care costs from business, and companies would be moving to the USA because cost of doing business would be drastically lower. We really need free(subsidized) world class virtual university where people can download apps on world class job training plus a welfare program where those who lose their jobs can work on public works while they are acquiring new skills. This is politically incorrect but free trade and globalization raises living standards and is why those in poverty in this nation have big screens and cell phones.

That is not part of the argument at all. please stop trying to derail. I understand that it is financially better and will make Mitt Romney lots more money to do this because he is a large shareholder in the company. I am not arguing that fact at all. What I am saying is if he is all for the american worker then why doesn't he ask them to take the more expensive route and stick up for the people he is saying he is sticking up for? I am not even asking him to win or to force their hand. I am just wondering why he wont even meet with those people and is completely ignoring that it is happening. He isn't even asking the company to hold on so he try to pass legislation that would make american workers competitive. This is the guy who is out there every day telling middle america he has our back and understands our problems and will do something about it and he is doing nothing. He is completely ignoring a situation he would have huge influence in even if he was not the president of the US. He could do this under his own power and show us all how much of a man he is and he is turning his backs on them.

You can try to point blame at other people. You can try to say that other guy does it so why shouldn't he. That would be all great if mitt were just trying to be rich old Mitt Romney. It is all within the law and his rights, and it will make him lots of money. However, he is telling us we need to sacrifice to make this country better and he cannot even take a little time to do a great political gesture that would really raise public opinion of him. If he was not trying to be our friggen hero and save our nation from the evils of Obama and the recession and joblessness we were in I would not have any point at all, but that is exactly what he is doing.

Now stop deflecting and avoiding and tell me what type of person this shows mitt to truly be.

tererun · Oct 13, 2012

jerry7 said:
tererun said:

But he has not done anything. If he had we would have surely seen it. He would have made a big deal about trying to save those jobs. Why not do it for the public? It would only help them. This is not about obama, this is about Mitt, and how can anyone believe in him being the person who will look after the working middle class if he wont even ask his old company to do him a favor. You are trying to deflect this back on Obama, and that is not the issue. the issue is Mitt could do something and is not. If you want to argue about Obama not doing anything in this case make another thread and see how ridiculous you sound. We are talking about mitt romney and his claims right here, and why he cannot even do the smallest things that would mean a hell of a lot for those people and for his image. The only thing I see having any sort of threat is his bottom line and his bank account.[/QUOT

If Romney had any influence with Bain this move would not be taking place in the middle of his campaign regardless of his opinion of the move. You are using the actions of Bain to attack Romney when Obama actually has more influence with Bain than Romney. And once again if Romney contacted Bain leadership you would never know. The plight of these workers has been seized on by the left to score political points which makes it about the election and makes Obama fair game whether you like it or not.

Click to expand...

you cannot tell me romney does not have anty influence in bain as a huge stockholder, an ex ceo, and now running for president of the US. I don't have any influence in bain. Most stockholders in bain don't have much influence in that company. Mitt Romney was Bain Capital. They don't ignore his calls. That is his company, and even though he is retired they would listen to him. I am not saying they would do what he says, but he could at least make a show of it. It would do him some good. It looks a hell of a lot better than ignoring them. Yes, i am keeping this on Mitt.

tererun · Oct 13, 2012

Mycroft said:
As I said, he is doing it the conservative way...not the liberal way, as you want him to do.

Perhaps you would be better served by suggesting that Obama do what you think Romney should do. He's a liberal, he's very comfortable with telling people what HE thinks they should do and, for god's sakes...he's not just a candidate, he's a President. That should give him more influence, don't you think?

You can type it in whatever colors you want, but if mitt cannot do this small little thing than every claim he has to be looking out for the jobs of the middle class is completely bogus. He won't even aknowledge they are there. How is that seeing the plight of middle america? How is that caring for the people who work in this country? How is taking your profit from putting americans out of work without even asking they cut a little bit of it and keep those americans employed anything like the Mitt Romney he claims to be in his campaign?

Sarcogito · Oct 13, 2012

mike2810 said:
I would not be surprised that Romney's stock is in some sort of trust and he is not managing it. Many politicians do that to avoid conflict of interest.

The blind trust is an age old ruse.

tererun · Oct 13, 2012

Aunt Spiker said:
You know - a lot of people own stock in companies that outsource their jobs.

- just pointing out it's not immoral.

So what do you want him to do - sell his stock? Ask them to stop? What would they say - what's their incentive? What's the reason for them to listen - because he'd sell his stock if they don't?

I'm not sure how I feel about the concept of him using such powers of coercion to secure some jobs in the US by trying to force a company to swing it's practice around this way.

Ask them to stop would at least be something. It would be small, but coming from Mitt it would have as much push as anyone outside of the board has. The worst they are going to say is no. If they said no that would completely cut Mitt from bain in the public's eye. They might say yes. It would be a great boost to his campaign if they did. It would even boost his campaign if they didn't. So yes I would love him to just ask. That is a step of the tiniest magnitude and he will not even aknowledge they exist.

So yes i want him to man the **** up and show us he means business in the smallest possible way.

Mycroft · Oct 13, 2012

tererun said:
You can type it in whatever colors you want, but if mitt cannot do this small little thing than every claim he has to be looking out for the jobs of the middle class is completely bogus. He won't even aknowledge they are there. How is that seeing the plight of middle america? How is that caring for the people who work in this country? How is taking your profit from putting americans out of work without even asking they cut a little bit of it and keep those americans employed anything like the Mitt Romney he claims to be in his campaign?

What would be bogus is for Romney to start adopting liberals tactics.

tererun · Oct 13, 2012

Sarcogito said:
The blind trust is an age old ruse.

Thank you, it would seem that even Mitt romney agrees he could do something about this.

If Mitt Romney was serious.

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