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Which issues really decide your vote?

Why, because I don't live in fear of the rest of the world?

Because it demonstrates you do not understand the rest of the world. Allow me to explain:

1. the Middle East remains a strategic center of gravity in the world for two major reasons: the oil and the shipping chokepoints, and huge chunks of the world economy are dependent on both of those. instability in the region threatens those two facets, thus threatening the world (and our) economy.

2. the Middle East is inherently unstable, as demonstrated by nothing better than recent events. Tyrannical governments keep their populace in line with the stick of the mukhaberat nd the carrot of the welfare state based on revenues generated from nationalized resources (read: oil and the Suez). But that rentier state carrot is intensely vulnerable to falling revenues and - as the Iranian Shah and Mubarak learned to their chagrin - can rapidly inspire revolution followed by replacement by radical (and themselves inherently destabilizing) elements. Internally, the Middle East is a bubbling cauldron, and the resources upon which much of the worlds' economy is based right there in the middle.

Internationally, among the Sunnis, Egypt and Saudi Arabia both consider themselves the natural leaders, and have already proven willing in Yemen to shoot at each other over that disagreement. The Iraqi's also consider themselves the natural leader of the Arab world, but lately they haven't been a serious contender. The Saudis are currently attempting to take control over the region through the exportation of Wahabism, which is itself inherently destabilizing, as it preaches the overthrow of the National-Socialist model governments left over from the 60's and 70's in Egypt (check) and Pakistan, (as well, obviously, as the democracy - as much as it exists - in Lebanon and in Israel) followed by the violent unification of the region under a single banner, followed by an invasion of the rest of the world. They aren't kidding about that part, and we are idiots if we fail to take them at their word, especially as they seem to have just succeeded in part A of step 1, the removal of the Mubarak regime.

The Iranians are the largest terror-exporting nation in the world, and they are very, very good at it. The IRGC, and in particular the Quds forces, have fostered the growth of Hezbollah (the real deadliest terrorist network in the world - Al Quada was their student, not the other way around), Hamas, and even (through proxies) Al Quada. They are currently waging a campaign to destroy the Lebanese government, and are strengthening ties with Syria and Turkey in an attempt to build a base with which to challenge the US and Saudi Arabia for dominance of the region, part of that struggle (they assume) including the destruction of Israel. The leadership of that nation Really Believes that the 13th Imam is coming soon, and that they must kick off international Jihad in order for him to arrive and bring about the End Times - and again, we are fools if we fail to take them at their word on that.

3. the region, thus, needs an overpowering, hegemon if it is to remain stable enough to ensure the non-collapse of the world economy. Someone has to impose order and keep these nutjobs from destroying the ability of the world to access the oil and the suez. There is only one nation currently on the planet with the capacity to perform this task: the US. The US Fifth Fleet, currently headuquartered in Bahrain, is the major (and perhaps only realistic) force for stability in that region, contending with numerous, powerful forces for instability.

4. Withdrawal or severe downdrawl of US Forces would create a power vacuum and kick off fights within the sunni community and between Iran and Saudi Arabia for regional dominance. Shiite Iran is seeking to get nukes. Syria has had a nuclear facility already destroyed by the Israelis. Sunni Pakistan (see: Wahhabi plans for governments, the overthrow and replacement of) already has them. In the face of a US Withdrawal, Saudi Arabia certainly would start developing her own.

Imagine a Mexican standoff, except that 3 of the 4 players are A) paranoid schizophrenics facing opponents they violently hate, B) convinced that death will be a net benefit for them, C) convinced that their souls are in peril if they don't shoot, and D) potentially armed with nukes (the 4th Player is the unfortunately-located Israel). I think everyone here can agree that that is not a "stable" situation, particularly when you add in E) these countries are not internally stable, but may feel forced into an external war in order to solidify internal support and F) at least two of the players (Iran and Saudi Arabia) are held hostage by their own extremists, who feel free to act without permission, are nearly impossible to stop, and are most desirous of the conflict. And I feel that A) deserves rementioning.

FUN FACTS WORTH NOTING: China (also nuclear) is rapidly becoming a good, good friend of Iran, and is semi-distancing itself from Pakistan (whom it largely views as a foil against India). China is also heavily invested in East Africa. It is possible that China would seek to intervene in the region to tilt the balance in Iran's favor as the US did in Saudi Arabia's. If that happens, then the newly Taliban (and nuclear!) Pakistan - which is deeply paranoid, xenophobic, and a wierd mixture of Wahhabist and neo-Deobandi - becomes an ally of Saudi Arabia, and our players are all now holding two pistols even as their inner demons scream at them to shoot first. BEST CASE SCENARIO here is that China is able to stabilize (kinda) the region, and merely takes all the oil for itself - only partially collapsing the world economy. but that's the "best" case, not the "most likely" one. it's not even really a "sorta likely" or a "semi likely" one.

5. The West is dying. Literally - our creation of an entitlement culture and our devotion to materialism have left us with birthrates below replacement level. In both Europe and America the solution has been mass immigration - but both have had issues with assimilation. America here is comparatively lucky, her immigrants share many of her cultural assumptions. But Europe is not - the West in Europe is being replaced by a high-birthrate Islamic culture which does not accept the Enlightenment. As the immigrant populations threaten to break the local safety nets and culture, the backlash they provoke isn't what we would recognize as classic liberalism, but rather classic fascism. Nationalist groups are springing up all over Europe, though they are doomed by their own inability to breed to dying out after sparking conflict. All those aspects of the West that we consider dear; the rights of the individaul, limited, secular government, free markets... they are doomed to wither and die as the culture that upholds them does.



The situation at current cannot sustain indefinitely - eventually the destabilizing elements that are currently inherent in the Middle East will win, and the price of loss is not just a world wide economic collapse, but the slide, decline, and perhaps fall of the West. The long-term solution is therefore to change the rules of the game. The destabilizing elements in the Middle East must be replaced with stabilizing ones. Tyrannies must (carefully) be replaced with representative governments that give public pressure an outlet other than violent overthrow. Rentier societies that encourage stagnation, revolution, and hostility abroad must be replaced with market economies that encourage trade, growth, and a politically active middle class with a vested interest in stability. Radical Islam must be replaced with a new ideology that allows Muslims to recoup their pride and independence without striking at others. In short, we need to allow the Enlightenment to do to Islam what it has done to Christianity.

Even with our presence, US pursual of that strategy (again, as we see today) is not guaranteed, and even with US pursual of that strategy, sucess is not any kind of certain.... but if the US withdraws before these things are accomplished (or, at least, accomplished enough to become self-feeding cycles), then the game is up. the match is struck. Europe falls, China moves to become hegemon, nukes possibly fly, and back to the Dark Ages we go, but this time with much, much better weapons with which to massacre each other in the name of God.

In the short run, a world without a global US presence is merely one in which Iran, India, China, Russia, Saudi Arabia, and Egypt all compete against each other for control over the worlds' critical choke points, turning our current global system into a series of mercantilist blocs, and causing economic meltdown here in the United States. In the long run, a world without a global US presence is a much, much, much uglier place. But hey, if you have evidence that the CCP or the Muslim Brotherhood leadership isn't a bunch of Nationalist Corporatist/Islamists willing to sacrifice nigh on anything to retain power, and is in fact a bunch of misunderstood liberal, free-traders who stay up late at nights reading Locke, I'd be glad to see it.
 
It's also worth noting that that's merely the cost to us. The cost to the world will be much, much heavier. On top of global depression, on top of the increased instability and resultant loss of investment capital, on top of damage wrought by war, they've now lost their back-stop response to natural disaster. There is no US Navy Response to tsunamis' in Indonesia or Daichi without a forward-deployed 7th Fleet. The Phillipines get no help when floods wipe away their people, and so on and so forth etc. That may be relatively minor to you, but it's people's lives, and its' important.
 
I cannot vote for any candidate or party who claims the entire problem with the debt were in is because of Govt and Public worker pays and benefits and Medicare, Social Security and Medicaid and believes the way to fix it is to give huge tax breaks to only the richest americans.
There have been several republican govs attack their state and public workers and then turned around and either gave or tried to give tax cuts....thats mostly what I hear is needed from the republicans and thats why im voting for Obama.
 
Nice that you have a clear-cut decision to make. For people like me, a Traditionalist, Isolationist, Nationalist, and Ultra-Conservative the options are nowhere near as clear-cut and obvious. In most cases this means I end up not voting for anyone.

Perhaps you should rethink how extreme your positions are if not even a third party candidate is representative of your views, and if there is someone vote for them, but if you have a minority viewpoint you can't expect much to be accomplished.

As to other comments ITT not wanting to be a second class citizen is a pretty powerful motive to vote, I accept whatever critique people want to give over being a one issue voter, but I have other opinions on issues, and FWIW they are closer to the democrats than the republicans so it isn't like I am voting against everything for one issue, just a few things.
 
I cannot vote for any candidate or party who claims the entire problem with the debt were in is because of Govt and Public worker pays and benefits and Medicare, Social Security and Medicaid and believes the way to fix it is to give huge tax breaks to only the richest americans.


Huh. Is there a "we don't like math" party?
 
"It's the economy stupid."

Under Obama it has gotten gradually better. Under the Republicans it has crashed not once but twice. Romney has no new ideas for his party.

Other things I care about

Education
Social tolerance
Globalization
Science & Tech
 
Star knows my position quite well by now. I'm not saying anything she isn't already aware of my feelings on.



NO. The exact OPPOSITE. It is only once Traditional Morals and Values are returned to the vast majority of the population that the economy will be fixed. Not through magic either, but rather through the common sense, reason, and logic attached to those Traditional Morals and Values.

Boy have I got the place for you! There's this place where they take social values and religion very seriously. They also believe women to be inferior and kill homosexuals. They are often described as ultra-conservative... mouth watering yet? The middle east my friend!!! It has your name written all over it. Now there is a little problem though... the whole religion thing, hmmm, I'm assuming you're some form of Jesus type you're going to have to work that out once you get there. I'm sure they'll be accepting of this and treat you real nice, being that they are just like you!
 
Huh. Is there a "we don't like math" party?


They like math...they just use the reverse math that the gop uses....they use 30 yrs of tax cuts...outsourcing and putting taxpaying americans out of work by the millions and making them party of the 47 percent and wall street financial institutions that are as crooked as it gets and have been raping the country....
 
Good luck with that. Just realize that there are many people like ME out there who will not have our viewpoints changed by you or anyone else.

You can have your views, but don't try to apply your bible to me. Things like killing, assault, theft, and crimes against other people I see as good to have laws against. i do not see things like religios or non-religious choices to be any business of yours. As long as i am having sex with a consenting adult, it is no business of yours who it is. If i want to marry a consenting adult, that is my business. If you are going to give government benefits to married couples then you give marriage o any consenting adult. We are not the christian police of the world, despite how you want to be. You should not get to tell me what i can say, or what i can put into my body.

Your rights to my actions begin and end with your property and body. Oh, and i also believe that when you try to use the government to overextend your power over me I have every right to revolt and use a firearm to protect my rights.
 
"It's the economy stupid."

Under Obama it has gotten gradually better. Under the Republicans it has crashed not once but twice. Romney has no new ideas for his party.

Other things I care about

Education
Social tolerance
Globalization
Science & Tech

why do you support globalization? o_O
 
....

In the short run, a world without a global US presence is merely one in which Iran, India, China, Russia, Saudi Arabia, and Egypt all compete against each other for control over the worlds' critical choke points, turning our current global system into a series of mercantilist blocs, and causing economic meltdown here in the United States. In the long run, a world without a global US presence is a much, much, much uglier place. But hey, if you have evidence that the CCP or the Muslim Brotherhood leadership isn't a bunch of Nationalist Corporatist/Islamists willing to sacrifice nigh on anything to retain power, and is in fact a bunch of misunderstood liberal, free-traders who stay up late at nights reading Locke, I'd be glad to see it.


So to paraphrase your lengthy post:

Without the USofA the world would swiftly descend into anarchy, communism, and terrorism.

The USofA is, and must continue to be the world's police force. For all eternity.

Do I have that summarized some-what correctly?
 
Who ever isn't Republican.


Partisan Hackery aside,

It's

1. Economics

2. Foreign Policy

3. Willingness to pursue Scientific Interests
 
1. Practicality - positive points for demonstrated commitment to working with both sides of the aisle in a civil and thoughtful manner, negative points for very black or white ideology.

2. Fairness/Compassion - demonstrated ability to see multiple sides of an issue, desire to treat different classes of people fairly, to be a representative for everyone, not just those whose votes he/she received.

3. Independence - independent mind (without being a "maverick" simply for the sake of being different), willingness to buck partisan pressure, or pressure from financial backers.

4. Rational policy ideas - should have their own perspective and vision to contribute to debate, ideas that aim to support and make life better for as many people as possible.

5. Balance - I think about how the candidate would affect the balance of power and debate in government.

I've supported both republicans and democrats in the past with these qualities, even though their underlying policy ideas were very different and even opposite to each other or my own views.
 
An old college buddy told me that he was going to vote for the candidate who would personally benefit him the most. He wants a government handout, and he doesn't want to pay any taxes, so he said he is going to vote for Romney.

My friend is rich, he inherited money from his uncle shortly after he graduated college. He lives on the dividends and occasional sale of stock from his portfolio, and one day he will likely inherit again, this time from his parents who are fairly wealthy themselves. Romney has promised to eliminate capital gains and inheritance taxes so that people like himself (Romney) and my friend, will no longer have to pay taxes.
 
Which issues really decide your vote?

My biggest issues is whether or not they are REAL Men and not controlled by the CFR or other Foreign Banking interest. which is why I'm voting for Ron Paul.

Barry and Mittens are CFR lapdogs.
 
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