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Forward To Tired Old Liberalism

T

The Prof

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rubio told a story:

i watched my first republican convention in 1980 with my cigar smoking grandfather who was born a poor cuban and left permanently disabled by polio, his family sent him to school and he became the only one of them who could read

he talked baseball, history and politics, but the one thing i remember---the dreams he had when he was young became impossible in his circumstances to achieve

but not me, abuelo said, i was american, i was free...

obama's newest slogan is forward, but to where?

a govt that borrows a trillion a year more than it brings in, an 800B stim that creates more debt than jobs, a govt intrusion into health care paid for with middle class taxes and medicare cuts, scores of new restricting rules and regulations...

these are not forward, they are back, back to the tired old big govt policies of the past

they are ideas people like my grandfather came to america to get away from

back to a time and place where the only change is that hope is hard to find, where americans are told they're worse off because others are better off, that some get rich by making others poor

hope and change becomes divide and conquer

we are not divided by race and ethnicity but united by common core values

we are not trapped by the circumstances of our birth...

the dem response, stated by the convention chair: Villaraigosa: Republicans 'can't just trot out a brown face' - First Read

post racial america, anyone?

who ya gonna turn to in days like these for hope and change?
 
That's a nice non sequitur story. How do you reconcile that sentimental bull**** with Republicans campaigning on cutting funding for schools (Ryan plan), raising taxes on the poor and middle classes (again, see the Ryan plan) and reducing the availability of health care for the poor? (repealing Obamacare)

we are not trapped by the circumstances of our birth...
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Not yet, but the Republicans sure are trying their damnedest to cut our bootstraps and shoot economic mobility in the face.
 
economic mobility

nyt friday: 58% of all new jobs created since the official end of the recession three years ago, almost exactly coincident with barack hussein's elevation, have been on the lowest rung of the income ladder, earning between $7.69 and $13.83 per hour

http://www.nytimes.com/2012/08/31/business/majority-of-new-jobs-pay-low-wages-study-finds.html

top growth industries are retail, averaging $10.97, with food prep #2 at $9.04

the biggest loser was middle earners, according to the new york times, friday, august 31, 2012

60% of jobs lost during the recession pulled down $13.84 to $21.13

only 22% of jobs recouped during the misnamed "recovery" are in this middle earning group

that's a lot of mobility, granted, but it's all the wrong way

wages are a profoundly underappreciated parameter in all poor-economy elections, playing a prominent role attendant unemployment

no amount of obfuscation, recrimination or todd akin can alter the food server's daily comeuppance against her $9.04

at least that's the gray lady's lament---friday, aug 31

no spin, wynn

seeya at the polls, progressives
 
Gawd, another tired old immigrant story....from a Republican Cuban American who is against immigration.

The GOP claim they're for the free market but then they want to close off the borders to free trade.

They claim they want less government interference, but then they want the government to create jobs.

I'm starting to notice a pattern here.
 
You: "We should eat gravel!"
Me: "Gravel has no nutritious value and eating it will damage your digestive track."
You: "Tree bark tastes bad. [news story about tree bark sucking] We should eat gravel."
Me: "Yeah, tree bark ****ing sucks, but how the **** does that make gravel a better alternative?"
You: "...We should eat gravel!"
 
Moot said:
Gawd, another tired old immigrant story....from a Republican Cuban American who is against immigration.

The GOP claim they're for the free market but then they want to close off the borders to free trade.

They claim they want less government interference, but then they want the government to create jobs.

I'm starting to notice a pattern here.
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The only pattern I can see in your post is that you misrepresent other's words.

Rubio isn't against immigration...he's against ILLEGAL immigration. These two are not the same regardless your attempts to make them so.

Republicans want to close borders to illegal immigration...not to trade. Republicans LIKE trade.

Republicans don't want the government to create jobs...they want the government to get out of the way of the PEOPLE, who create jobs.
 
Mycroft said:
The only pattern I can see in your post is that you misrepresent other's words.

Rubio isn't against immigration...he's against ILLEGAL immigration. These two are not the same regardless your attempts to make them so.
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So where is the Republican's plan for immigration reform?

Republicans want to close borders to illegal immigration...not to trade. Republicans LIKE trade.
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Mexico is the US's third largest trading partner and it's shameful the way US exploited their markets and displaced their population which caused the illegal immigration in the first place. With trading partners like the US who needs enemies?


Republicans don't want the government to create jobs...they want the government to get out of the way of the PEOPLE, who create jobs.
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Thats what they say, but when I read the RNC platform, it looked almost exactly like what Obama has been doing for the last four years, including funding for infrastructure, education, tax breaks for small businesses, etc.



China is the US's second largest trading partner but you would never know that Republicans liked trade the way Romney was threatening China with sanctions, tariffs and threatening military intervention in the S. China seas. Perhaps someone should remind Romney that China is also one the largest buyers of US debt.

"...The principal attack came through an editorial on Monday in China Daily, the state-run newspaper, which called Mr. Romney’s policies “an outdated manifestation of a Cold War mentality” that “endorses the ‘China threat’ theory and focuses on containing China’s rise.”

China Slams Romney for 'Pugnacious' Policies - NYTimes.com
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I have to agree, Republican's policies are stuck in the Cold War. It is time to move forward, not backward to tired old conservatism that created the economic crisis in the first place.
 
Mycroft said:
Rubio isn't against immigration...he's against ILLEGAL immigration. These two are not the same regardless your attempts to make them so.

Republicans want to close borders to illegal immigration...not to trade. Republicans LIKE trade.

Republicans don't want the government to create jobs...they want the government to get out of the way of the PEOPLE, who create jobs.
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You sir, are totally correct.

A L
 
Moot said:
So where is the Republican's plan for immigration reform?

"Immigration reform" is the tired old liberalism that's never dealt with illegal immigration. Republicans know this and would rather enforce our existing immigration laws that would be more than adequate in dealing with it.

Mexico is the US's third largest trading partner and it's shameful the way US exploited their markets and displaced their population which caused the illegal immigration in the first place. With trading partners like the US who needs enemies?

If the Mexicans have a problem with the trade they are doing with the U.S., they are free to stop...that is inherent in the concept of "free trade". But our trade with Mexico isn't the cause of their problems...THEY are the cause of their problems and they have the responsibility to correct their problems.

Thats what they say, but when I read the RNC platform, it looked almost exactly like what Obama has been doing for the last four years, including funding for infrastructure, education, tax breaks for small businesses, etc.

You either know nothing of the two Parties...or you don't know how to read. The differences are fundamental.

China is the US's second largest trading partner but you would never know that Republicans liked trade the way Romney was threatening China with sanctions, tariffs and threatening military intervention in the S. China seas. Perhaps someone should remind Romney that China is also one the largest buyers of US debt.

Sounds like you think we should act toward China the way you think Mexico acts toward us. Sorry, but Romney knows the importance of dealing with situations that are not in the best interest of us...and our allies.

I have to agree, Republican's policies are stuck in the Cold War. It is time to move forward, not backward to tired old conservatism that created the economic crisis in the first place.
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The Cold War has nothing to do with Republican policies...but it makes for a nice liberal sound bite (something else that's tired about liberalism...basing all their actions on sound bites). Also, liberals are the one's who are fundamentally responsible for the economic crisis...you should educate yourself on that sometime.
 
It is so dumb when either of the two mainstream parties try to play this off as some huge war the ideologies. There isn't some huge rift in the records of Obama/Biden or Romney/Ryan or even just between the two major parties for all this high flying rhetoric. If you want to argue about specific policies that's fine but there is no evidence that either campaign is presenting anything different ideologically.

Lets take the fact that Romney supported the same government intervention into healthcare as Obama did while he was governor of MA. Ryan voted for TARP and Romney supported the need and passage of it (though he thought there were some problems with it). Ryan also voted for Medicare part D despite the fact that it added to the deficit.

To me it seems like Romney and Ryan are complaining about Obama returning to the same ideology they supported in the Bush years. The whole campaign by Romney and Ryan has been whitewashing their own history and the history of the republican party. Elections aren't referendums in this country, they are choices. Despite the rhetoric of Romney and Ryan lately their past show that in terms of ideology they offer no distinct choice from Obama.
 
E-M said:
It is so dumb when either of the two mainstream parties try to play this off as some huge war the ideologies.
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But aren't you forgetting Nancy's "We'll pass it first then figure out what's wrong with it". Never, ever to I remember anything close to that insane stupidity coming from the Republicans. That, to me, is a HUGE difference in ideologies.

A L
 
The Prof said:
obama's newest slogan is forward, but to where?
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Going back would be nice. Back to full employment, lower gasoline prices, less regulations, less government spending, etc.
 
ChunkySalsa said:
That's a nice non sequitur story. How do you reconcile that sentimental bull**** with Republicans campaigning on cutting funding for schools (Ryan plan), raising taxes on the poor and middle classes (again, see the Ryan plan) and reducing the availability of health care for the poor? (repealing Obamacare)
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There's only so much money. We can either deal with that fact in a straightforward fashion or have it all crash down around our feet.
 
LowDown said:
Going back would be nice. Back to full employment, lower gasoline prices, less regulations, less government spending, etc.
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Now there's an idea with some real appeal...
 
Another Lurker said:
But aren't you forgetting Nancy's "We'll pass it first then figure out what's wrong with it". Never, ever to I remember anything close to that insane stupidity coming from the Republicans. That, to me, is a HUGE difference in ideologies.
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Really? The dumb statement of one member is grounds for a huge ideological shift? What exactly does that state about the 'liberal' ideology?

When it comes to the dumbest thing I've heard a politician say it would probably be Michelle Bachmann's statement that the founding fathers "worked tirelessly until slavery was no more in the United States." The only figure she could cite was John Quincy Adams, the son of a founding father. What is worse is that her whole tea party movement was based around returning back to the principles of the founding fathers and the constitution. Somehow she saw it fit to ignore that Washington and Jefferson owned slaves and that the constitution originally defined a slave as 3/5ths of a person. Apparently for Bachmann "working tirelessly" against slavery means 'profiting from and legally protecting' slavery.

Regardless, every ideology has its idiotic members. My point is that the actions of Romney and Ryan in the past seem to indicate they follow an ideology that isn't much different from Obama's.
 
nancy pelosi, speaker of the house, banger of the giant gavel, leader of the caucus, one third of single party control of the united states govt, prodigious fundraiser, known for the iron hand wielding the fearsome whip, cat o nine tails...

merely one member?

ok

to cram via senate reconciliation a radical reform of the entire united states health care system, one sixth of the economy, relied upon like life itself by seniors and children and moms who are married and moms who are single...

why, the dame was damn near set to DEEM the dumb thing

House may try to pass Senate health-care bill without voting on it

one sixth of the economy, vital lifeblood, as critical to the household as air

Democrats Reid, Pelosi prepare to craft Obama's final healthcare bill behind closed doors - latimes.com

obama promised transparency

Barack Obama "Public Will Have 5 Days To Look At Every Bill That Lands On My Desk" - YouTube

instead we got closets, locked doors, whispered plannings

you'll have to pass it to find out what's in it---one sixth of the us economy

more power to em, of course, she's speaker, he's prez

but you can't sidestep the consequences, at least not outside your own precious little narcissistic musings

OTHER people are equally entitled to THEIR musings too

Nov, 2010: Obama concedes 'shellacking' - Washington Times

michelle bachmann and the boston slave trade?

LOL!

why even contemplate a point so insignificant and microscopic it can only be seen as purely petty and personal

there is a campaign going on over the macro direction of a whole lot more than one sixth of the still most crucial economy on the planet

if major budget reform is not enacted immediately, our precious social programs---social security, medicare and medicaid, as well as public pensions---will simply not exist for our next generation, at least not in the form we've all come to expect

leadership is required

ie, a quarterback not a pusillanimous punter
 
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It's time to find someone who can lead from the front.
 
ChunkySalsa said:
That's a nice non sequitur story. How do you reconcile that sentimental bull**** with Republicans campaigning on cutting funding for schools (Ryan plan), raising taxes on the poor and middle classes (again, see the Ryan plan) and reducing the availability of health care for the poor? (repealing Obamacare)


Not yet, but the Republicans sure are trying their damnedest to cut our bootstraps and shoot economic mobility in the face.
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Emotional platitudes without any basis in fact

Obama is the one who cut 716B from Medicare

Obama is the one who has saddled future generations with massive debt

Obama is the one who has presided over abysmal GDP and Job Growth

Obama is the one who massively raised taxes on the poor and middle class (Obamacare)

Your premise that the poor and middle class are going to get HC under Obamacare is laughable. Seniors are also getting the shaft with Obamacare by having the funds they paid into the system over their entire lives get raided by greedy liberals such as yourself to pay for Sandra Flukes 9 dollar a month birth control pill.

The ROMNEY/Ryan plan pushes for competition in a corrupt and failing Public School System. You're rhetoric is old, tired, and cliche. It's nothing more than fear mongering. That's what you have been reduced to. Championing what you believe and pointing to any success under this far left Democrat corrupt administration is not possible for you, so you're reduced to playing lap dog for the WH, spewing their talking points in a state of emotional bliss.

You still have time to come over the winning side that understands Economics and Job Creation which is Romney/Ryan
 
Hare said:
200 Common Redundancies - Cut Redundant Expressions
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Although the phrase makes the redundancies list ... it is not applicable when referring to the Kenyan. His big thing is about what a great 'leader' he is ... and yet we fail to see the leadership. Example, the Kenyan laid claim to 'leading the west against Mohamar' while all the time sitting back watching ESPN.

I think it is appropo, regardless of what the list says.

An old man's opinion.

A L
 
 
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Another Lurker said:
When the country was founded and lasted until FDR. You didn't work, you didn't eat.
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Not much for compassionate conservatism I see. Also a fan of constant market bubble's and burst and also a fan of economic depression too I see.

Another Lurker said:
Drilling our own oil comes to mind.
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Well when it comes to making policy that what we drill, we use.... guess which party votes against it? Yep... The Grand 'Ol Party. Oil is an international commodity that get's sold on the world market. That means what we drill does NOT get used here. Why? because we pay the least for our oil. Oil companies drill out natural resources and sell them abroad to the highest bidder... so again... What policy can be enacted from your perspective, that will lower our gasoline prices?
 
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