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Something doesn't add up about Paul Ryan.

T

Tucker Case

Matthew 16:3
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He voted for the bailouts of the auto industry (SOCIALISM!!!!!) and he voted for the $700 billion bailouts of the banks (SOCIALISM!!!!!), so why the hell are people calling him a fiscal conservative?

Can someone explain this one to me, because it just doesn't make any ****ing sense. Thanks.
 
Tucker Case said:
He voted for the bailouts of the auto industry (SOCIALISM!!!!!) and he voted for the $700 billion bailouts of the banks (SOCIALISM!!!!!), so why the hell are people calling him a fiscal conservative?

Can someone explain this one to me, because it just doesn't make any ****ing sense. Thanks.
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He also voted for Medicare Part D, and he voted for the Iraq War and the Bush tax cuts. IOW, he has voted for just about everything that has led to massive deficits ... while he is considered by the right to be the small government messiah.

Things that make you go ... hmmmm?
 
Tucker Case said:
He voted for the bailouts of the auto industry (SOCIALISM!!!!!) and he voted for the $700 billion bailouts of the banks (SOCIALISM!!!!!), so why the hell are people calling him a fiscal conservative?

Can someone explain this one to me, because it just doesn't make any ****ing sense. Thanks.
Click to expand...
When looks down and see's gangrene setting into your foot and threatening to kill you, one doesnt WANT to do it, but MUST decide to amputate the leg to save the life.

I have no doubt Ryan has cast his share of votes that contributed to the problems as has every elected politician. He is offering solutions. Considering the 'supercommittee' of republicans and democrats couldnt come up with basic DEFICIT cuts over a 10 year span, to say nothing of debt cuts, at least Ryan is offering some form of solution. More individuals, on both sides of the aisle, that would be willing to engage MIGHT just prevent this generation from kicking tomorrows generation in the balls to pay for our foolishness.
 
VanceMack said:
When looks down and see's gangrene setting into your foot and threatening to kill you, one doesnt WANT to do it, but MUST decide to amputate the leg to save the life.

I have no doubt Ryan has cast his share of votes that contributed to the problems as has every elected politician. He is offering solutions. Considering the 'supercommittee' of republicans and democrats couldnt come up with basic DEFICIT cuts over a 10 year span, to say nothing of debt cuts, at least Ryan is offering some form of solution. More individuals, on both sides of the aisle, that would be willing to engage MIGHT just prevent this generation from kicking tomorrows generation in the balls to pay for our foolishness.
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Why should we care more about his rhetoric than his record?
 
Tucker Case said:
He voted for the bailouts of the auto industry (SOCIALISM!!!!!) and he voted for the $700 billion bailouts of the banks (SOCIALISM!!!!!), so why the hell are people calling him a fiscal conservative?

Can someone explain this one to me, because it just doesn't make any ****ing sense. Thanks.
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Ryan is a typical Washington insider who changes to whatever it takes to get reelected.
 
VanceMack said:
When looks down and see's gangrene setting into your foot and threatening to kill you, one doesnt WANT to do it, but MUST decide to amputate the leg to save the life.

I have no doubt Ryan has cast his share of votes that contributed to the problems as has every elected politician. He is offering solutions. Considering the 'supercommittee' of republicans and democrats couldnt come up with basic DEFICIT cuts over a 10 year span, to say nothing of debt cuts, at least Ryan is offering some form of solution. More individuals, on both sides of the aisle, that would be willing to engage MIGHT just prevent this generation from kicking tomorrows generation in the balls to pay for our foolishness.
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Did you know that Ryan was on the president's Bowles-Simpson panel? Accounts from other members of the panel suggest that Ryan came into it like a ball of fire, but by the end, at nut-cutting time, he reverted to partisan form and rejected the hard choices that emerged in the Bowles-Simpson plan. Ryan talks a good game, but at the end of the day he's just another career politician toeing the party line.
 
Tucker Case said:
Why should we care more about his rhetoric than his record?
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You shouldnt. You should care about it all. But isnt it just a TEENSY bit hypocritical to make that point towards Ryan and not towards every politician in the race, or for that matter, congress? A lot of people said at the time...I dont like having to vote for the auto industry bailout but believe it is the only way to keep it afloat.

He didnt just start coming out against spending when his candidacy was declared. He offered the Ryan plan a few years ago. Considering we are 16 trillion in debt, are running annual deficits between 1.5 and 3 trillion, with no end in sight and not so much as a budget passed in 3 years...offering a plan to FIX things isnt the worst thing a representative can do.

But hey...we COULD do this all day long. Obama blamed 5% unemployment on Bush, but then says 8.3% unemployment isnt the presidents fault. Candidate Obama blamed high gas prices on Bush, but now says the president doesnt have any input to gas prices. Obama said using black ops prisons was a bad thing but has expanded black ops prison use as president. Obama said the surge was a bad thing, then used the Bush plan to surge in Afghanistan. And the same can be said about Romney. And about Biden. On...and on...and on...

Politics is what it is.
 
VanceMack said:
When looks down and see's gangrene setting into your foot and threatening to kill you, one doesnt WANT to do it, but MUST decide to amputate the leg to save the life.
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That sounds like a fancy definition of flip-flopping to me.
 
TheNextEra said:
That sounds like a fancy definition of flip-flopping to me.
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Is it? I think there is a vast difference. What Romney and Obama is doing is outright flip flopping. But seriously...are you telling me YOU have never done something you had to do, even if it wasnt really what you WANT to do? Hell...I can go you one better. Damn near EVERY PERSON on this board has said the same thing at one time or another. "I despise the two candidates running...but what choice do I have?" Does that make you all ****ing hypocrites?
 
VanceMack said:
When looks down and see's gangrene setting into your foot and threatening to kill you, one doesnt WANT to do it, but MUST decide to amputate the leg to save the life.

I have no doubt Ryan has cast his share of votes that contributed to the problems as has every elected politician. He is offering solutions. Considering the 'supercommittee' of republicans and democrats couldnt come up with basic DEFICIT cuts over a 10 year span, to say nothing of debt cuts, at least Ryan is offering some form of solution. More individuals, on both sides of the aisle, that would be willing to engage MIGHT just prevent this generation from kicking tomorrows generation in the balls to pay for our foolishness.
Click to expand...

Ryan's plan doesn't balance the budget for at least 28 years, according to the CBO.
 
Tucker Case said:
He voted for the bailouts of the auto industry (SOCIALISM!!!!!) and he voted for the $700 billion bailouts of the banks (SOCIALISM!!!!!), so why the hell are people calling him a fiscal conservative?

Can someone explain this one to me, because it just doesn't make any ****ing sense. Thanks.
Click to expand...

You know just notice?
 
Kandahar said:
Ryan's plan doesn't balance the budget for at least 28 years, according to the CBO.
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Without SOME sort of plan we will be an additional 20 trillion in debt in 10 years (thats 36 trillion), NOT counting interest costs.
 
VanceMack said:
Is it? I think there is a vast difference. What Romney and Obama is doing is outright flip flopping. But seriously...are you telling me YOU have never done something you had to do, even if it wasnt really what you WANT to do? Hell...I can go you one better. Damn near EVERY PERSON on this board has said the same thing at one time or another. "I despise the two candidates running...but what choice do I have?" Does that make you all ****ing hypocrites?
Click to expand...

Oh come on, please tell us how he was FORCED to vote for the bailouts. This ought to be good. Hey if making excuses so that you can hold your nose and vote for a cadidate works for you, great. That's on you.
 
TheNextEra said:
Oh come on, please tell us how he was FORCED to vote for the bailouts. This ought to be good. Hey if making excuses so that you can hold your nose and vote for a cadidate works for you, great. That's on you.
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No one suggested he was 'forced' to. GM was on the brink of total collapse. Could just be that even though he felt it wasnt a GREAT thing the alternative was worse. You either lack basic comprehension and critical thinking skills or are...well...a hack. I'll let you answer that...I dont know you well enough.
 
VanceMack said:
Without SOME sort of plan we will be an additional 20 trillion in debt in 10 years (thats 36 trillion), NOT counting interest costs.
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Some sort of plan is all well and good. Ryan's plan...not so much. It eviscerates the federal budget, adds on another big tax cut for the rich, and doesn't even balance the budget.
 
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VanceMack said:
You shouldnt. You should care about it all. But isnt it just a TEENSY bit hypocritical to make that point towards Ryan and not towards every politician in the race, or for that matter, congress?
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It's a good thing I make that point towards a ****load of people on both sides of the political divide, then.

A lot of people said at the time...I dont like having to vote for the auto industry bailout but believe it is the only way to keep it afloat.
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And if they have the balls to point the blame finger at themselves for passing those laws, I'd commend them for it. I'd respect someone who did that, even if I disagreed with them.

He didnt just start coming out against spending when his candidacy was declared. He offered the Ryan plan a few years ago. Considering we are 16 trillion in debt, are running annual deficits between 1.5 and 3 trillion, with no end in sight and not so much as a budget passed in 3 years...offering a plan to FIX things isnt the worst thing a representative can do.
Click to expand...

So he's offering a plan now to fix the problems he helped create then. That's like me stealing all of your money and then providing you with job applications and a plan to get a second job to recoup all that money I stole from you.


But hey...we COULD do this all day long. Obama blamed 5% unemployment on Bush, but then says 8.3% unemployment isnt the presidents fault. Candidate Obama blamed high gas prices on Bush, but now says the president doesnt have any input to gas prices. Obama said using black ops prisons was a bad thing but has expanded black ops prison use as president. Obama said the surge was a bad thing, then used the Bush plan to surge in Afghanistan. And the same can be said about Romney. And about Biden. On...and on...and on...
Click to expand...

Absolutely. Not only can one say those things, I've often said those things. I'm talking about Ryan this time, but that hasn't stopped me from talking about the others, nor will I ever hold back from talking about the others on both sides of the bull**** American political spectrum.

Politics is what it is.
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True. It's disgusting. But what truly sickens me is that so many people who aren't politicians eat this **** up and say "Thank you for the nice meal" afterward. My problem isn't with Ryan being a politician. My problem is with people being stupid enough to not only believe his line of bull****, but to share that line of bull**** with others as though it's true. If he was calling himself a fiscal conservative, I'd simply chalk it up as standard political bull****. But random people on the street are saying that nonsense. People who will gain nothing for it.

That's the thing I don't understand.
 
Tucker Case said:
Notice what?
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Paul Ryan is the opposite of everything he claiming to stand for? You know his biggest donors right? Doesn't it bother even a little where his funding is coming from. Yes I know about Obama is bought. I'm just asking you about Ryan since its about him.
 
Kandahar said:
Some sort of plan is all well and good. Ryan's plan...not so much. It eviscerates the federal budget, adds on another big tax cut for the rich, and doesn't even balance the budget.
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It SHOULD gut the federal budget...but the nice thing about negotiations is both sides come to the table with proposals and actually work together to bring about a positive finished product. Congress hasnt so much as passed a budget in 3 years and you are upset that Ryan has actually offered a plan? You must ****ing HATE the democrats in the senate.
 
Tucker Case said:
It's a good thing I make that point towards a ****load of people on both sides of the political divide, then.



And if they have the balls to point the blame finger at themselves for passing those laws, I'd commend them for it. I'd respect someone who did that, even if I disagreed with them.



So he's offering a plan now to fix the problems he helped create then. That's like me stealing all of your money and then providing you with job applications and a plan to get a second job to recoup all that money I stole from you.




Absolutely. Not only can one say those things, I've often said those things. I'm talking about Ryan this time, but that hasn't stopped me from talking about the others, nor will I ever hold back from talking about the others on both sides of the bull**** American political spectrum.



True. It's disgusting. But what truly sickens me is that so many people who aren't politicians eat this **** up and say "Thank you for the nice meal" afterward. My problem isn't with Ryan being a politician. My problem is with people being stupid enough to not only believe his line of bull****, but to share that line of bull**** with others as though it's true. If he was calling himself a fiscal conservative, I'd simply chalk it up as standard political bull****. But random people on the street are saying that nonsense. People who will gain nothing for it.

That's the thing I don't understand.
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Ah. I see. So...Ryan SHOULDNT be suggesting a way to fix the problem. No one that was involved int he creation of the problem should actually try to do something to FIX the problem. Well...THAT makes a lot of sense.
 
TheNextEra said:
Oh come on, please tell us how he was FORCED to vote for the bailouts. This ought to be good. Hey if making excuses so that you can hold your nose and vote for a cadidate works for you, great. That's on you.
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Oh...and as Libertarian I have been generally happy with the presidential candidates that have run. State and local...not so much. Johnson, if he remains the candidate, will be a pretty decent vote.
 
Vallista said:
Paul Ryan is the opposite of everything he claiming to stand for? You know his biggest donors right? Doesn't it bother even a little where his funding is coming from. Yes I know about Obama is bought. I'm just asking you about Ryan since its about him.
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Where'd you get the silly idea that I have ever supported Ryan?
 
VanceMack said:
Ah. I see. So...Ryan SHOULDNT be suggesting a way to fix the problem. No one that was involved int he creation of the problem should actually try to do something to FIX the problem. Well...THAT makes a lot of sense.
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Those who caused the problem should be held accountable. They should be replaced, not promoted.

Would you argue that the thief who stole your money should be given a free pass simply because he created a "fix" that was also paid for off of your labor? Cause that's what Ryan's doing.
 
VanceMack said:
It SHOULD gut the federal budget
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Why

but the nice thing about negotiations is both sides come to the table with proposals and actually work together to bring about a positive finished product.
Click to expand...

:lamo
Have you taken a look at Congress lately?

Congress hasnt so much as passed a budget in 3 years and you are upset that Ryan has actually offered a plan? You must ****ing HATE the democrats in the senate.
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Their plan isn't great (i.e. chug along with the status quo) but Ryan's is a lot worse.
 
Tucker Case said:
Those who caused the problem should be held accountable. They should be replaced, not promoted.

Would you argue that the thief who stole your money should be given a free pass simply because he created a "fix" that was also paid for off of your labor? Cause that's what Ryan's doing.
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I agree...lets replace every single sitting member of congress and the executive branch...top down, and never let them run for office ever again.

Kind of funny seeing this from you. You REALLY believe that someone that voted for the GM bailout must have done so because he was corrupt, not because he didnt see it as the only viable (if not preferable) alternative? Wow...Tucker has joined the Sith...
 
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