A quote that Mitt Romney might wish he could take back

AdamT said:

And I assume that we're supposed to believe you, based on nothing? I'm sure your view isn't in any way influenced by your confessed hatred of Obama. :roll:

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If you are so full of information to the contrary, prove your argument.

AdamT said:

And I assume that we're supposed to believe you, based on nothing? I'm sure your view isn't in any way influenced by your confessed hatred of Obama. :roll:

If Obama was doing everything in its power to delay and derail, it wouldn't be approving the permits.

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see post #123, he covered it quite well. What I see with my own eyes does not need confirmation from any media source. I see what is going on, I have friends in the industry, I don't need the NY times or DC Post to tell me what I can see myself.

Obama can only do so much to stop drilling, he and his buddy Salazar have tried to block all oil and coal recovery. When you get that first solar plane, remember not to book a night flight on it.. Oh, and the hybrid 18 wheeler-----still waiting for that one.

Bobcat said:

see post #123, he covered it quite well. What I see with my own eyes does not need confirmation from any media source. I see what is going on, I have friends in the industry, I don't need the NY times or DC Post to tell me what I can see myself.

Obama can only do so much to stop drilling, he and his buddy Salazar have tried to block all oil and coal recovery. When you get that first solar plane, remember not to book a night flight on it.. Oh, and the hybrid 18 wheeler-----still waiting for that one.

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A couple of questions:

If Obama hates oil production so much, why has oil production risen on a fairly regular basis since his inauguration?

and

If Bush was so good at helping America produce oil, why did oil production fall every year he was in office?


A fact: American crude oil production fell every year from 1985 to 2008 and has increased each year since 2008.

The answers may be found on the EIA website

but Obama controls the EIA, so it's probably all lies :roll:

Somerville said:

A couple of questions:

If Obama hates oil production so much, why has oil production risen on a fairly regular basis since his inauguration?

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Due to increased production on private lands that fall outside of federal jurisdiction.

Arbo said:

Due to increased production on private lands that fall outside of federal jurisdiction.

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You seem to have missed my second question:

If Bush was so good at helping America produce oil, why did oil production fall every year he was in office?

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Your statement also depends upon one's definition of "federal jurisdiction"

Onshore Drilling and Air Quality

Onshore oil drilling is regulated by the EPA, in conjunction with the Bureau of Land Management and the Department of the Interior. Under the Clean Air Act (CAA), the onshore petroleum industry is obligated to comply with the National Emission Standards for Hazardous Air Pollutants register and must reduce the amount of benzene, ethylbenzene, toluene and mixed xylenes, all of which are considered hazardous air pollutants. To do this, the industry must install air emission-control devices and adhere to EPA test methods, inspections and monitoring.

Onshore Drilling and Environmental Waste

The EPA has exempted many waste products for the petroleum industry, including drilling fluids, packing fluids, pit sludge, hydrocarbon solids and basic sediment, as a by-product of drilling. The EPA regulates hazardous wastes that include caustic or acid cleaners, unused fracturing fluids, incinerator ash, radioactive waste, and sanitary, laboratory and pesticide waste. Failure to dispose of, or contain, hazardous waste properly may result in criminal prosecution of a corporation under EPA regulations.


Read more: Environmental Regulations on Oil Drilling in USA | eHow.com

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Bobcat said:

see post #123, he covered it quite well. What I see with my own eyes does not need confirmation from any media source. I see what is going on, I have friends in the industry, I don't need the NY times or DC Post to tell me what I can see myself.

Obama can only do so much to stop drilling, he and his buddy Salazar have tried to block all oil and coal recovery. When you get that first solar plane, remember not to book a night flight on it.. Oh, and the hybrid 18 wheeler-----still waiting for that one.

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Again, reality does not match up wll with your anecdotal opinion. Federal Offshore--Gulf of Mexico Field Production of Crude Oil (Thousand Barrels per Day)

As you can see, Gulf oil production reached an all-time high in late '09, and then started falling off after the BP disaster. Even still, production is about the same now as it was between 2006 and mid-2008 (when the recession dropped the bottom out of it).

IndepCentristMA said:

Wow... pointless semantical arguments have distorted yet another discussion on DP...

Regarding the Soros $250K dollar contribution to Obama's campaign... that's the maximum amount allowed by an individual by campaign rules... but do you honestly think that's all the money that Soros has given? Hell, Bill Maher gave $1M, remember?

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Um, the maximum donation by an individual directly to a campaign is $2,500 -- not $250,000. Mahr donated his $1 million to Obama's super pac, which can accept unlimted donations. The articles above discuss Soros' contributions to super pacs.

Somerville said:

You seem to have missed my second question:


Your statement also depends upon one's definition of "federal jurisdiction"

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I never suggested anything that related to your second question. Ah, more of the semantics game from AdamT. Go figure.

Somerville said:

A couple of questions:

If Obama hates oil production so much, why has oil production risen on a fairly regular basis since his inauguration?

and

If Bush was so good at helping America produce oil, why did oil production fall every year he was in office?


A fact: American crude oil production fell every year from 1985 to 2008 and has increased each year since 2008.

The answers may be found on the EIA website

but Obama controls the EIA, so it's probably all lies :roll:

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Ah... now you're getting it... that is how biased political action works... maybe now you can see things a little bit clearer...

Please take a look at the following videos and tell yourself what Obama's real intentions are regarding fuel in this country...

Against Coal, and supports policy eventhough it will hurt the coal industry
("If someone wants to open a coal plant, they can, but it will bankrupt them")


Would prefer (but does not oppose) higher fuel prices, to make the market have to adapt to them
Obama says he wants high gas prices - YouTube

Expects gas to go higher than $12
OBAMA TALKS $12-A-GALLON FOR GAS - YouTube

Inflate tires and get regular tune-ups and you can save gasoline...
Obama's Solution For High Gas Prices - YouTube

Appointed a energy secretary who had said he wants gas prices to be at European levels...
Obama Wants Gas Prices to Hit European Levels - YouTube

Now, do you think they're putting on a smokescreen with the fuel production numbers, or do you think he legitimately wants to expand oil production...

Let's keep in mind his major actions regarding this during his presidency

- Appoints an energy secretary who in 2008 had said at a major conference that he wanted us gas prices at European levels
- Fracking was outlawed on public lands, and the purchase of those lands has been rejected on many occasions
- Keystone Pipeline was vetoed, despite being one piece of legislation which passed both houses of the divided congress
- CASH FOR CLUNKERS was created to buy more fuel efficient cars
- Tax incentives were given to increase sales of the Chevy Volt, then later "other fuel efficient cars"
- When asked at a speech he was giving what about fuel prices, he told people they need to buy more fuel efficient cars, instead of the large SUVs, when someone responded from the crowd, how can I get my family of 10 around in a SUV, he challenges the fact that the guy has 10 people in his family... then dodges the question...

Obama Humiliated After Attempt To Shame SUV Driver - YouTube

So realistically... all semantics aside... do you think this president is doing all he can to get fuel prices lower, and/or to increase fossil fuel production?

Clearly he isn't... and is pushing an alternative agenda...

"Never let a good crisis go to waste" -- Rahm Emanuel, as Chief of Staff under Obama

The problem for those blaming the coal industry's problems on the President is one small fact, natural gas is now much cheaper than coal.

and the biggies are switching over

Wall Street Journal, Dec 2011

Exxon Declares Gas King
Abundant Fuel Expected to Dethrone Coal as Top U.S. Power Generator by 2025

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NPR, July 2012

Gas is one of the cheapest sources of electricity generation, now half the price of coal. Much of this a recent development, the result of advances in hydraulic fracturing or fracking, the controversial process by which gas is extracted from deep under rock formations. Fracking now produces a third of all U.S. natural gas.

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Posted by IndepCentristMA

- Appoints an energy secretary who in 2008 had said at a major conference that he wanted us gas prices at European levels and what has Secretary Chu had to say on the subject since 2009?

- Fracking was outlawed on public lands, and the purchase of those lands has been rejected on many occasions That would be on national park land and in Vermont and locales where the locals voted it down, its called democracy

- Keystone Pipeline was vetoed, despite being one piece of legislation which passed both houses of the divided congress It may have passed both houses of Congress but for some reason, the locals who live in the proposed path of the pipeline aren't much in favour of it either. Like the Republicans in Nebraska

- CASH FOR CLUNKERS was created to buy more fuel efficient cars Worked didn't it

- Tax incentives were given to increase sales of the Chevy Volt, then later "other fuel efficient cars" And .... ?

- When asked at a speech he was giving what about fuel prices, he told people they need to buy more fuel efficient cars, instead of the large SUVs, when someone responded from the crowd, how can I get my family of 10 around in a SUV, he challenges the fact that the guy has 10 people in his family... then dodges the question..
I didn't see the President "humiliated" but then I'm not wearing the Goggles of Truth. Then there's always the question: did the questioner actually have 10 kids or was he simply trying to make a point at what he thought would be the expense of the President?

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my reply in RED

Somerville said:

The problem for those blaming the coal industry's problems on the President is one small fact, natural gas is now much cheaper than coal.

and the biggies are switching over

Wall Street Journal, Dec 2011


NPR, July 2012

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No one is blaming the president for the price of coal... People are blaming the president for cap and trade policies which are hampering businesses, and the use of coal...

Yes, natural gas is cheaper, but not always as readily abundant in certain areas which are right next to coal mines... and those coal mines employee thousands across this country... Yet, both Biden and Obama want to shut them down...

The article you posted, pointing out the benefits of fracking on dropping fuel prices, just underscores the problem here, with the president being an obstacle to a greater expansion of it...

However, I think you've gravely missed the point here... This isn't about coal... it's about the president's desire to have higher fuel prices to attempt to force people to use "green" fuel sources... Which is really hurting the economy and has an awful effect on people's cost of living...

Somerville said:

my reply in RED

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Which makes it oh so easy to respond to, right?

1) It doesn't matter what Chu said in 2009... Since he was already appointed by Obama prior to that. Obama appointed the guy despite what he said in 2008, because he actually agrees with it... Anything after that would just be classified as trying to save face, or cover up for the real intentions...

2) It's miles and miles of useless space in North Dakota, Utah, etc. where private companies have offered good money to purchase a small section of those lands to frack on... The deals would be a very wise decision for a president who wants to cut fuel prices, have us less dependent on foreign sources of oil, and wants to stimulate the economy...

3) The president vetoed it... then says he was for it... then says he's against it... then says he's for it... It's this bogus game of trying to make it seem like he actually cares to get involved in lowering gasoline prices... when in actuality he does everything he can to prevent it... Once the next president signs the bill, there will be no problem getting approval to have the pipeline built, wherever it goes through...

4) No, Cash for Clunkers was pretty much a useless program, which actually benefited the foreign automakers at a time when it was meant to stimulate domestic auto sales... all for what equated to 1 mile on average saved nationally... ooooo aaaaaa There are far bigger fish to fry...

5) And...? And people shouldn't have to fork over $40K to buy a brand new car (that's also untested technology, that keeps having problems) to please the president's desires...

Most people can't afford any new car, nevermind a $40K car... People already own vehicles, or are still paying off vehicles that they have and need to drive to keep their existence... These vehicles are what they are, regardless of what the president wants them to drive, and by keeping fuel prices high, he's hurting these families...

6) Hmmm... I'm having trouble finding the part where I said he was humiliated... Perhaps you should read my original comment again...

"When asked at a speech he was giving what about fuel prices, he told people they need to buy more fuel efficient cars, instead of the large SUVs, when someone responded from the crowd, how can I get my family of 10 around in a SUV, he challenges the fact that the guy has 10 people in his family... then dodges the question..."

So you think the guy made up having 10 kids... If you're gonna make up a number of kids, you make up one thats a little more believable than 10... the guy probably had 10... but what does it matter how many kids he had? If he had more than 3, they don't fit in a hybrid sedan... They'd still need an SUV...

You missed the point, yet again... not shocking...

The president was trying to belittle people for driving SUVs but complaining about gas mileage... Yet, the questioner showed the real problem... The President's ignorance as to how real people actually live... There is no hybrid van that's out there at competitive prices on the market... Plus, replacing hybrid batteries and general maintenance over time actually doesn't save owners any money, but has actually been shown to cost owners more than the internal combustion engine... These people get the cars that they can afford... and guess what the president rides around in... SUVs!!!!!!

The president is just simply out of touch with reality on this issue... Just because fuel prices go high doesn't mean suddenly everyone has enough money to jump ship to new technology... People can't afford new technology... They have what they have, and it's mostly older and used cars... Because people are scraping by... Now they can't afford basic fuel for their existing cars as well... which is making them go broke just getting to and from work, or operating their equipment at work... That's his doing... all for trying to impress upon the general public his personal philosophy regarding energy useage...