Chanda

Jimmy Massey isn't the only Iraq War vet to speak out against the Iraq war:

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Reverend_Hellh0und

Wow 3 soldiers speak out and that represents "ft. Hood" how?

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Never forget those who died.
Never forget those who killed them.

Mori Wanna

I cannot speak for anyone else, but my issue is not with Veterans speaking out against the war, it was with Massey himself, and the obviously anti-troop message that came from him. I have often had to remind some people from my very own family that their experiences in life are not universal. Those who jump on the Massey bandwagon believe his is a universal experience. When in fact, it seems as if Massey has a bald face case of the lies, or he is mentally ill. I will choose the mentally ill side of the equation, because I cannot believe a reasonable person with military experience would ever say what he has said.

I would prefer that our active duty members of the military wait until they are civilian before they start complaining, but if they are out of uniform, not using government equipment and not protesting on federal or state property, then I don't particularly care. I would have a problem for instance with any member of the military partaking in debate here or on the Internet if they were using a government computer.

I can say I was quite displeased with the decision to go into Iraq. I can also state that I firmly believe the president and administration knew exactly how little of a threat Saddam was, yet we still chose to invade. I am completely and utterly Anti-Stupid-----which for some (including me), means Anti-Bush. Yet none of that makes me want to hear what the likes of a Massey has to say----even if he is mentally ill. He is the exception not the rule.

WI Crippler

I have no problems when veterans want to speak their mind about the war they are involved in, so long as they are trying to do so honestly. It seems this person is doing so, although I have to disagree with the tactic of "blitzing" that was discussed in this article.

And another tidbit that caught my eye......

This is the result of a failure of leadership to properly explain or put into context, the importance of what they are doing.

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"What Jesus fails to appreciate is that it's the meek who are the problem."- Reg

DarkWizard12

3 soldiers speak out and somehow, thats a consensus?

Look, My dad is a vet and he supports the Iraq war, is his voice being heard throughout the country? Are you going to put up quotes of why my father supports the war? No.

The troops are split probably about 50-50 when it comes to Iraq. but there is no source because, well, there is no consensus so, basically, this source measn nothing untill more troops speak out where it becomes known that most soldiers are against the war.

Hatuey

Nobody takes issues with people who are currently serving taking stance on this war. They don't even take issue with vets taking a stance on this war. Regardless of how wrong or right their opinion might be. The problem is that Joe Hill chose to use an "army marine" who has been exposed. Not only by the right wing media but also by left wing media. Massey is an insult to people like my father and my cousins. All of them either served or are serving their country proudly and have all taken stances on the war. My father is more or less neutral this war. I have cousins who are in Iraq/Afghanistan and they either hate the current situation but carry it out anyways or love the job they are doing. Military society is like that. People do their jobs first and their opinions come second. The problem comes when people make opinions based on the opinion of dishonest people like Massey. I am against this war. However I have no need to base my arguments against it on the words of Massey. I base my arguments on what has basically been a failed civilian leadership of this war and the result this war will yield. Which I doubt anybody will disagree just isn't worth what it's costing us. If Joe Hill based his arguments off of the actual situation and not the dishonest crocodile tears of Massey then I wouldn't have said anything. But he didn't. He chose a dishonest path and was exposed for it.

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Is Intolerant Because He Won't Let The Intolerant Run Other People's Lives.

Chanda

Based on?

What, that atrocities were committed in Iraq?

Mori Wanna

Most of the answers you seek from me have already been given in the EX-Marine testimony thread. You will forgive if I don't re-write my thoughts all over again, because quite frankly, I am a wordy guy.

Which atrocity are you talking about?

The atrocity of making the decision to invade Iraq in the first place?
The atrocity replacing a paper tiger who ran a secular nation in the Middle East?
The atrocity of placing our troops in harms way when it was not necessary?
The atrocity that many of the people who supported the president's decision to invade now act as if there was no one warning that we would end up with exactly what we got?
The atrocity that YES----Innocent Iraqis have died?
The atrocity in which a few nutcases slip through the cracks and are put in a position to kill innocents?
Or, and this is near and dear to my heart and more important than any atrocity I have asked you about----the atrocity that as of today, 3,963 of our finest assets have died in Iraq.

Forgive me if that offends you, but I'm going to reserve my greatest sympathy for the members of our team first. Always. Again, American GI's are not the people who decide what The United States' foreign policy is going to be. They go where they are told and they enforce it. Most of the time we get it right. I forgot to mention, 99.9% do their jobs without committing murder.

I will defend the American Fighting Man until the day I die. I vowed a long time ago that I would not stand by and watch the stigma that once surrounded military service after Vietnam, to return in the American psyche. I am disturbed at the level of extreme discourse I am seeing at this site from certain people. Especially if that discourse appears to be demonizing people who have no say so where they go and what their orders are. Their only crime is that they joined the military knowing that they there was no option out in case of a bad war.

Today I was considering the 3,963 members of the fraternity who have walked through the valley of the shadow of death----only not to return. I wondered if one or two of them might have gone on to discover a cure for cancer. I wondered about the babies that will never be born, the birthdays that will never be celebrated, and the children who will never know their Father or Mother. I wondered if we lost a great American president among the numbers. Then I thought of the million and a half troops who have already passed through Iraq over the last 5-years, and the nightmares that have yet to come----with a VA Health Care System that is not ready for them.

There is plenty of atrocity to go around. The men I have known that have faced war think war is an atrocity. I dare say most do. What we need to do in this country is to calm down a little bit. One side needs to stop being afraid of the cave dwellers and the other needs to stop believing that Nazis occupy the Whitehouse.

Billo_Really

This I agree with.

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Chanda

Thanks, I agree with most of your points, but more specifically, what I was asking is how you determined that Massey was lying. Some have implied he was "exposed" by journalist Ron Harris. Is that the basis for your conclusion, and if so, how do you know Massey wasn't smeared by Harris?