Thread: Reagan on Socialized Medicine

Originally Posted by roughdraft274

PolitiFact | Private health insurance not banned on page 16 of the House bill

You really just believe anything youre told, huh?

You honestly think that there's clauses to keep you from getting private insurance and for paying for any procedure yourself and that Rush and the republicans aren't blathering on about it endlessly ( I listen to all the typical conservative shows and hadn't heard a peep about this)? Check your facts before you go around spewing this kind of crap.

Next he'll be talking about those "death panels".

Originally Posted by roughdraft274

PolitiFact | Private health insurance not banned on page 16 of the House bill

You really just believe anything youre told, huh?

You honestly think that there's clauses to keep you from getting private insurance and for paying for any procedure yourself and that Rush and the republicans aren't blathering on about it endlessly ( I listen to all the typical conservative shows and hadn't heard a peep about this)? Check your facts before you go around spewing this kind of crap.

Relying on the St Petersburg times, a known Obama biased site, eh?

4. Freedom to keep your existing plan

This is the freedom that the President keeps emphasizing. Yet the bills appear to say otherwise. It's worth diving into the weeds -- the territory where most pundits and politicians don't seem to have ventured.

The legislation divides the insured into two main groups, and those two groups are treated differently with respect to their current plans. The first are employees covered by the Employee Retirement Security Act of 1974. ERISA regulates companies that are self-insured, meaning they pay claims out of their cash flow, and don't have real insurance. Those are the GEs (GE, Fortune 500) and Time Warners (TWX, Fortune 500) and most other big companies.

The House bill states that employees covered by ERISA plans are "grandfathered." Under ERISA, the plans can do pretty much what they want -- they're exempt from standard packages and community rating and can reward employees for healthy lifestyles even in restrictive states.

But read on.

The bill gives ERISA employers a five-year grace period when they can keep offering plans free from the restrictions of the "qualified" policies offered on the exchanges. But after five years, they would have to offer only approved plans, with the myriad rules we've already discussed. So for Americans in large corporations, "keeping your own plan" has a strict deadline. In five years, like it or not, you'll get dumped into the exchange. As we'll see, it could happen a lot earlier.

The outlook is worse for the second group. It encompasses employees who aren't under ERISA but get actual insurance either on their own or through small businesses. After the legislation passes, all insurers that offer a wide range of plans to these employees will be forced to offer only "qualified" plans to new customers, via the exchanges.

The employees who got their coverage before the law goes into effect can keep their plans, but once again, there's a catch. If the plan changes in any way -- by altering co-pays, deductibles, or even switching coverage for this or that drug -- the employee must drop out and shop through the exchange. Since these plans generally change their policies every year, it's likely that millions of employees will lose their plans in 12 months.

You'll lose 5 key freedoms under Obama's health care plan - Jul. 24, 2009

j-mac

Originally Posted by j-mac

Relying on the St Petersburg times, a known Obama biased site, eh?





j-mac

Sigh...

Find me somewhere where they actually show you the legislation and quotes the part that will prohibit you from getting private health insurance so I can prove you wrong. Linking some moron who writes editorials for the cnn website proves nothing. Especially when he's talking about an old bill that has been changed through all the committees and then doesn't even link to the text that he's talking about. Show me the actual text like the one you did before and I'll show you where your wrong.

Also, for the first post you made, go to damn near any conservative site that used your link as proof of what you were saying has retracted their statements and instead say "well yeah we were wrong, but Obama will regulate it till all the insurance companies are gone!" without any evidence for their assertion.

Is the heritage foundation conservative enough for you?

Does the House Plan Outlaw Private Insurance? | The Foundry: Conservative Policy News.
"So IBD is wrong: individual health insurance will not be outlawed. But it will be effectively regulated out of existence… which is effectively the same thing."

You'll be so kind as to notice that you didn't even try to refute my post, just throw out that you don't like the site. Grow a pair and actually stick to your guns. Show me how my link was wrong. Instead you want to just list example after example of the stupid lies being spread about bill, lol.

If you want to make the idiotic assertion that the bill outlaws private insurance then you need to show me where it states this. It shouldn't be hard to find if it really does. It would be on every conservative website and radio show and tv show.

Originally Posted by j-mac

Laugh all you want you are still doing nothing more that what MSNBC tells you to do....How's that feel.



j-mac

Hard for them to do that as I don't watch MSNBC.

J, be more original. The fact is Reagan was wrong, and these talking points you spout are not even original talking points, but those that have been retread since long before Reagan.

Originally Posted by roughdraft274

Sigh...

Find me somewhere where they actually show you the legislation and quotes the part that will prohibit you from getting private health insurance so I can prove you wrong. Linking some moron who writes editorials for the cnn website proves nothing. Especially when he's talking about an old bill that has been changed through all the committees and then doesn't even link to the text that he's talking about. Show me the actual text like the one you did before and I'll show you where your wrong.

Also, for the first post you made, go to damn near any conservative site that used your link as proof of what you were saying has retracted their statements and instead say "well yeah we were wrong, but Obama will regulate it till all the insurance companies are gone!" without any evidence for their assertion.

Is the heritage foundation conservative enough for you?

Does the House Plan Outlaw Private Insurance? | The Foundry: Conservative Policy News.
"So IBD is wrong: individual health insurance will not be outlawed. But it will be effectively regulated out of existence… which is effectively the same thing."

You'll be so kind as to notice that you didn't even try to refute my post, just throw out that you don't like the site. Grow a pair and actually stick to your guns. Show me how my link was wrong. Instead you want to just list example after example of the stupid lies being spread about bill, lol.

If you want to make the idiotic assertion that the bill outlaws private insurance then you need to show me where it states this. It shouldn't be hard to find if it really does. It would be on every conservative website and radio show and tv show.

j-mac

Originally Posted by j-mac

j-mac

Lol, you highlighted my point exactly. They claim that he'll do something and give no evidence for it. Along with that you actually refuse to accept the fact that you were wrong on your first point. You read that article and believed it without even 1 second of critical thought to see if it was believable, lol. Now the best you'll do is throw around emoticons.

If anyone else on the forum wants to know what the new conservative white flag for surrender is, take note -

Originally Posted by roughdraft274

Lol, you highlighted my point exactly. They claim that he'll do something and give no evidence for it. Along with that you actually refuse to accept the fact that you were wrong on your first point. You read that article and believed it without even 1 second of critical thought to see if it was believable, lol. Now the best you'll do is throw around emoticons.

If anyone else on the forum wants to know what the new conservative white flag for surrender is, take note -

When I find it I'll be sure and let you know, believe me.....But now that I know that slander, and childishness is a part of your style, I'll do it in my time....thanks.


j-mac

Originally Posted by j-mac

When I find it I'll be sure and let you know, believe me.....But now that I know that slander, and childishness is a part of your style, I'll do it in my time....thanks.


j-mac

Slander?

I love this. In the conservative world, proving their talking points wrong equates with slander.


Also, I love how you talked yourself into believing that somehow I was rushing you to answer. It's that big bad liberal conspiracy.

Do you really just expect people to give you the benefit of the doubt on matters like this? If you want to be able to spout out conspiracy theories like this and not be fact checked call glenn beck or rush limbaugh.

Originally Posted by j-mac

When I find it I'll be sure and let you know, believe me.....But now that I know that slander, and childishness is a part of your style, I'll do it in my time....thanks.


j-mac

I won't be holding my breath then.

Originally Posted by j-mac

Really? And what is Medicare's unfunded liability today? 37 Trillion? Yeah great success!


j-mac

And who caused that unfunded liability to happen? Who signed that bill into law?