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It is up to us

danarhea

danarhea

Slayer of the DP Newsbot
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A very interesting article from Paul Craig Roberts, who was despised by Conservatives for going after George Bush. Conservatives may love him now, as he has laid open the reason Trump won. The answer is very simple. He spoke of the corruption of government, and the people were finally ready for that message. I believe that Trump is a loudmouthed, boorish person, as well as a despicable human being. However, despicable people have sometimes been called in historical times to do historical things. Trump did tap into the frustration the American people have with government, and like it or not, he told the truth about that. This is why he won. Yes, Russia may have helped out a bit, but voting machines were not hacked, and Trump did not rig this election. He simply admitted that, as a businessman, he gamed a corrupt economic system and gained wealth by doing so, as did everybody else who was rich enough to do so, and who also had the opportunity to play the game. But he also promised to end the corruption which allowed him to do that.

What Trump is promising is very simple. Hard work is ahead of us if we are able to regain the standing in the world we once had. There are no promises of handouts in his administration, but an admonition to roll up our sleeves and do the hard work that needs to be done. The next few years will be a bit painful, but I believe that, if Trump actually delivers on his promises, we will overcome the obstacles that need to be overcome, and come out of it better than we were before. America is at a crossroads, and despite my misgivings about Trump, I believe that he could actually be the right person for the job. So, for now, Trump has my support, as long as he delivers on what he promised he would deliver.

So much for all my hot air. Now read the damned article. :mrgreen: I don't agree with all of it, but it's a very decent read.

 It Is Up To Us      : Information Clearing House - ICH
 
As long as Americas current system of government remains in tact, the corruption will never stop.

A two party system that dominates the political landscape, receiving unlimited money from private donors through superPACS, nothing is going to change and it will continue to get worse, Trump or not.
 
Jetboogieman said:
As long as Americas current system of government remains in tact, the corruption will never stop.

A two party system that dominates the political landscape, receiving unlimited money from private donors through superPACS, nothing is going to change and it will continue to get worse, Trump or not.
Click to expand...

Okay, I'll bite.

You are now the President of the United States.

Mr. President, what are your clearly outlined and sure-fire steps to create the kind of system you think would ensure the elimination of all the ills you are concerned with?

(Hell, anyone else have suggested solutions feel free to jump in.)
 
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danarhea said:
A very interesting article from Paul Craig Roberts, who was despised by Conservatives for going after George Bush. Conservatives may love him now, as he has laid open the reason Trump won. The answer is very simple. He spoke of the corruption of government, and the people were finally ready for that message. I believe that Trump is a loudmouthed, boorish person, as well as a despicable human being. However, despicable people have sometimes been called in historical times to do historical things. Trump did tap into the frustration the American people have with government, and like it or not, he told the truth about that. This is why he won. Yes, Russia may have helped out a bit, but voting machines were not hacked, and Trump did not rig this election. He simply admitted that, as a businessman, he gamed a corrupt economic system and gained wealth by doing so, as did everybody else who was rich enough to do so, and who also had the opportunity to play the game. But he also promised to end the corruption which allowed him to do that.

What Trump is promising is very simple. Hard work is ahead of us if we are able to regain the standing in the world we once had. There are no promises of handouts in his administration, but an admonition to roll up our sleeves and do the hard work that needs to be done. The next few years will be a bit painful, but I believe that, if Trump actually delivers on his promises, we will overcome the obstacles that need to be overcome, and come out of it better than we were before. America is at a crossroads, and despite my misgivings about Trump, I believe that he could actually be the right person for the job. So, for now, Trump has my support, as long as he delivers on what he promised he would deliver.

So much for all my hot air. Now read the damned article. :mrgreen: I don't agree with all of it, but it's a very decent read.

*It Is Up To Us***** : Information Clearing House - ICH
Click to expand...

Cool story, bro.

But it sure looks like Trump is planning on grifting and looting as much as humanly possible while delegating the governing as much as possible.
 
Jetboogieman said:
As long as Americas current system of government remains in tact, the corruption will never stop.

A two party system that dominates the political landscape, receiving unlimited money from private donors through superPACS, nothing is going to change and it will continue to get worse, Trump or not.
Click to expand...

It could be reduced simply by instituting single term limits for all elected offices.
 
Captain Adverse said:
Okay, I'll bite.

You are now the President of the United States.

Mr. President, what are your clearly outlined and sure-fire steps to create the kind of system you think would ensure the elimination of all the ills you are concerned with?

(Hell, anyone else have suggested solutions feel free to jump in.)
Click to expand...

Well, he has already reneged on most of his promises, but has left this one alone for now. If he doesn't regeg on this one, I'll support him.
 
How does trump plan on removing big money from our political campaigns?

How will he reign in big contributions from corporations, unions, and the super rich?
 
Sietske22 said:
How does trump plan on removing big money from our political campaigns?

How will he reign in big contributions from corporations, unions, and the super rich?
Click to expand...

make it illegal
 
danarhea said:
A very interesting article from Paul Craig Roberts, who was despised by Conservatives for going after George Bush. Conservatives may love him now, as he has laid open the reason Trump won. The answer is very simple. He spoke of the corruption of government, and the people were finally ready for that message. I believe that Trump is a loudmouthed, boorish person, as well as a despicable human being. However, despicable people have sometimes been called in historical times to do historical things. Trump did tap into the frustration the American people have with government, and like it or not, he told the truth about that. This is why he won. Yes, Russia may have helped out a bit, but voting machines were not hacked, and Trump did not rig this election. He simply admitted that, as a businessman, he gamed a corrupt economic system and gained wealth by doing so, as did everybody else who was rich enough to do so, and who also had the opportunity to play the game. But he also promised to end the corruption which allowed him to do that.

What Trump is promising is very simple. Hard work is ahead of us if we are able to regain the standing in the world we once had. There are no promises of handouts in his administration, but an admonition to roll up our sleeves and do the hard work that needs to be done. The next few years will be a bit painful, but I believe that, if Trump actually delivers on his promises, we will overcome the obstacles that need to be overcome, and come out of it better than we were before. America is at a crossroads, and despite my misgivings about Trump, I believe that he could actually be the right person for the job. So, for now, Trump has my support, as long as he delivers on what he promised he would deliver.

So much for all my hot air. Now read the damned article. :mrgreen: I don't agree with all of it, but it's a very decent read.

*It Is Up To Us***** : Information Clearing House - ICH
Click to expand...

You will recall all the times in the last year when someone who liked Trump called him a truth teller and then large numbers of people would respond "Waddya talking about, he lies constantly?".....
 
Hawkeye10 said:
You will recall all the times in the last year when someone who liked Trump called him a truth teller and then large numbers of people would respond "Waddya talking about, he lies constantly?".....
Click to expand...

Yea, he was full of BS, but he did tell the truth when he said people were fed up. I think people looked past his lies when they saw the message. Fact is that there are powerful moneyed interests who wanted to keep the status quo, and Trump broke that mechanism. Now if he will only follow up on what he promised, I will become a supporter, but on one condition only. His conflicts of interests must go.
 
danarhea said:
Yea, he was full of BS, but he did tell the truth when he said people were fed up. I think people looked past his lies when they saw the message. Fact is that there are powerful moneyed interests who wanted to keep the status quo, and Trump broke that mechanism. Now if he will only follow up on what he promised, I will become a supporter, but on one condition only. His conflicts of interests must go.
Click to expand...

No, that would hurt his kids too much because their pops got a wild hair to go serve his country.

Trump needs to manage his conflicts of interest well and with transparency.
 
Hawkeye10 said:
No, that would hurt his kids too much because their pops got a wild hair to go serve his country.

Trump needs to manage his conflicts of interest well and with transparency.
Click to expand...

I strongly disagree. Trump's businesses must go into a blind trust, which has been the SOP before Trump was elected. If he does that, then I am OK with him. If he doesn't, then I have a huge problem with him.
 
danarhea said:
I strongly disagree. Trump's businesses must go into a blind trust, which has been the SOP before Trump was elected. If he does that, then I am OK with him. If he doesn't, then I have a huge problem with him.
Click to expand...

I submit that your demand is sadistic:

THE BOTTOM LINE
To establish a blind trust of the sort used by his predecessors, Trump would not merely have to liquidate a securities portfolio and permit an independent trustee to manage those assets. He would have to sell off business holdings that he has built and managed most of his life, and with which he is personally identified in a way that few other business magnates are
Click to expand...
Unfair to make Donald Trump use a blind trust | Newsday

David B. Rivkin Jr. and Lee A. Casey, who practice appellate and constitutional law in the District of Columbia, served in the Justice Department under Presidents Ronald Reagan and George H.W. Bush.
 
Hawkeye10 said:
I submit that your demand is sadistic:


Unfair to make Donald Trump use a blind trust | Newsday

David B. Rivkin Jr. and Lee A. Casey, who practice appellate and constitutional law in the District of Columbia, served in the Justice Department under Presidents Ronald Reagan and George H.W. Bush.
Click to expand...

It's what every president since Hoover has done, and for good reason. If he isn't up to doing what is standard operating procedure, then he shouldn't have run in the first place. If he does change his mind and do the right thing, then he will have my support.
 
danarhea said:
It's what every president since Hoover has done before him, and for good reason. If he isn't up to doing what is standard operating procedure, then he shouldn't have run in the first place. If he does change his mind and do the right thing, then he will have my support.
Click to expand...

THATS THE WAY WE HAVE ALWAYS DONE IT is one of the dumbest things we humans do.

PLUS (from the piece):

Likewise, neither federal law nor regulations limit the president in this area. Presidential candidates and presidents must disclose their finances, but the president is not covered by the principal financial conflict-of-interest law, and the relevant regulations specifically exclude the president. Indeed, it is doubtful that Congress could constitutionally limit the president’s personal investments or business activities consistent with separation of powers principles
Click to expand...

In our society THE LAW dictates to the citizen what our responsibilities are. If this was so very important to you why is it not written into law?

You are being unreasonable.
 
danarhea said:
I strongly disagree. Trump's businesses must go into a blind trust, which has been the SOP before Trump was elected. If he does that, then I am OK with him. If he doesn't, then I have a huge problem with him.
Click to expand...

That's literally impossible.
 
Threegoofs said:
That's literally impossible.
Click to expand...

No it isn't. He merely assigns someone, or some company, not related to him, to run his business while he is in office. After leaving office, he takes his business back.
 
danarhea said:
No it isn't. He merely assigns someone, or some company, not related to him, to run his business while he is in office. After leaving office, he takes his business back.
Click to expand...

It is, because his assets and businesses are so obvious- it's all real estate either owned and managed, or his name on developments that he gets a cut from.

His kids will almost necessarily have to run the operation, and you know he won't have a firewall there.

The only real solution is total transparency. And I think it's pretty clear we won't get any, given that he won't even release his tax returns, much less open up his business books.

We are in for four years of spectacular grifting. And most of it we will never hear about.
 
Last edited:
danarhea said:
A very interesting article from Paul Craig Roberts, who was despised by Conservatives for going after George Bush. Conservatives may love him now, as he has laid open the reason Trump won. The answer is very simple. He spoke of the corruption of government, and the people were finally ready for that message. I believe that Trump is a loudmouthed, boorish person, as well as a despicable human being. However, despicable people have sometimes been called in historical times to do historical things. Trump did tap into the frustration the American people have with government, and like it or not, he told the truth about that. This is why he won. Yes, Russia may have helped out a bit, but voting machines were not hacked, and Trump did not rig this election. He simply admitted that, as a businessman, he gamed a corrupt economic system and gained wealth by doing so, as did everybody else who was rich enough to do so, and who also had the opportunity to play the game. But he also promised to end the corruption which allowed him to do that.

What Trump is promising is very simple. Hard work is ahead of us if we are able to regain the standing in the world we once had. There are no promises of handouts in his administration, but an admonition to roll up our sleeves and do the hard work that needs to be done. The next few years will be a bit painful, but I believe that, if Trump actually delivers on his promises, we will overcome the obstacles that need to be overcome, and come out of it better than we were before. America is at a crossroads, and despite my misgivings about Trump, I believe that he could actually be the right person for the job. So, for now, Trump has my support, as long as he delivers on what he promised he would deliver.

So much for all my hot air. Now read the damned article. :mrgreen: I don't agree with all of it, but it's a very decent read.

*It Is Up To Us***** : Information Clearing House - ICH
Click to expand...

Good post, Dan. Happy to read it, actually. This is the Dan I thought you were before all this election nonsense. Level headed. Open minded. Glad you're back. All meant as compliments. (I like to think my OWN level headedness has returned.)

The thoughts you've expressed here are the exact reasons I and many others voted for him. I think he'll be a bully pulpit expert. And we'll need that extra push.

Term limits! Cleaning up the tax code! Checking illegal immigration! Ensuring our corporations pay their fair share! Fixing Obamacare! TRYING to bring jobs. Shining bright lights on our failing inner city schools. Just imagine. Both major parties have had opportunities to tackle these big issues. And yet it's been the same old same old for decades.

He's brash. He's outside the box. He MAY be exactly what our country needs right now.
 
We already have several examples of trump using his position as President-elect to influence his business deals.

http://www.nytimes.com/2016/11/25/o...-left-region&WT.nav=opinion-c-col-left-region

The fear is that he will make decisions as President that are good for his businesses, but bad for the USA's national and security interests. Or the interests of our allies.

Is trump capable of making decisions as President that are good for his businesses but bad for the interests of the USA and or our allies? Yes.
 
Threegoofs said:
It is, because his assets and businesses are so obvious- it's all real estate either owned and managed, or his name on developments that he gets a cut from.

His kids will almost necessarily have to run the operation, and you know he won't have a firewall there.

The only real solution is total transparency. And I think it's pretty clear we won't get any, given that he won't even release his tax returns, much less open up his business books.

We are in for four years of spectacular grifting. And most of it we will never hear about.
Click to expand...

His kids won't be able to run it. When Trump named them to his transition team, they became government employees. This means that the Trump family will be both the landlord and the tenant in regards to the Trump Hotel in Washington. Trump is currently involved in a lawsuit against the government over taxes on the hotel. That is 2 conflicts of interest right there.
 
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