Democrats or Republicans - who is most to blame in the financial crisis? - Page 3

sazerac · 09-28-08, 07:24 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by obvious Child

Actually they did make changes.

They just created some of the origins of the current mess.

Fact Sheet: President Bush Calls for Expanding Opportunities to Homeownership
President Reiterates Goal on Homeownership

And yes, those are directly off the White House's webpage.

George Bush was governor of Texas when the current problems began. Bush helped low income people come up with a down payment for a home through HUD. His program was not about risky loans.

obvious Child · 09-28-08, 07:26 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by sazerac

George Bush was governor of Texas when the current problems began. Bush helped low income people come up with a down payment for a home through HUD. His program was not about risky loans.

Current problem began in the mid 90s? How do you figure that?

Bush's program extended into Fannie/Freddie policies. Frankly prior to the two initiatives, we did not see changes in loan policies regarding income and down payments. After the initiatives, we did.

sazerac · 09-28-08, 07:33 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by obvious Child

Current problem began in the mid 90s? How do you figure that?

Bush's program extended into Fannie/Freddie policies. Frankly prior to the two initiatives, we did not see changes in loan policies regarding income and down payments. After the initiatives, we did.

It was Clinton that loosened the rules, not Bush. (in 1999 when Bush was governor)

Fannie Mae Moves to Loosen Home Loan Credit Rules - Los Angeles Times

obvious Child · 09-28-08, 07:44 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by sazerac

It was Clinton that loosened the rules, not Bush. (in 1999 when Bush was governor)

Fannie Mae Moves to Loosen Home Loan Credit Rules - Los Angeles Times

Quote:

It is designed to provide homeownership opportunities for “many borrowers whose credit is just a notch below” qualifying for a loan, said Franklin Raines, Fannie Mae’s chairman and chief executive.

Uh, no. Related, but not the cause of the current crisis.

Going on

Quote:

If the borrowers make payments on time for two years, the interest rates will be reduced by 1 percentage point. For example, a consumer who is granted a 30-year, fixed-rate $100,000 mortgage at 9.5% interest initially would pay $841 a month. After two years of timely payments, the interest rate would be reduced to 8.5%, cutting the monthly bill to $769.

That's the reverse of what happened. The Subprime loans were offered at teaser rates which went up no matter what after two years. The loans under the 1999 time frame went down on several conditions and they were fixed. The Subprimes were ARMs.

Related, but not the cause of the current crisis. Furthermore, there's no discussion of changes to the down payment system. That changed under the Bush administration.

aps · 09-28-08, 07:44 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by rebelbuc

I'm sorry, Aps, that you took it personally that I used the term "bedwetting liberal". Ever since I heard a libertarian talk show host use the term I thought it was so often appropriate. Think about it - liberals are so often very young, idealistic people who are misguided by their blind trust in demigoguing politicians who take advantage of these liberals' good intentions.

How can you look at the video, go to the cited sources (did you even take the time?), look at the second video that someone just put up, and call it my spin? Are there republicans who bear some responsibility for the current financial crisis... certainly! But, those were the few republicans who abandoned their unpopular stances and jumped on the Democrat bandwagon. Even the so called "evil" George Bush, and certainly Senator McCain, tried to increase oversight of Fannie Mae and Freddie Mac years ago as they headed towards disaster. But look at the two videos and notice that the majority of Democrats simply demogogued the issue and claimed that these nasty Republicans were just trying to take away housing opportunities from poor people... Obama uses a similar tactic today every chance he gets!

And that, my dear, is what makes a liberal a bedwetter!

I reiterate my point--if my father ever used that kind of terminology, I would ask him to seek mental health. On top of that, I would be embarrassed by those kind of words. You have no class whatsoever.

Yayasmom, I liked you, until I saw you thank rebel's post. Classy...real classy. I'm sure your child(ren) would be proud.

Family Guy · 09-28-08, 07:45 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by rebelbuc

The present financial crisis, on the surface, appears to be greatly due to poor decisions by greedy lending institutions. However, many of these institutions were coerced by US government policies such as the Community Reinvestment Act and the beefing up of the CRA during the Clinton presidency. John McCain, along with several other Republicans, did indeed try to warn of the potential looming crisis, however, Democrats stood in their way at every turn. The video link below makes a lot valid points. Obama tried to blame this on the Bush administration, but the Democrats thwarted Bush's attempt to put tougher controls on Freddie Mac and Fannie Mae. Obama attempts to trump McCain on this issue while McCain made the greatest attempts to warn people of this looming crisis. This video provides links to support its fast-paced story with facts!

I think you need to spend a bit more time reading and researching the truth? How come you have amnesia about the most basic of Republican mantras since the Ronald Reagan days? Very odd, very, very odd.

Did you forget this simple Republican mantra quoted from the current Republican platform?

Quote:

We do not support government bailouts of private institutions. Government interference in the markets exacerbates problems in the marketplace and causes the free market to take longer to correct itself. We believe in the free market as the best tool to sustained prosperity and opportunity for all.

Source: http://www.gop.com/2008Platform/Economy.htm

This plank in the GOP platform has been the same for more than 25 years and it is what ALL GOP Presidents have professed since Reagan. This is also McCain's current platform!

Please squirm out of this one if you can!

rebelbuc · 09-28-08, 09:06 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Iriemon

Let's see, the Repbublicans controlled the House, the Senate, and the executive for 6 years, from 2000-06.

But its the Dems fault.

Of course.

This is not to excuse the Republicans, I agree that during those 6 years they often did not have the courage of their convictions (at least many of them) to battle the class warfare of the Democrats As I remember, every time the slim Republican majority tried to do anything, the Democrats filibustered, yelled foul, and played the class warfare card. As an example, have you looked at the videos and noticed how often Fannie Mae and Freddie Mac defenders (Democrats) claimed that Republicans' effort to regulate them were only done in an effort to hurt poor people. Also remember that some of the so-called moderate Republicans often voted with the Democrats. Hey, the Dems class warfare card has been played so well and so often that look where we are today!

rebelbuc · 09-28-08, 09:14 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by NoMoreDems-Reps

It's both parties fault !

Corporate Welfare compounded with political corruption and spending like
drunken sailors. Bam! here we are, say bye bye to $700,000,000,000
And by all means, try to blame this all on one party while supporting the other!
That will absolutely keep us on this same downward spiral !

REPS&DEMS = DEATH TO AMERICA.....

I get so tired of the term "Corporate Welfare", a classic contradiction of terms! Welfare is giving something for nothing, like food stamps or that check that so many poor people receive each month... for doing nothing instead of working! When corporations get tax breaks because governments (state or federal) feel that their significant employment provides sales tax and income tax benefits, this is incorrectly termed "Corporate Welfare". What a crock! I promise you that it was a Democrat who coined that illogical term! This might be a minor point in this overall debate, but this sticks in my craw!

rebelbuc · 09-28-08, 09:35 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by aps

I reiterate my point--if my father ever used that kind of terminology, I would ask him to seek mental health. On top of that, I would be embarrassed by those kind of words. You have no class whatsoever.

Yayasmom, I liked you, until I saw you thank rebel's post. Classy...real classy. I'm sure your child(ren) would be proud.

Hey Aps, grow up! If Yayasmom's children (or mine for that matter) would want her to NOT speak her mind and cater to only others' beliefs, they might qualify to be bedwetting liberals. You seem to be evaluating everyone else's class level while you are dodging the issues that I brought up. Look at the cold hard facts. Watch the videos. Put your feelings aside and think with the other part of your brain.

rebelbuc · 09-28-08, 09:40 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Family Guy

I think you need to spend a bit more time reading and researching the truth? How come you have amnesia about the most basic of Republican mantras since the Ronald Reagan days? Very odd, very, very odd.

Did you forget this simple Republican mantra quoted from the current Republican platform?

Source: http://www.gop.com/2008Platform/Economy.htm

This plank in the GOP platform has been the same for more than 25 years and it is what ALL GOP Presidents have professed since Reagan. This is also McCain's current platform!

Please squirm out of this one if you can!

Squirming is not necessary. The government's role in making Fannie Mae and Freddie Mac what they are and have become (trash, that is) might necessitate the government stepping in. By the way, why do you assume that I am in any way in favor of the bailout. I have been tending to side with Dave Ramsey and some other voices of reason who believe that a bailout might not be the best course of action. But that doesn't absolve the bastards (both Democrats and Republicans) who made this crisis happen.