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9/17/2008 - The McCain Lie of the Day

danarhea

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Here is what John McCain just said:

Two years ago, I warned that the oversight of Fannie and Freddie was terrible, that we were facing a crisis because of it, or certainly serious problems," Sen. John McCain, R-Ariz., told CBS this morning. "The influence that Fannie and Freddie had in the inside the Beltway, old boy network, which led to this kind of corruption is unacceptable and I warned about it a couple of years ago.

But here is what McCain said about 10 months ago:

"So, I’d like to tell you that I did anticipate it, but I have to give you straight talk, I did not.”

Once again, I need not post anything one way or the other here. McCain certainly makes the case against himself all by himself, and needs no help from me.

Article is here.
 
Well, in the first quote, he's talking about Fannie Mae and Freddie Mac and not the broader crisis, and he did anticipate it.

GovTrack: Senate Record: FEDERAL HOUSING ENTERPRISE REGULATORY REFORM... (109-s20060525-16)

In the second, he's talking about the broader crisis.

You can make the argument, maybe, that his 2007 statement doesn't square with his comments made at the above link (before), but he's not lying about anticipating the Fannie Mae/Freddie Mac problems.

(Note, too, that while McCain was warning of problems with them, Obama was racking up more donations FROM them than anyone but Chris Dodd, and saying nothing.)
 
Here is what John McCain just said:

But here is what McCain said about 10 months ago:

Once again, I need not post anything one way or the other here. McCain certainly makes the case against himself all by himself, and needs no help from me.

Article is here.

Ahhh Dana, upholding your standards it seems.

Yes, yes, McCain LIED when he said that he stated "Two years ago, I warned that the oversight of Fannie and Freddie was terrible, that we were facing a crisis because of it, or certainly serious problems" and your article OBVIOUS proves th-....

Oh

****

It actually backs him up that he's NOT lieing

From your article

McCain did indeed deliver a speech on the Senate floor in 2006 in which he warned of a problem with Fannie Mae and Freddie Mac and the risks they posed to the housing market and the economy as a whole.

...well...Holy crap. You mean he DID warn 2 years ago that oversight of Frannie and Freddy were problems? But...but how can that be?! Then he wouldn't be lieing.

Oh wait, Dana...are you going to tell me that he's "lieing" by omitting the fact he didn't anticipate the SUB-PRIME crisis, but did 2 years ago warn of the problems of oversight on Freddie and Frannie?

Cause I'd love to see you claim he's lieing for "omitting" because then YOU'D be lieing for omitting the fact he DID do exactly what he said he did.
 
What was his position on oversight until a couple days ago?
 
Here is what John McCain just said:



But here is what McCain said about 10 months ago:



Once again, I need not post anything one way or the other here. McCain certainly makes the case against himself all by himself, and needs no help from me.

Article is here.

Who's the liar, danarhea?

14o3f2f.jpg


Hot Air Blog Archive McCain’s attempt to fix Fannie Mae, Freddie Mac in 2005; Update: Obama can’t get AIG right

And who was the second highest recipient of Fannie Mae/Freddie Mac campaign cash?

Hmmm?

30jnwx4.jpg


:poke
 
Ahhh Dana, upholding your standards it seems.

Yes, yes, McCain LIED when he said that he stated "Two years ago, I warned that the oversight of Fannie and Freddie was terrible, that we were facing a crisis because of it, or certainly serious problems" and your article OBVIOUS proves th-....

Oh

****

It actually backs him up that he's NOT lieing

From your article



...well...Holy crap. You mean he DID warn 2 years ago that oversight of Frannie and Freddy were problems? But...but how can that be?! Then he wouldn't be lieing.

Oh wait, Dana...are you going to tell me that he's "lieing" by omitting the fact he didn't anticipate the SUB-PRIME crisis, but did 2 years ago warn of the problems of oversight on Freddie and Frannie?

Cause I'd love to see you claim he's lieing for "omitting" because then YOU'D be lieing for omitting the fact he DID do exactly what he said he did.

It is true that I selectively quoted. That is because I wanted to see what the Bushneviks and the McCain supporters would say. You guys were true to form, and now I can post the entirety of what McCain said 10 months ago. Enjoy. :mrgreen:

“I don’t know the dimensions of this. It’s hard to know what the dimensions are. As I say, I never thought I’d pick up the paper and see a city in Norway is somehow dramatically impacted by it. When I say ‘surprised’ I’m not surprised when in capitalist systems that there’s greed and excess. I think it was Teddy Roosevelt who said ‘unfettered capitalism leads to corruption’ or something like that, that people have disputed for years. “But so, in this whole new derivative stuff, and SIBs and all of this kind of new ways of packaging mortgages together and all that is something that frankly I don’t know a lot about.
"But I do rely on a lot of smart people that I have that are both in my employ and acquaintances of mine. And most of them did not anticipate this. Most of them, I mean I can find some that did. But, a guy that’s on my staff named Doug Holtz-Eakin, who was once the head of the Office of Management and Budget, said that there was nervousness out there. There’s nervousness. There was nervousness that we had such a long period of prosperity without a downturn because of the history of our economy. But I don’t know of hardly anybody, with the exception of a handful, that said ‘wait a minute, this thing is getting completely out of hand and is overheating.'
"So, I’d like to tell you that I did anticipate it, but I have to give you straight talk, I did not.”
Read especially the bolded part. Actually, you could have done that before by clicking on the link I supplied. :mrgreen:

Like I said in my first post, I didn't have to really post anything extra. McCain's own words speak for themselves. LOL.
 
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It is true that I selectively quoted. That is because I wanted to see what the Bushneviks and the McCain supporters would say. You guys were true to form, and now I can post the entirety of what McCain said 10 months ago. Enjoy. :mrgreen:


Read especially the bolded part. Actually, you could have done that before by clicking on the link I supplied. :mrgreen:

I read it -- and not just because you posted it; I read it earlier today -- changes nothing about what I wrote above. In fact, it bolsters it, because it makes even clearer he's talking about two different things.
 
I read it -- and not just because you posted it; I read it earlier today -- changes nothing about what I wrote above. In fact, it bolsters it, because it makes even clearer he's talking about two different things.

Then I submit that you missed some words, or rather, paragraphs. Did you read it too fast?

McCain was clearly talking about mortgages 10 months ago. McCain was clearly talking about mortgages today. What don't you get?
 
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Then I submit that you missed some words, or rather, paragraphs. Did you read it too fast?

McCain was clearly talking about mortgages 10 months ago. McCain was clearly talking about mortgages today. What don't you get?

Uh, he was talking about Fannie Mae and Freddie Mac specifically in first quote -- and I've posted to what he meant.

He was talking about the larger subprime mess in the second quote, which is not the same thing.

What's so hard to understand about this? Seriously?
 
Uh, he was talking about Fannie Mae and Freddie Mac specifically in first quote -- and I've posted to what he meant.

He was talking about the larger subprime mess in the second quote, which is not the same thing.

What's so hard to understand about this? Seriously?

1) Fannie Mae and Freddie Mac were involved in almost the entirety of bad loans, which makes it exactly the same thing.

2) McCain says 10 months ago that he knew nothing about how the mortgage industry works.

3) McCain also says 10 months ago that it was just a handful of people who thought there was really a mess out there.

So, if (1) Fannie Mae and Freddie Mac controlled so much of the subprime mess, if (2) McCain admitted 10 months ago that he knew nothing of how the mortage industry worked, and if (3) McCain really believed that only a handful of people out of many thought there was a problem, then how would McCain have known enough, and certainly more than all but a handful of economists 2 years ago (14 months before the statement he made 10 months ago) to be able to warn Fannie Mae and Freddie Mac that there was a problem in the first place, especially considering the fact that he has, on numerous occasions, admitted his ignorance of economics?

McCain is busted - pure and simple.
 
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1) Fannie Mae and Freddie Mac were involved in almost the entirety of bad loans, which makes it exactly the same thing.

2) McCain says 10 months ago that he knew nothing about how the mortgage industry works.

3) McCain also says 10 months ago that it was just a handful of people who thought there was really a mess out there.

So, if (1) Fannie Mae and Freddie Mac controlled so much of the subprime mess, if (2) McCain admitted 10 months ago that he knew nothing of how the mortage industry worked, and if (3) McCain really believed that only a handful of people out of many thought there was a problem, then how would McCain have known enough, and certainly more than all but a handful of economists 2 years ago (14 months before the statement he made 10 months ago) to be able to warn Fannie Mae and Freddie Mac that there was a problem in the first place, especially considering the fact that he has, on numerous occasions, admitted his ignorance of economics?

McCain is busted - pure and simple.

Considering he DID warn about Fannie Mae and Freddie Mac two years ago, and that it's in the Congressional Record, I'm not sure where you have a leg to stand on here. No subsequent comments of his can "prove" he didn't make the warning, because he did.
 
YouTube - Obama Ranks Second In Freddie/Fannie Contributions

In only 4 years in the Senate, Barack Obama has managed to become the 2nd highest recipient of campaign cash from Freddie Mac & Fannie Mae in the years cited, 1989-2008.

Obama raked in $126,349 since 2004.

For point of comparison, the #1 highest recipient, Sen. Christopher Dodd, assumed his present office in 1981 and has received only $165,400 from the two controversial companies.

Are you still believing Obama's song and dance?

He's a sneaky guy.
 
Considering he DID warn about Fannie Mae and Freddie Mac two years ago, and that it's in the Congressional Record, I'm not sure where you have a leg to stand on here. No subsequent comments of his can "prove" he didn't make the warning, because he did.

Really? Here is the Fannie Mae web site. This information comes straight from the horse's mouth. In April of 2007, Fannie Mae reported that:

Fannie Mae has a history of working with lenders to serve families who don't have perfect financial profiles. "Subprime" is, after all, simply the description of a borrower who doesn't have perfect credit. We see it as part of our mission and our charter to make safe mortgages available to people who don't have perfect credit.

OK, now we have established that Fannie Mae engaged in the subprime market. Now this:

Today, our exposure remains relatively minimal -- less than 2.5 percent of our book of business can be defined as subprime.

Note - Fannie Mae claims in April of 2007 that subprime was less than 2.5 percent of its business. Nobody sees a problem here yet.

Now note this from the International Herald Tribune, printed July 30, 2007:

Fannie Mae, the largest provider of money for U.S. home loans, said it held $47.2 billion of securities backed by subprime mortgages at the end of June. Freddie Mac, the second-largest, held $120.8 billion of such debt as of May 31.

That was the first time the actual extent of Fannie Mae and Freddie Mac in subprime lending was actually disclosed. Before July 30, 2007, nobody knew.

2 years ago would put the date at September 17, 2006, almost a full year before the actual disclosures. See the problem yet, or do you believe that McCain should change his name to Karnak the Soothsayer? Or maybe McCain lied.
 
Considering he DID warn about Fannie Mae and Freddie Mac two years ago, and that it's in the Congressional Record, I'm not sure where you have a leg to stand on here. No subsequent comments of his can "prove" he didn't make the warning, because he did.

Really? Here is the Fannie Mae web site. This information comes straight from the horse's mouth. In April of 2007, Fannie Mae reported that:

Fannie Mae has a history of working with lenders to serve families who don't have perfect financial profiles. "Subprime" is, after all, simply the description of a borrower who doesn't have perfect credit. We see it as part of our mission and our charter to make safe mortgages available to people who don't have perfect credit.

OK, now we have established that Fannie Mae engaged in the subprime market. Now this:

Today, our exposure remains relatively minimal -- less than 2.5 percent of our book of business can be defined as subprime.

Note - Fannie Mae claims in April of 2007 that subprime was less than 2.5 percent of its business. Nobody sees a problem here yet.

Now note this from the International Herald Tribune, printed July 30, 2007:

Fannie Mae, the largest provider of money for U.S. home loans, said it held $47.2 billion of securities backed by subprime mortgages at the end of June. Freddie Mac, the second-largest, held $120.8 billion of such debt as of May 31.

That was the first time the actual extent of Fannie Mae and Freddie Mac in subprime lending was actually disclosed. Before July 30, 2007, nobody knew.

2 years ago would put the date at September 17, 2006, almost a full year before the actual disclosures. See the problem yet, or do you believe that McCain should change his name to Karnak the Soothsayer? Or maybe McCain lied.
 
Considering he DID warn about Fannie Mae and Freddie Mac two years ago, and that it's in the Congressional Record, I'm not sure where you have a leg to stand on here. No subsequent comments of his can "prove" he didn't make the warning, because he did.

Really? Here is the Fannie Mae web site. This information comes straight from the horse's mouth. In April of 2007, Fannie Mae reported that:

Fannie Mae has a history of working with lenders to serve families who don't have perfect financial profiles. "Subprime" is, after all, simply the description of a borrower who doesn't have perfect credit. We see it as part of our mission and our charter to make safe mortgages available to people who don't have perfect credit.

OK, now we have established that Fannie Mae engaged in the subprime market. Now this:

Today, our exposure remains relatively minimal -- less than 2.5 percent of our book of business can be defined as subprime.

Note - Fannie Mae claims in April of 2007 that subprime was less than 2.5 percent of its business. Nobody sees a problem here yet.

Now note this from the International Herald Tribune, printed July 30, 2007:

Fannie Mae, the largest provider of money for U.S. home loans, said it held $47.2 billion of securities backed by subprime mortgages at the end of June. Freddie Mac, the second-largest, held $120.8 billion of such debt as of May 31.

That was the first time the actual extent of Fannie Mae and Freddie Mac in subprime lending was actually disclosed. Before July 30, 2007, nobody knew.

2 years ago would put the date at September 17, 2006, almost a full year before the actual disclosures. See the problem yet, or do you believe that McCain should change his name to Karnak the Soothsayer? Or maybe McCain lied.
 
YouTube - Obama Ranks Second In Freddie/Fannie Contributions

In only 4 years in the Senate, Barack Obama has managed to become the 2nd highest recipient of campaign cash from Freddie Mac & Fannie Mae in the years cited, 1989-2008.

Obama raked in $126,349 since 2004.

For point of comparison, the #1 highest recipient, Sen. Christopher Dodd, assumed his present office in 1981 and has received only $165,400 from the two controversial companies.

Are you still believing Obama's song and dance?

He's a sneaky guy.

And McCain, the person this thread is about, has 19 former Fannie/Freddie lobbyists on his campaign. Vote Babar.
 
Who's the liar, danarhea?

14o3f2f.jpg


Hot Air Blog Archive McCain’s attempt to fix Fannie Mae, Freddie Mac in 2005; Update: Obama can’t get AIG right

And who was the second highest recipient of Fannie Mae/Freddie Mac campaign cash?

Hmmm?

30jnwx4.jpg


:poke

McCain is, and you are. McCain's speech had nothing to do with the subprime crisis, as he says, and as you say he said. This was a matter of overstating earnings so that officers in the company could get bonuses. McCain, and you, of course, take it out of context, and attempt to say that McCain predicted the subprime crisis. Now, officers in the company getting bonuses they did not deserve probably pissed McCain off at the time, and would have pissed me off too, had I found out as he did. I commend McCain for bringing it up, but he is still a liar in that he claims today that he warned about Fannie Mae and Freddie Mac in the context of sub prime lending, when that was not the case at all. It was earnings overstatements, which is also not a good thing, but is something quite different. As I have already shown, the actual disclosures from Fanny Mae were not even made public until August 30, 2007, so there is no way McCain could have seen this coming more than a year before that.

I guess that makes you out to be the liar. :mrgreen:

By the way, here is the entirety of what McCain said, directly from the Congressional record itself:

Mr. MCCAIN. Mr. President, this
week Fannie Mae’s regulator reported
that the company’s quarterly reports
of profit growth over the past few years
were ‘‘illusions deliberately and systematically
created’’ by the company’s
senior management, which resulted in
a $10.6 billion accounting scandal.
The Office of Federal Housing Enterprise
Oversight’s report goes on to say
that Fannie Mae employees deliberately
and intentionally manipulated
financial reports to hit earnings targets
in order to trigger bonuses for senior
executives.
In the case of Franklin
Raines, Fannie Mae’s former chief executive
officer, OFHEO’s report shows
that over half of Mr. Raines’ compensation
for the 6 years through 2003 was directly
tied to meeting earnings targets.
The report of financial misconduct at
Fannie Mae echoes the deeply troubling
$5 billion profit restatement at
Freddie Mac.
The OFHEO report also states that
Fannie Mae used its political power to
lobby Congress in an effort to interfere
with the regulator’s examination of the
company’s accounting problems. This
report comes some weeks after Freddie
Mac paid a record $3.8 million fine in a
settlement with the Federal Election
Commission and restated lobbying disclosure
reports from 2004 to 2005. These
are entities that have demonstrated
over and over again that they are deeply
in need of reform.
For years I have been concerned
about the regulatory structure that
governs Fannie Mae and Freddie Mac—
known as Government-sponsored entities
or GSEs—and the sheer magnitude
of these companies and the role they
play in the housing market. OFHEO’s
report this week does nothing to ease
these concerns. In fact, the report does
quite the contrary. OFHEO’s report solidifies
my view that the GSEs need to
be reformed without delay.
I join as a cosponsor of the Federal
Housing Enterprise Regulatory Reform
Act of 2005, S. 190, to underscore my
support for quick passage of GSE regulatory
reform legislation. If Congress
does not act, American taxpayers will
continue to be exposed to the enormous
risk that Fannie Mae and Freddie Mac
pose to the housing market, the overall
financial system, and the economy as a
whole.
I urge my colleagues to support swift
action on this GSE reform legislation.
 
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Here is what John McCain just said:



But here is what McCain said about 10 months ago:



Once again, I need not post anything one way or the other here. McCain certainly makes the case against himself all by himself, and needs no help from me.

Article is here.

I can't see the video from here. Does it show the guy who asks a 3-part question and McCain looking like a deer in headlights? His first response was that he wasn't smart enough to answer the question. Wow--that's someone I want in the White House. NOT.

Rachel Maddow's show showed a lengthy video related to this question-and-answer session. It made McCain look like he didn't know what he was talking about. I actually felt sorry for McCain.
 
Great so you've basically proven me correct.

9/17/2008 - The Danahrea Lie of the Day

It is true that I selectively quoted. That is because I wanted to see what the Bushneviks and the McCain supporters would say. You guys were true to form, and now I can post the entirety of what McCain said 10 months ago. Enjoy. :mrgreen:

Good thing I'm not either of those.

Read especially the bolded part. Actually, you could have done that before by clicking on the link I supplied. :mrgreen:

I did read your link. That's where I found the part you PURPOSEFULLY STILL have left out, that proves you are the lier, not McCain in this....at least by the standard you're attempting to hold him to.

Like I said in my first post, I didn't have to really post anything extra. McCain's own words speak for themselves. LOL.

Yes they do.

Lets look at McCain's words:

"Two years ago, I warned that the oversight of Fannie and Freddie was terrible, that we were facing a crisis because of it, or certainly serious problems"

And lets look at what your article says:

"McCain did indeed deliver a speech on the Senate floor in 2006 in which he warned of a problem with Fannie Mae and Freddie Mac and the risks they posed to the housing market and the economy as a whole. "

Well holy **** Dana, what do you know. You purposefully have still left out the fact that McCain DID deliver a speech 2 years ago where he warned that hte oversight of Frannie and Freddie was in trouble and that they were facing a possible crisis because of it.

Wait...that's EXACTLY WHAT MCCAIN SAID

But of course, by your own standards you're trying to hold McCain to, you LIED by not pointing out that he did EXACTLy what he said he did.

Why do you lie so much Dana? I mean, by your standard, why do you lie so much?
 
Really? Here is the Fannie Mae web site. This information comes straight from the horse's mouth. In April of 2007, Fannie Mae reported that:



OK, now we have established that Fannie Mae engaged in the subprime market. Now this:



Note - Fannie Mae claims in April of 2007 that subprime was less than 2.5 percent of its business. Nobody sees a problem here yet.

Now note this from the International Herald Tribune, printed July 30, 2007:



That was the first time the actual extent of Fannie Mae and Freddie Mac in subprime lending was actually disclosed. Before July 30, 2007, nobody knew.

2 years ago would put the date at September 17, 2006, almost a full year before the actual disclosures. See the problem yet, or do you believe that McCain should change his name to Karnak the Soothsayer? Or maybe McCain lied.

1) He said he warned about the problems at Freddie Mac and Fannie Mae two years ago. You say this is a lie.

2) I linked to statements he made in Congress two years ago which show he did exactly that.

Your obsession with sliming McCain is really reaching pathological and disturbing proportions. "Conservative," indeed.
 
1) He said he warned about the problems at Freddie Mac and Fannie Mae two years ago. You say this is a lie.

2) I linked to statements he made in Congress two years ago which show he did exactly that.

Your obsession with sliming McCain is really reaching pathological and disturbing proportions. "Conservative," indeed.

2 different problems, as I have already shown with McCain's statement, taken directly from the Congressional Record web site.

As for your ad hominem attack, consider it reported.
 
2 different problems, as I have already shown with McCain's statement, taken directly from the Congressional Record web site.

Here's what he said yesterday.

Two years ago, I warned that the oversight of Fannie and Freddie was terrible, that we were facing a crisis because of it, or certainly serious problems," Sen. John McCain, R-Ariz., told CBS this morning. "The influence that Fannie and Freddie had in the inside the Beltway, old boy network, which led to this kind of corruption is unacceptable and I warned about it a couple of years ago.


Here's what he said in Congress in 2006 (I linked to it earlier).

Mr. President, this week Fannie Mae's regulator reported that the company's quarterly reports of profit growth over the past few years were "illusions deliberately and systematically created" by the company's senior management, which resulted in a $10.6 billion accounting scandal.

The Office of Federal Housing Enterprise Oversight's report goes on to say that Fannie Mae employees deliberately and intentionally manipulated financial reports to hit earnings targets in order to trigger bonuses for senior executives. In the case of Franklin Raines, Fannie Mae's former chief executive officer, OFHEO's report shows that over half of Mr. Raines' compensation for the 6 years through 2003 was directly tied to meeting earnings targets. The report of financial misconduct at Fannie Mae echoes the deeply troubling $5 billion profit restatement at Freddie Mac.

The OFHEO report also states that Fannie Mae used its political power to lobby Congress in an effort to interfere with the regulator's examination of the company's accounting problems. This report comes some weeks after Freddie Mac paid a record $3.8 million fine in a settlement with the Federal Election Commission and restated lobbying disclosure reports from 2004 to 2005. These are entities that have demonstrated over and over again that they are deeply in need of reform.

For years I have been concerned about the regulatory structure that governs Fannie Mae and Freddie Mac--known as Government-sponsored entities or GSEs--and the sheer magnitude of these companies and the role they play in the housing market. OFHEO's report this week does nothing to ease these concerns. In fact, the report does quite the contrary. OFHEO's report solidifies my view that the GSEs need to be reformed without delay.

I join as a cosponsor of the Federal Housing Enterprise Regulatory Reform Act of 2005, S. 190, to underscore my support for quick passage of GSE regulatory reform legislation. If Congress does not act, American taxpayers will continue to be exposed to the enormous risk that Fannie Mae and Freddie Mac pose to the housing market, the overall financial system, and the economy as a whole.

I urge my colleagues to support swift action on this GSE reform legislation.

There. Is. No. Lie.

Anybody fair-minded can see that.
 
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