On Obama, Earmarks, Palin Less Than Honest

Summerwind · 09-04-08, 05:39 PM

ABC News: On Obama, Earmarks, Palin Less Than Honest

Quote:

In a rousing speech at last night's Republican National Convention, vice presidential hopeful Sarah Palin, the governor of Alaska, touted her record, attacked the opposition, and in some cases bent the facts.
Sarah Palin
Speaking last night at the RNC in St. Paul, vice-presidential pick Gov. Sarah Palin stretched the truth when it came to Barrack Obama and her support of earmarks.
(Donna Svennevik/ABC )
More Photos

•PALIN: "[Obama] is a man who can give an entire speech about the wars America is fighting, and never use the word 'victory' except when he's talking about his own campaign."

FACT: On July 15, in a speech in Washington, D.C., Obama twice used the word "victory" in reference to Iraq.

"In fact," he said, "true success in Iraq -- victory in Iraq -- will not take place in a surrender ceremony where an enemy lays down their arms. . . I want Iraqis to take responsibility for their own future, and to reach the political accommodation necessary for long-term stability. That's victory. That's success. That's what's best for Iraq, that's what's best for America, and that's why I will end this war as President. <more at link>

I am shocked and surprised by the fact that media is not giving her a pass. I guess she sort of bought it with her comments last eve. Begging for both barrels, she was.

Zyphlin · 09-05-08, 01:47 AM

I'm really surprised and shocked the media didn't give her a pass.

Why you ask?

Because they gave Barack Obama one.

These things are stump speeches for your base. EVERY politician leaves out information, gives information that's a bit slanted, or uses great amount of hyperbole to make a point or show humor.

But no, I'm not shocked, as I've said.

Now, before I get asked "But what things by Obama?!", here's what I mean:

Link

Quote:

* Obama said he could “pay for every dime” of his spending and tax cut proposals “by closing corporate loopholes and tax havens.” That’s wrong – his proposed tax increases on upper-income individuals are key components of paying for his program, as well. And his plan, like McCain’s, would leave the U.S. facing big budget deficits, according to independent experts.

* He twisted McCain’s words about Afghanistan, saying, “When John McCain said we could just ‘muddle through’ in Afghanistan, I argued for more resources.” Actually, McCain said in 2003 we “may” muddle through, and he recently also called for more troops there.

* He said McCain would fail to lower taxes for 100 million Americans while his own plan would cut taxes for 95 percent of “working” families. But an independent analysis puts the number who would see no benefit from McCain’s plan at 66 million and finds that Obama’s plan would benefit 81 percent of all households when retirees and those without children are figured in.

* Obama asked why McCain would “define middle-class as someone making under five million dollars a year”? Actually, McCain meant that comment as a joke, getting a laugh and following up by saying, “But seriously …”

* Obama noted that McCain’s health care plan would “tax people’s benefits” but didn’t say that it also would provide up to a $5,000 tax credit for families.

* He said McCain, far from being a maverick who’s “broken with his party,” has voted to support Bush policies 90 percent of the time. True enough, but by the same measure Obama has voted with fellow Democrats in the Senate 97 percent of the time.

* Obama said “average family income” went down $2,000 under Bush, which isn’t correct. An aide said he was really talking only about “working” families and not retired couples. And – math teachers, please note – he meant median (or midpoint) and not really the mean or average. Median family income actually has inched up slightly under Bush.

Palin's speech, like Obama's and Bidens and McCain's tonight, was as much about sending a message, political spin, painting ones opponent in a negative light, and using traditional political tactics of hyperbole, exclussion of information, and "facts" that are or aren't true based on the context in which they're stated. This is nothing new, its nothing singular to Palin, or even just the Republicans in this campaign...and the media know it. Honestly,are going over Palin hard on this when they barely even meeped about it with Obama, does nothing but further show hypocracy in some of them and help to further prove the republican "talking point" at this convention right about the media.

((edited cause its late and I misread your first sentence))

Kernel Sanders · 09-05-08, 02:20 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Summerwind

Quote:

•PALIN: "[Obama] is a man who can give an entire speech about the wars America is fighting, and never use the word 'victory' except when he's talking about his own campaign."

FACT: On July 15, in a speech in Washington, D.C., Obama twice used the word "victory" in reference to Iraq.

can give =\= always gives

Also, when you have to go out to find that one speech where Obama talked about victory in Iraq, you're proving her point, not refuting it

RightinNYC · 09-05-08, 02:45 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Kernel Sanders

can give =\= always gives

Also, when you have to go out to find that one speech where Obama talked about victory in Iraq, you're proving her point, not refuting it

Thank you. ABC is apparently retarded.

RightinNYC: "Posters on this forum tend to get out of hand around elections"

ABC Factchecker: "Not true, in the week leading up to the 2005 Pawtucket City Council Primary there were at least 3 posts on DP that were not out of hand. RightinNYC is stretching the truth."

Zyphlin · 09-05-08, 02:52 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by RightinNYC

Thank you. ABC is apparently retarded.

RightinNYC: "Posters on this forum tend to get out of hand around elections"

ABC Factchecker: "Not true, in the week leading up to the 2005 Pawtucket City Council Primary there were at least 3 posts on DP that were not out of hand. RightinNYC is stretching the truth."

Its just too bad as of yet I can't find anything about ABC's fact checker actually looking at Obama's speech at all.

Actually, as I go back to the dates after Obama's speech, I can see almost no mentions of "fact checking of Obama's speech". Yet there are tons of ones about Palin.

I guess if you're not the medias favorite current attack target, its not worth checking your political speech to be certain its 100% accurate in every way possible.

independent_thinker2002 · 09-05-08, 06:32 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Zyphlin

Its just too bad as of yet I can't find anything about ABC's fact checker actually looking at Obama's speech at all.

Actually, as I go back to the dates after Obama's speech, I can see almost no mentions of "fact checking of Obama's speech". Yet there are tons of ones about Palin.

I guess if you're not the medias favorite current attack target, its not worth checking your political speech to be certain its 100% accurate in every way possible.

Does FNC have a fact check story?

American · 09-05-08, 07:38 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Kernel Sanders

can give =\= always gives

Also, when you have to go out to find that one speech where Obama talked about victory in Iraq, you're proving her point, not refuting it

The left wingnut media never gives a pass to a conservative. They're nothing more that a Democratic propaganda machine.

Zyphlin · 09-05-08, 01:44 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by independent_thinker2002

Does FNC have a fact check story?

I honestly don't know if they have a fact check story on Obama or Palin, I haven't looked.

Ah, just checked...yep, they have both:

PALIN

OBAMA

I found that in about 3 minutes. I spent about 5 to 8 and couldn't find an Obama one on ABC

disneydude · 09-05-08, 09:44 PM

ABC: Palin’s Speech Full of Lies and Distortions
Trish | Sep. 4, 2008

PALIN: “[Obama] is a man who can give an entire speech about the wars America is fighting, and never use the word ‘victory’ except when he’s talking about his own campaign.”

FACT: On July 15, in a speech in Washington, D.C., Obama twice used the word “victory” in reference to Iraq
Palin hired a former chief of staff for Sen. Ted Stevens to lobby Congress for earmarks. Wasilla, population 10,000, received $27 million in federal money, about as much as Boise, Idaho, population 200,000“In fact,” he said, “true success in Iraq — victory in Iraq — will not take place in a surrender ceremony where an enemy lays down their arms. . . I want Iraqis to take responsibility for their own future, and to reach the political accommodation necessary for long-term stability. That’s victory. That’s success. That’s what’s best for Iraq, that’s what’s best for America, and that’s why I will end this war as President. A week later in Berlin, Germany on July 23, Obama used the word “victory” three times to describe Allied successes during World War II. And in a June speech about the prospect of universal healthcare, he said Sen. Hillary Clinton “will be central to that victory.”

PALIN: “There is much to like and admire about our opponent. But listening to him speak, it’s easy to forget that this is a man who has authored two memoirs but not a single major law or reform — not even in the state senate.”

FACT: The meaning of “major” is open to debate, but Obama worked with Republicans, including Sen. Richard Luger of Indiana, to pass legislation that would expand efforts to intercept illegal shipments of weapons of mass destruction and to destroy conventional weapons stockpiles. While a state senator in Illinois, he sponsored two contentious bills, one that studied racial profiling by police and another that ordered interrogations in potential death penalty cases to be recorded.

PALIN: “I fought to bring about the largest private-sector infrastructure project in North American history. And when that deal was struck, we began a nearly $40 billion natural gas pipeline to help lead America to energy independence. That pipeline, when the last section is laid and its valves are opened, will lead America one step farther away from dependence on dangerous foreign powers that do not have our interests at heart.”

FACT: That infrastructure project has not yet been approved by Federal regulators. The proposed pipeline would ship natural gas from the Alaska’s North Slope to homes and businesses across the U.S. In June, the Alaskan legislature, with Palin’s prodding, agreed to pay Canadian energy company TransCanada $500 million as an incentive to build the pipeline.

PALIN: “And I have protected the taxpayers by vetoing wasteful spending: nearly half a billion dollars in vetoes. I suspended the state fuel tax, and championed reform to end the abuses of earmark spending by Congress. I told the Congress ‘thanks, but no thanks,’ for that Bridge to Nowhere.”

FACT: While serving as mayor of Wasilla, Alaska, Palin hired Steven Silver, a former chief of staff for Sen. Ted Stevens, to lobby Congress for earmarks. Wasilla received around $27 million in federal money, about as much as Boise, Idaho. Boise has a population of 200,000 people, compared to Wasilla’s 10,000. Earmarked funds went to sewage improvements and improving roads connecting the town to a local ski resort. As for the “Bridge to Nowhere,” Palin initially supported using federal funds to build a $398 million bridge from Ketchikan to Gravina Island, which has 50 residents and a small airport. It was not until the plan was ridiculed that she withdrew her support. Critics contend she still supports using federal money to build a 3.4 mile “road to nowhere” on the island for $26 million — from the funds for the bridge.

PALIN: While I was at it, I got rid of a few things in the governor’s office that I didn’t believe our citizens should have to pay for. That luxury jet was over the top. I put it on eBay. I also drive myself to work.

FACT: Soon after entering office, Palin put the state-owned Westwind II jet that her predecessor Frank Murkowski’s purchased amid much criticism (sic). When the deal fell through with the sole eBay bidder, the plane was sold offline. Alaskan businessman Larry Reynolds paid $2.1 (sic) for the jet after learning about it from Republican John L. Harris, speaker of the Alaskan House of Representatives. Palin drives herself to work. In July, her Chevy Suburban was rear-ended while driving from Wasilla to her office in downtown Anchorage.

And the crazy thing about it....McCain was repeating many of these same lies on the campaign trail today.
Either McCain is senile or he believes that the American people are stupid.

obvious Child · 09-05-08, 09:46 PM

So?

Did you expect the truth? These speeches are generally targeted towards those who are already going to vote for the candidate who makes them. Opposition and independents generally won't be swayed by these as they'd go through the effort of fact checking and generally finding out that the majority of the so called facts are actually not facts.

I'd be shocked if Palin actually gave an accurate representation of Obama and herself. I'd be shocked if any candidate did that.