Military see 2008 race through different lens

Hatuey · 07-01-08, 06:27 PM

Political Pulse | The Associated Press-Yahoo! News Poll on Yahoo! News

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McCain, with a family tradition of military service and his own history as a decorated Vietnam prisoner of war, holds natural appeal for members of the military and veterans. Indeed, an AP-Yahoo News poll conducted last month (in June), found that veterans favored McCain over Obama 49 percent to 32 percent, while the two candidates ran about even in the population as a whole. Three-fourths of veterans in the survey thought McCain would be a good leader of the military, compared to one-fourth who thought likewise of Obama.

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That Obama attracts support from some in the military is evident in dollars and cents: Among people who have donated at least $200 to a presidential campaign this election cycle, Obama has collected more than $327,000 from those identifying themselves as military personnel, while McCain has collected $224,000, according to an analysis of Federal Election Commission data by The Associated Press.

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"I don't want anyone to think that because he (Obama) is of the African-American heritage that he automatically has my vote, or that McCain will get it because I was in the military," said Friday, who is black.

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Friday, 49, added that he understands what McCain meant when he said the United States could have troops in Iraq for 100 years, but he doesn't necessarily support the statement. Still, he predicted, "We will be in Iraq until death do we part."

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Sgt. Maj. Brent Dick, a 35-year-old career soldier stationed at Fort Bliss in Texas, hasn't decided who he'll vote for in November, but he agrees with McCain's stance on Iraq.

"I favor staying there until we are done with our mission," said Dick. He said the candidates' plans for Iraq will be one deciding factor in his vote, but the weakening economy also is a huge concern.

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"I'm a Democrat," said Warren, who served three tours in Iraq. He said that while the war will be an issue for him in picking a president, he doesn't see military service as a must.

"They don't necessarily have to have served in the military to know about it," he said.

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As for Obama, says Ziegler: "He's new and he's young. He's got what seem like new ideas. I don't think now's the right time for that, being that we are in Iraq."

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"I have a lot of respect for McCain," says Morin. "Everyone in the military is going to tell you that." But then he adds: "I don't think he has anything new to offer. His mind-set is really stuck maybe in the Vietnam era, and the conflicts we're facing now have nothing to do with Vietnam."

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Richard Topping, a former Army JAG officer who spent more than five years on active duty, said McCain's military record is impressive, but he finds the senator's open-ended commitment to Iraq troubling. "I care far more about the economy, which has me leaning left this election," said Topping, who works as a Justice Department attorney. "Time for new people and new ideas here in D.C."

I think some of these opinions are very interesting. I do not doubt that Obama will not get the military vote but it's interesting that the military isn't lining up behind McCain as I would have expected them to like with Bush. Seems to me like in sharp contrast with Bush McCain has yet to pimp out his military credentials. They don't need to be spoken for. So why the hesitation for so many to support McCain?

rsixing · 07-01-08, 08:23 PM

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Originally Posted by Hatuey

I think some of these opinions are very interesting. I do not doubt that Obama will not get the military vote but it's interesting that the military isn't lining up behind McCain as I would have expected them to like with Bush. Seems to me like in sharp contrast with Bush McCain has yet to pimp out his military credentials. They don't need to be spoken for. So why the hesitation for so many to support McCain?

I'm former military and McCain is not my candidate. He is so far removed from the the man in the street and the direction this nation needs to go he has accomplished alienating not only myself but nearly every person I have talked to with his saber rattling and warmongering posturing. Yes, he served this nation in the Navy. Yes, he was a POW. I respect his service. How could I not. That said I do not find the notion that military service makes anyone automatically qualified nor even capable of being CiC and PotUS.

A point I have not broached about McCain is I also am concerned about his mental well-being and just how six years of torture and isolated imprisonment affected his mental well-being. I'm sorry for what he suffered but there is not one person in the world who could come out of such an experience and not be traumatized, mentally, from such an existence and that potentiality worries me, deeply. If McCain is elected what can we expect from him? How will he handle the stresses, both mental and physical, from being CiC and PotUs? Will these stressors cause him to have lapses in judgment? It's an unknown I don't want to have to find out about.

Additionally I have two young sons (15 and 13) and I will cast my vote to make clear I will not have a warmonger like McSame in the highest office in this land who, by his own comments, has every intention of "asking" my children to serve because, as he has stated, there will be more wars. Albeit I will not forbid my boys from following in my footsteps and serving our nation in the military I will try to direct them to a service which should offer them some greater form of protection from direct combat danger, such as the USCG or the USAF, rather then their desire to serve in the US Army. I pray, if McCain is elected, they will listen to my advice and take it as given, out of my deep undying love for them and my fatherly concern for their well-being in a world that has gone mad.

DeeJayH · 07-01-08, 09:15 PM

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That Obama attracts support from some in the military is evident in dollars and cents: Among people who have donated at least $200 to a presidential campaign this election cycle, Obama has collected more than $327,000 from those identifying themselves as military personnel, while McCain has collected $224,000, according to an analysis of Federal Election Commission data by The Associated Press.

why are they only counting donations of >$200?
do they not keep records of lesser amounts
or is that the cutoff that makes one candidate look better?

Indy · 07-01-08, 10:35 PM

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Originally Posted by DeeJayH

why are they only counting donations of >$200?
do they not keep records of lesser amounts
or is that the cutoff that makes one candidate look better?

Just a guess but with Obama's lead with small donors I would think that this would also be the case here. Its probably much much easier to collect the data of donations over $200 than to add up every single entry. I could be wrong but that's my take on it.

DeeJayH · 07-02-08, 12:16 AM

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Originally Posted by Indy

Just a guess but with Obama's lead with small donors I would think that this would also be the case here. Its probably much much easier to collect the data of donations over $200 than to add up every single entry. I could be wrong but that's my take on it.

seems to me that since the bulk of Obamas financing has come over the internet, ti is easily calculated
dollars are alot less easy to add than web credits

P/N · 07-02-08, 06:41 AM

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Originally Posted by rsixing

I'm former military and McCain is not my candidate. He is so far removed from the the man in the street and the direction this nation needs to go he has accomplished alienating not only myself but nearly every person I have talked to with his saber rattling and warmongering posturing. Yes, he served this nation in the Navy. Yes, he was a POW. I respect his service. How could I not. That said I do not find the notion that military service makes anyone automatically qualified nor even capable of being CiC and PotUS.

First of all, thanks for your service. Secondly, what leads us to believe that Obama is any different fron what I bolded in your quote above? I certainly don't see it in him. And I do agree that military service doesn't qualify anyone for anything aside from benefits that veterans aren't getting. It certainly doesn't qualify them for the POTUS, but I think it says a lot about a person who was willing to serve their country in the armed forces.

Quote:

Originally Posted by rsixing

A point I have not broached about McCain is I also am concerned about his mental well-being and just how six years of torture and isolated imprisonment affected his mental well-being. I'm sorry for what he suffered but there is not one person in the world who could come out of such an experience and not be traumatized, mentally, from such an existence and that potentiality worries me, deeply. If McCain is elected what can we expect from him? How will he handle the stresses, both mental and physical, from being CiC and PotUs? Will these stressors cause him to have lapses in judgment? It's an unknown I don't want to have to find out about.

This is a load of crap. If McCain had any issues remotely close to what you imply, don't you think we would have seen something out of him (or at least heard about it) during his last 26 years of serving the state of Arizona in Congress. How long has Obama been serving in Congress again? I think McCain's perfectly capable of serving the office of the POTUS from a "mental" standpoint.

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Originally Posted by rsixing

Additionally I have two young sons (15 and 13) and I will cast my vote to make clear I will not have a warmonger like McSame in the highest office in this land who, by his own comments, has every intention of "asking" my children to serve because, as he has stated, there will be more wars. Albeit I will not forbid my boys from following in my footsteps and serving our nation in the military I will try to direct them to a service which should offer them some greater form of protection from direct combat danger, such as the USCG or the USAF, rather then their desire to serve in the US Army. I pray, if McCain is elected, they will listen to my advice and take it as given, out of my deep undying love for them and my fatherly concern for their well-being in a world that has gone mad.

To the first bolded point in this quote - McCain is as much a warmonger as Kennedy or Truman was. He will be inheriting a war that was poorly planned and poorly managed from the WH. Yes, McCain supported the war, but I can guarantee you he would have fought it much differently (if at all) had he been the POTUS.

To the second bolded point in this quote, I applaud you. I would only hope that you would give them the same advice regardless of who is in the WH. Neither party has a solid history of properly using the military to carry out the business of the US Government.

I believe this election is probably going to be the most important election of not only our lifetimes, but most likely in the last 200 years or more. While the condition in Iraq is improving, it is still unstable and could easily swing back in the opposite direction in a very short time frame. Iran has become a major problem and while I pray we don't go to war with Iran, it is becoming more and more evident that we will, but I will not support going it alone as we did in Iraq - no way. The economy is stuck in a spiral that I figured we would have started recovering from by now, but I hardly blame Bush for the state it's in. There are so many other factors involved and legislation passed by both sides that haven't helped matters either. To be perfectly honest, I don't believe McCain or Obama is going to help the economic situation. I think Obama will hurt it slightly more than McCain will, but neither are what I would call economic geniuses at all.

My take on this election, we're screwed - no matter who wins. I'm not a big fan of McCain, but I'm less a fan of Obama. This is the first time since I've been able to vote (I'm 36), that I honestly feel my vote will truly go to the lesser of the two evils. I don't see either candidate with all the right answers. Obama may be stronger when it comes to A, B or C, whereas McCain is stronger when it comes to X, Y and Z. No matter who wins, they are going to screw something up. I'm just hoping that whoever wins will not send us to hell faster than we are already headed. And yes, the entire world has gone mad, and we're all along for the ride.

WI Crippler · 07-02-08, 07:05 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Hatuey

They don't need to be spoken for. So why the hesitation for so many to support McCain?

Most military members simply don't donate to Presidential candidates(don't let the Ron Paul supporters tell you otherwise). Alot of them simply don't make their leaning publically known, or aren't interviewed.
McCain should sweep the military vote, but probably by less than previous republican candidates.

partier9 · 07-02-08, 07:15 PM

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Originally Posted by WI Crippler

Most military members simply don't donate to Presidential candidates(don't let the Ron Paul supporters tell you otherwise). Alot of them simply don't make their leaning publically known, or aren't interviewed.
McCain should sweep the military vote, but probably by less than previous republican candidates.

Yeah thats what ive noticed all the military members in my family have never donated any money to their presidental canidate, and they all vote repuplican. Also my friends brother is currently serving in the military and he told her that most of his friends in the military support McCain, they just don't donate.

partier9 · 07-02-08, 07:20 PM

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Originally Posted by rsixing

A point I have not broached about McCain is I also am concerned about his mental well-being and just how six years of torture and isolated imprisonment affected his mental well-being.

It isn't a issue at all:

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McCain underwent three operations and other treatment for his injuries,[158] spending three months at the Naval Regional Medical Center in Jacksonville.[159][48] Psychological tests, given to all the returning POWs, showed that McCain had "adjusted exceptionally well to repatriation" and had "an ambitious, striving, successful pattern of adjustment".[160] McCain told examiners that he withstood his ordeal by having "Faith in country, United States Navy, family, and God".[161] Unlike many veterans, McCain did not experience flashbacks or nightmares of his Vietnam experience,[162] although the sound of keys rattling would cause him to tense up.[163]

Early life and military career of John McCain - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

so just dont rattle keys when he is making decisions.