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Is remaining a virgin till marriage possible.

SouthernDemocrat said:
Well we are animals. Hominid Genus.

We are biologically wired to want to do it. The sex drive for the average 20 year old guy is probably stronger than it is for a nymphomaniac porn actress.
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If you are going to split hairs (animal) then I will counter that the sex drive of a woman in her 30s is stronger than that of any man in his twenties and beyond.

A nymphomaniac porn actress though? Are you seriously going to tell me (by implication) that a woman would have to be nympho and a porn actress in order to have a high sex drive.

Wrong.
 
DarkWizard12 said:
Because the "bedroom" doesn't really matter to us. We are both virgins. When the time comes we will explore each other ourselves and see what we like, other than that, sex is never brought up. I...apparantly...have a talent with poetry, and she thoroughly enjoys that about me. She looks beautiful and I've never had more fun making a girl go "awwww!". We are confident our time together will be good enough for the both of us.
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You obviously don't realize this, but you are pretty much planting the seeds for a midlife crisis here.
 
TheGirlNextDoor said:
If you are going to split hairs (animal) then I will counter that the sex drive of a woman in her 30s is stronger than that of any man in his twenties and beyond.

A nymphomaniac porn actress though? Are you seriously going to tell me (by implication) that a woman would have to be nympho and a porn actress in order to have a high sex drive.

Wrong.
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Of course not. I am just saying that its a biological fact that a guy for just biological reasons alone has a higher sex drive than a woman does.
 
SouthernDemocrat said:
Of course not. I am just saying that its a biological fact that a guy for just biological reasons alone has a higher sex drive than a woman does.
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They have to, or they wouldn't put up with all the crap to get laid. No women would.
 
Skateguy said:
They have to, or they wouldn't put up with all the crap to get laid. No women would.
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Its just a medical fact that we do.

http://www.webmd.com/sex/features/sex-drive-how-do-men-women-compare

I watched this show on Discovery once about a some women that had sex changes and became men. They said that once they got on all the male hormone therapies they could not believe how strong there sex drive became, exponentially stronger than anything they had ever experienced as a woman.

I don't think women should be envious of a guys sex drive though. Its the cause of probably 90% of our problems in life.
 
nonpareil said:
I have to ask: why do you (or men in general) "need that at some point, somehow, someway"? Like what kind of drive cause you to need to have sex with a women (or men if you're gay) irregardless? Is it something that can be explained? Because I think for most women, they like sex, but they don't have to have it irregardless of who they have it with.
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rivrrat is a girl. ;)

I completely agree with her. If you're not getting it at home, eventually you'll find it elsewhere. Man or woman. Some women may be more patient and hold out longer, but others not so much.
 
How do you know you're going to raise children well together?

How do you know you're going to have the same level of housekeeping expectations?

How do you know you're going to handle finances well together?

How do you both handle a huge crisis like cancer in the family? Losing a home to fire? Bankruptcy?

All of those issues are just as important for spending the rest of your lives together as sex is. Why chastise people who choose to wait? Wasn't the sexual revolution about CHOICE?

I think it's disgusting that we're suppose to stay out of other people's bedrooms (and rightly so) unless they're choosing to remain abstinent until marriage. Then everyone gets to tell them they're doomed. To each his own, for Heaven's sake.

I bet DarkWizard and his lady love are going to make an outstanding couple. They obviously have the chemistry, respect and love.
 
cpwill said:
if the sex sucks forever, then it's their own fault; good sex, like most everything else, is a matter of practice and learning rather than something you just naturally 'have'. and if they love and are devoted to each other, then it should be something that (once they get to that point / are married) they should be willing to work on.
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No, it's not always 'their own fault'. Sometimes there is absolutely nothing to be done about it, no matter how much you 'work on it'.

nonpareil said:
I have to ask: why do you (or men in general) "need that at some point, somehow, someway"? Like what kind of drive cause you to need to have sex with a women (or men if you're gay) irregardless? Is it something that can be explained? Because I think for most women, they like sex, but they don't have to have it irregardless of who they have it with.
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I'm a woman. And I enjoy sex. I would like to have a fulfilling sex life and that's not something I'm willing to do without for the rest of my life.

StandUpChuck said:
How do you know you're going to raise children well together?

How do you know you're going to have the same level of housekeeping expectations?

How do you know you're going to handle finances well together?

How do you both handle a huge crisis like cancer in the family? Losing a home to fire? Bankruptcy?

All of those issues are just as important for spending the rest of your lives together as sex is.
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Which is exactly why people should live together for awhile prior to marrying. But hey, I'm against marriage altogether.

Not to mention that many of the things you speak of can be dealt with. Sexual incompatibility cannot always be dealt with.

Why chastise people who choose to wait? Wasn't the sexual revolution about CHOICE?

I think it's disgusting that we're suppose to stay out of other people's bedrooms (and rightly so) unless they're choosing to remain abstinent until marriage. Then everyone gets to tell them they're doomed. To each his own, for Heaven's sake.
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I'm not telling him they're doomed, I'm stating the reasons why I cannot comprehend the reasoning behind their decisions, as is my right to do so. I'm also stating how *I* personally could not, would not, ever do such a thing and stating the reasons WHY. As is MY choice. Of course to each their own, as I have already stated. And I have already stated, quite sincerely, that I wish them the best. I simply also stated how and why such a decision is considered insane to myself, and others.

Quite frankly, I don't give a flying **** what anyone else does. They can marry and never touch each other and remain abstinent the rest of their damn lives. They can marry a ****ing camel for all I care, have crazy three way camel sex. I. Don't. Care. But if they tell me about it, I'm going to voice how crazy I think they are. And I will continue to do so.
 
SouthernDemocrat said:
You obviously don't realize this, but you are pretty much planting the seeds for a midlife crisis here.
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I'm doing it the way I want to, and I'm confident, as long as my girl is there, my midlife crisis will be most enjoyable. :2wave:
 
DarkWizard12 said:
I'm doing it the way I want to, and I'm confident, as long as my girl is there, my midlife crisis will be most enjoyable. :2wave:
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How long have you been together?
 
rivrrat said:
I wouldn't be okay with that possibility, myself. Wouldn't matter how much I loved someone. I would still need that at some point, somehow, someway. And if I couldn't get it at home, then we'd just have to have an open relationship wherein I could get it elsewhere.
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So, okay, you're shallow. Can't you just accept that not everyone else is?
 
Dav said:
So, okay, you're shallow. Can't you just accept that not everyone else is?
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Having a sexual desire makes someone shallow? That's strange, I guess we're all shallow.
 
Dav said:
So, okay, you're shallow. Can't you just accept that not everyone else is?
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LMFAO

Yeah, desiring sexual fulfillment is 'shallow'. Gotcha. ;) Whatever makes you feel better, dude. Most of the people in the world don't have an iota of a desire to be celibate their entire lives.
 
GManNickG said:
Having a sexual desire makes someone shallow? That's strange, I guess we're all shallow.
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rivrrat said:
LMFAO

Yeah, desiring sexual fulfillment is 'shallow'. Gotcha. ;) Whatever makes you feel better, dude. Most of the people in the world don't have an iota of a desire to be celibate their entire lives.
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That's not what I said at all.

If you really love someone, love everything about them, but when things don't go 100% like you want to in bed - and I may not have much experience with this, but I find it hard to believe that you could not enjoy sex with someone you love - then you decide based solely on that that you can't have a devoted relationship to that person, then yes, that is pretty much the definition of shallow. I won't condemn you for it, I just wish you wouldn't condemn others for not being the same way.
 
Dav said:
That's not what I said at all.

If you really love someone, love everything about them, but when things don't go 100% like you want to in bed - and I may not have much experience with this, but I find it hard to believe that you could not enjoy sex with someone you love - then you decide based solely on that that you can't have a devoted relationship to that person, then yes, that is pretty much the definition of shallow. I won't condemn you for it, I just wish you wouldn't condemn others for not being the same way.
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Of *course* you can not enjoy sex with someone you love! Loving someone doesn't make you compatible with them in bed. Loving someone doesn't make you orgasm. And, loving someone you're incompatible in the bedroom with doesn't suddenly make your sex drive disappear. Nor does it make you want to be celibate for the rest of your life.
 
Dav said:
That's not what I said at all.

If you really love someone, love everything about them, but when things don't go 100% like you want to in bed - and I may not have much experience with this, but I find it hard to believe that you could not enjoy sex with someone you love - then you decide based solely on that that you can't have a devoted relationship to that person, then yes, that is pretty much the definition of shallow. I won't condemn you for it, I just wish you wouldn't condemn others for not being the same way.
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Part of love and attachment is sexual drive and satisfaction. You failed at the start when you said: "If you really love someone, love everything about them, but when things don't go 100% like you want to in bed" If things aren't 100% in the bed, the love isn't 100%. That is, take the same person, fix the bedroom issues, and now you've got someone you can love *even more*.

What I mean is, you can't possibly be in a full 100% loving relationship without a sexual relationship, because sexual desire is in *every single person*. So to say "We're fully in love, even if the sex is sub-optimal" is contradictory; such a couple is *not* fully in love.

Ergo, you can't fully know if you love someone until you've explored each other sexually as well. You can love them quite a bit, I agree; sex is important, but not everything. But it's still important, we can't just shrug it off and let "love take us through it." Sex is part of love.
 
rivrrat said:
Of *course* you can not enjoy sex with someone you love! Loving someone doesn't make you compatible with them in bed.
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How the hell are you "not compatible" in the first place? If the plug fits in the socket, then you're compatible. Not fully enjoying it is extremely shallow grounds for not having a relationship, by definition.

Loving someone doesn't make you orgasm. And, loving someone you're incompatible in the bedroom with doesn't suddenly make your sex drive disappear. Nor does it make you want to be celibate for the rest of your life.
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Why would you be celibate just because you don't enjoy sex with someone? That doesn't make any sense. It would be like starving because you're not fond of the only thing you're able to eat. It would be much more sensible to teach them how to do it better if you're a sexpert, or get counseling.
 
All I'm saying is, if a guy told his girlfriend that he loves her and all, but she's just not good enough in the sack for him, the guy would not leave the scene without a few bruises and/or stab wounds.
 
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GManNickG said:
Part of love and attachment is sexual drive and satisfaction. You failed at the start when you said: "If you really love someone, love everything about them, but when things don't go 100% like you want to in bed" If things aren't 100% in the bed, the love isn't 100%. That is, take the same person, fix the bedroom issues, and now you've got someone you can love *even more*.

What I mean is, you can't possibly be in a full 100% loving relationship without a sexual relationship, because sexual desire is in *every single person*. So to say "We're fully in love, even if the sex is sub-optimal" is contradictory; such a couple is *not* fully in love.

Ergo, you can't fully know if you love someone until you've explored each other sexually as well. You can love them quite a bit, I agree; sex is important, but not everything. But it's still important, we can't just shrug it off and let "love take us through it." Sex is part of love.
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I have no doubt that LUST is related to love; I just find it hard to believe that you wouldn't enjoy sex with someone you already lust after.
 
StandUpChuck said:
I think it's disgusting that we're suppose to stay out of other people's bedrooms (and rightly so) unless they're choosing to remain abstinent until marriage. Then everyone gets to tell them they're doomed. To each his own, for Heaven's sake.
.
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Exactly, which is why the culture wars are such bs. It's Do As I Say vs Do As I Say. Right now, Do As I Say is winning. But you can't rule out a comeback for Do As I Say. :roll:
 
I have no doubt that LUST is related to love; I just find it hard to believe that you wouldn't enjoy sex with someone you already lust after.
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Its the same reason a person need hands to masturbate. The mind plays an important part of sexual relations, but some of it is just the physical parts interacting. Now which part plays a bigger role depends on the people involved, but both the mind and body are crucial.
 
Here's a poser. If it's desirable for people to remain virgins until they marry, and given gay marriage isn't yet legal in the US, does that exempt gays from this exhortation? Or do they just have to wait a looooong time?
 
Andalublue said:
Here's a poser. If it's desirable for people to remain virgins until they marry, and given gay marriage isn't yet legal in the US, does that exempt gays from this exhortation? Or do they just have to wait a looooong time?
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It's very simple: generally people who combines both the beliefs that gay marriage should not be legal + there should not be sex before marriage = there shouldn't be gay (-sex) in the first place.
 
Dav said:
How the hell are you "not compatible" in the first place? If the plug fits in the socket, then you're compatible. Not fully enjoying it is extremely shallow grounds for not having a relationship, by definition.
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Holy crap :shock: Is that all you think good sex entails? Sticking a plug in a socket? Let me ask you something... you think you would enjoy it if that 'socket' just laid there and didn't move? Wasn't the slightest bit interested? If she just spread her legs and said, "Get it over with?"

On the flip side, most women aren't going to orgasm just by sticking plug in a socket. Additionally, there are multiples ways to do even THAT. Slow and easy, Slow and Deep, Slow and shallow, Fast and deep, fast and hard, fast and shallow, Fast and shallow, shallow, shallow then deep. So on and so forth. I've been with guys that moved with the speed of molasses, and that did NOTHING for me. I've been with guys that were a ****ing jackhammer, and that did nothing for me.

Don't you think kissing is part of sex? What about talking? What if your partner talks and talks and talks and all it does is distract you? But what if they NEED that in order to get off?

What if oral sex is the only way she can get off and you don't like doing that?

There are so many damn ways that a couple can be incompatible that it would be impossible for me to touch on them all.

But let me assure you: Sex is more than 'sticking a plug in a socket'. And if you think that's 'shallow', so be it. But all that tells me is that you have little, if any, experience with sex.

Why would you be celibate just because you don't enjoy sex with someone? That doesn't make any sense. It would be like starving because you're not fond of the only thing you're able to eat. It would be much more sensible to teach them how to do it better if you're a sexpert, or get counseling.
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Teaching them how to do it better doesn't always work. First, they have to be willing. Second, doing it better for you also needs to work for them, sometimes it doesn't. And no amount of counseling is going to change what I need to orgasm.

I would want to remain celibate because why would I want to do something I don't enjoy and that in the end, is only going to frustrate the **** out of me. You can't equate it to eating, because eating satisfies a hunger regardless. Having sex does NOT satisfy a hunger regardless.

So why would I want to have sex with a man I no longer desire since we are completely incompatible? Why would I want to have sex with someone when I KNOW I'm not going to enjoy it? What would be the point?
 
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