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Utah Judge orders child be taken from Lesbian Parents

CRModeration said:
Order to Take Baby From Lesbian Foster Parents Under Review

I'd like to know under what legal argument does the judge states to do this; this is downright ridiculous—especially when the Utah Division of Child and Family Services doesn't agree with the decision either.
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Under State law (as far as I understand it), he doesn't have any legal argument for it. If it's found that he's just anti-gay couples and he used his government power to enforce his personal opinion over the free and lawful exercise of the People, then he will need to be removed from office and disbarred.
 
If the judge ruled to remove the child simply because the married couple were a same-sex couple, then his ruling should be reversed and the judge sanctioned or removed from the court.

However, the OP article states that there are no transcripts of the case available to the public to prove what was actually said, the judge is prohibited by judicial rules from talking about it, and all we have is one side's view, memory, or interpretation. We should wait to see what actually happened before we call to ruin the life of a judge. Maybe one or both of the ladies have something in their background that they are not telling us, that caused the judge to make this ruling? We can't know the truth yet.
 
And irrational decisions based on bigotry continues...
 
Beaudreaux said:
If the judge ruled to remove the child simply because the married couple were a same-sex couple, then his ruling should be reversed and the judge sanctioned or removed from the court.

However, the OP article states that there are no transcripts of the case available to the public to prove what was actually said, the judge is prohibited by judicial rules from talking about it, and all we have is one side's view, memory, or interpretation. We should wait to see what actually happened before we ca to ruin the life of a judge. Maybe one or both of the ladies have something in their background that they are not telling us, that caused the judge to make this ruling? We can't know the truth yet.
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A representative from the Utah Division of Child and Family Services said:

"Sumner said she can't speak to specifics of the case but confirmed that the couple's account of the ruling is accurate — the judge's decision was based on the couple being lesbians. The agency isn't aware of any other issues with their performance as foster parents.​


The agency charged with knowing what was going on in the Foster Care home said their were no issues with the performance of the couple.


>>>>
 
WorldWatcher said:
A representative from the Utah Division of Child and Family Services said:

"Sumner said she can't speak to specifics of the case but confirmed that the couple's account of the ruling is accurate — the judge's decision was based on the couple being lesbians. The agency isn't aware of any other issues with their performance as foster parents.​


The agency charged with knowing what was going on in the Foster Care home said their were no issues with the performance of the couple.


>>>>
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That's my take as well. However, I know how it feels to be attacked based on misinformation, and I try not to do so to others if I can help it. Even the person you quoted said " ... she can't speak to specifics of the case ..."

Look, if it can be proven that the judge made this ruling based on the couple being lesbians, then he should be removed from the bench and disbarred. IF ...
 
faithful_servant said:
I agree, all the people jumping to a conclusion that this about anti-homosexuality without knowing the facts are making bigoted and irrational decisions.
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This is all we have to go on...

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A full transcript of his ruling has not been made public and may not be because court records of cases involving foster children are kept private to protect the kids, Sumner said.

Sumner said she can't speak to specifics of the case but confirmed that the couple's account of the ruling is accurate — the judge's decision was based on the couple being lesbians. The agency isn't aware of any other issues with their performance as foster parents.
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So, it is either they were removed based on the couple being lesbians or some other issue... to be determined later after a thorough game of ass cover.
 
Found on Reddit:
Holy **** this judge needs disbarred. Not only is he 100% lying about "research" stating children do better in heterosexual households (despite real research showing the contrary) but what he's doing is illegal since same sex couples are allowed to adopt in that state.
The judge is a piece of **** too:
In 1997, he was reprimanded by the Utah Judicial Conduct Commission for "demeaning the judicial office" after slapping a 16-year-old boy who became belligerent during a 1995 meeting at the Price courthouse.
And this:
Johansen was also criticized in 2014 for ordering a woman to lop off her 13-year-old daughter's ponytail as punishment for the teen cutting the hair off a 3-year-old girl at a restaurant. The judge offered to shave off 150 hours of community service from the sentence if she cut her daughter's hair in court.
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This judge is a bigot, and, as expected, the right wing nuts will rally to defend him.
 
I really hope there is more to this story.
 
As I posted in the other thread on this same topic:

As someone who opposes abortions of convenience and who promotes less restrictive processes to enable willing adults to adopt abandoned and/or orphaned children, I hope this decision is quickly reversed and that this judge no long sits in judgment of similar cases/issues. Any person or persons who would give of themselves to provide a loving home to any child in such need should be cheered and encouraged and not disparaged. I hope this couple fights hard against this bigoted decision.
 
OrphanSlug said:
This is all we have to go on...

-----

A full transcript of his ruling has not been made public and may not be because court records of cases involving foster children are kept private to protect the kids, Sumner said.

Sumner said she can't speak to specifics of the case but confirmed that the couple's account of the ruling is accurate — the judge's decision was based on the couple being lesbians. The agency isn't aware of any other issues with their performance as foster parents.
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So, it is either they were removed based on the couple being lesbians or some other issue... to be determined later after a thorough game of ass cover.
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So as I said, you've jumped to a conclusion based on ignorance and bigotry. You admit that you don't have the full story and still think that you can come to a valid conclusion.
 
faithful_servant said:
So as I said, you've jumped to a conclusion based on ignorance and bigotry. You admit that you don't have the full story and still think that you can come to a valid conclusion.
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The source in the story tells the conclusion.
 
The Division of Child Services recommended that, for the good of the child, the judge reverse his decision. That seems to be a pretty clear statement indicating the appropriateness of the couple.

If Johansen does not vacate his order, DCFS officials will proceed to the court of appeals, Sumner said Thursday night.

"It is our position that this removal is not in the best interest of the child," the agency spokeswoman's statement said.
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http://www.nydailynews.com/news/national/lesbian-couple-foster-child-ordered-removed-utah-judge-article-1.2433025
 
OrphanSlug said:
The source in the story tells the conclusion.
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No, it doesn't, it tells the results and you are assuming the motivation behind the results. For all you know, the judges decision could be based on the child only having it's diaper changed once a day and being fed by simply having a bottle dropped in it's crib a couple times a day or it could be because the judges hates all lesbians. But we don't know anything except what ONE side of this case has told us. You know NOTHING except the outcome and are passing judgement on the judge's motivation based on your bigotry and not accurate information.
 
faithful_servant said:
No, it doesn't, it tells the results and you are assuming the motivation behind the results. For all you know, the judges decision could be based on the child only having it's diaper changed once a day and being fed by simply having a bottle dropped in it's crib a couple times a day or it could be because the judges hates all lesbians. But we don't know anything except what ONE side of this case has told us. You know NOTHING except the outcome and are passing judgement on the judge's motivation based on your bigotry and not accurate information.
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Of course, all the articles on the subject are wrong... but you.
 
faithful_servant said:
No, it doesn't, it tells the results and you are assuming the motivation behind the results. For all you know, the judges decision could be based on the child only having it's diaper changed once a day and being fed by simply having a bottle dropped in it's crib a couple times a day or it could be because the judges hates all lesbians. But we don't know anything except what ONE side of this case has told us. You know NOTHING except the outcome and are passing judgement on the judge's motivation based on your bigotry and not accurate information.
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Actually, all those things would have been caught by the child welfare agencies and the plethora of oversight they have in our adoption processes. But they all endorsed this married couple. From everything that has been reported, it seems like the judge had no valid or lawful reason for his ruling.
 
faithful_servant said:
No, it doesn't, it tells the results and you are assuming the motivation behind the results. For all you know, the judges decision could be based on the child only having it's diaper changed once a day and being fed by simply having a bottle dropped in it's crib a couple times a day or it could be because the judges hates all lesbians. But we don't know anything except what ONE side of this case has told us. You know NOTHING except the outcome and are passing judgement on the judge's motivation based on your bigotry and not accurate information.
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Not true.

From the article:

Sumner [Utah Department of Family Services] said she can't speak to specifics of the case but confirmed that the couple's account of the ruling is accurate — the judge's decision was based on the couple being lesbians. The agency isn't aware of any other issues with their performance as foster parents​


This was after the court proceedings, therefore if the Judges decision had been based on only having it's diaper changed one a day or have a bottle dropped in the crib occasionally. If those conditions had been part of the court case, and since the UDFS representative was in the court - then logically speaking the above statement made AFTER the court proceedings would include if such conditions had been brought out in court.



>>>>
 
faithful_servant said:
So as I said, you've jumped to a conclusion based on ignorance and bigotry. You admit that you don't have the full story and still think that you can come to a valid conclusion.
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we have the full story, the judge acted outside the law and is derelict in his duties. He's a bigot who needs to be removed.
 
faithful_servant said:
No, it doesn't, it tells the results and you are assuming the motivation behind the results. For all you know, the judges decision could be based on the child only having it's diaper changed once a day and being fed by simply having a bottle dropped in it's crib a couple times a day or it could be because the judges hates all lesbians. But we don't know anything except what ONE side of this case has told us. You know NOTHING except the outcome and are passing judgement on the judge's motivation based on your bigotry and not accurate information.
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so, if it is proven to you that it was because he doesn't like lesbians, what would your position be?
 
OrphanSlug said:
Of course, all the articles on the subject are wrong... but you.
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I'm not taking a stand about the judge's motivation in any way - you are the one doing that. All I'm saying is that we don't know the "why", we just know the "what". You are assuming the "why" based on your bigotry and willingness to accept the word of someone based on the fact that they are lesbians, this is Utah and in Utah there are a lot of Mormons, so the judge obviously must be a Mormon forcing his personal beliefs on the lesbians. But you have NOTHING to back that up, other that the assumptions of the lesbians and the way the press reported the story. Where is the proof of the judge's motivation?? I'm willing to accept that he abused his position to enforce a personal belief, are you willing to accept that he made his decision based on a objective standard of what would be best for the child??
 
ReverendHellh0und said:
so, if it is proven to you that it was because he doesn't like lesbians, what would your position be?
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Toss him on his ear, he's unqualified to be a judge. If it was proven to you that women were neglecting the child and are trying to play the "homosexual card" to get a decision they disagree with overturned, what would your position be??
 
faithful_servant said:
Toss him on his ear, he's unqualified to be a judge. If it was proven to you that women were neglecting the child and are trying to play the "homosexual card" to get a decision they disagree with overturned, what would your position be??
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remove the child. however in this case the government agency that managed thier case said they were fine:


Later Thursday, the child services division said it was asking Johansen to reconsider, filing a motion with the judge to stay his order. If he declines, the agency said it would petition the court of appeals.

"It is DCFS's position that this removal is not in the best interest of the child," the agency said.

And the governor's office has weighed in

"I expect the court and the judge to follow the law. He may not like the law, but he should follow the law," said Gov. Gary Herbert. "We don't want to have activism of the bench in any way, shape or form."

Utah judge rules lesbians can't foster a child - CNN.com
 
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