Chuck

Very interesting

You know, I sometimes have to move very heavy objects. I dare say if I had to move a safe, I'd use a different method. I have actually moved large sections of concrete using my method described below. It also works for moving large timbers and logs

By putting two shims near the center of the block, the load becomes the lever, and can be moved much easier, without needing rollers, pinchbars, or levers such as you use. Proper use of counterweights will let you remove the shims when the moving is complete. This method makes gravity a force to work for you, instead of a force that must be overcome. I can raise large loads by simply tipping the load, adding a shim, tipping it the other way, adding two shims, and on and on, as high as you want to go.

I haven't read the entire thread, 51 pages, but I did read the first and last few pages. While trying to research that Dunn guy you mentioned, I googled "forgotten technology" and found this guy. His method is very similar to mine.

The Forgotten Technology

Physics

His site is a little difficult to navigate, so I included the page six link, which explains the lever function pretty well.

Oh, in 1994 I installed the equipment for a Nissan engine plant in Mexico. We used water levers to set the conveyor and lifter elevations. Very accurate. I'm not yet 50, but I think I'll qualify to discuss them. I thought of animal intestines as soon as someone mentioned the need for watertight hose.

__________________
If you had a right to be safe, you wouldn't need the right to defend yourself.

Don't try to change my mind, and I won't try to change yours. Let's debate, and let the winner take the undecided.

teacher

I think I know this guy.

If it's the same guy, we went over this over ayear ago, it's in the thread, Wally? been asking him to show up forever, gonna let this stew a bit.

Sent him a PM.

I know exactly what he is talking about and have used it. Do you? Useful in certain times. Not this time. Too slow, too much work, don't get me started on the friggin counter weights, he knows HIS way, it worrks, he's WAY ahead of the rest of you...


but he's no teacher.


Sent him a PM. We'll see.


I thought of animal intestines as soon as someone mentioned the need for watertight hose


I'll be getting into this. BTW. You didn't happen to, ah,. write it down, time/date stamped anywhere, did you? Like me? See, way I go about bidness, good idea, set it in stone, or HWSOH's CPU anyway. (Yes I have this all backed up)

But then, if he did, great minds think alike, and...ah, lost you morons there, didn't I?


Oh, my bad, reread your post. The guy you refer to is Wally Wallenback, wore him out long time ago. He don't talk to me no more. Busted his bubble and all. I mention him often in this thread. Tried to get him on board, have saved email between him and I (he he) and, oh well...that's for the look who I destroyed phase of "teacher's pyramid crusade and travelling menagerie" tour.

I so have this pegged.





Oh Tashah...



Right foot green. Nah, you can keep the garter on...


Miss me?

Chuck

Nope, you don't know me.

Hmmmm,,,,, date time I thought of using animal intestines?
How about yesterday when I read you musing about needing a watertight hose in the thread? I don't claim to have thought of it first, just pointing out it wasn't a hard thing to think of. It's well known that American Indians used animal inards to carry water. As a person who butchers his own meat, and occassionally makes his own sausage, an intestine is a logical hose.

Since it interested me, I commented on some of the work I've done that's similiar to what you were discussing. I have moved concrete slabs with the only size limitation being the slab must be strong enough to hold it's own weight from the folcrum out. I have "walked" large timbers and logs on stubs of branches left attached to the trunk for just that purpose. I have raised huge pieces of wood to my splitter with the shim method I described.

You used to move safes. I bet you used dollies to wheel them about. That's why you like rollers for your block moving. What rollers accomplish actually is they reduce friction by reducing the area of contact. Even when they crush and splinter, it'll be easier than dragging it with the entire area of one side causing friction. You do the same thing when you use a pinch bar or lever to set a large machine base in place.

I used to set heavy machining equipment. I know of that which I speak.

If you walk them, your area of friction is even smaller, making the moving easier, making the final placement easier. Using a small counter weight to tip the load to remove the feet makes final placement possible while still using the feet. The worst obstacle is that the entire load is placed on a very small area. This is overcome by your building the road to transport them.


I'm sure you'll have some clever witty comeback to post, all but calling me an idiot and/or a liar, and claiming I don't know what I'm talking about.
But, what I do, and how I do it works for me.

BTW, where you from? Out here in the heartland, where men are men and do a man's work, much of what you are "discovering" is common knowledge amoungst the trades.

Chuck

I checked out your "Son of" page.

Several items made me laugh out loud.

Your "Area 51" is what's commonly known as a datum

Using the North Star for a N/S line is more accurate and can be done ANY clear night. Your method can only be done two days a year, and only in the Tropics. What's more, a near true E/W line can be made ANY clear day by simply tracing the path of a shadow from a plumb staff in the ground, from sunrise to sunset. I can show you how if you're interested.

Your "roller stop bypass gizmo" is called an antiback and is used throughout material handling and conveyors. Nothing new there, and frankly, much better ones could be built from copper.

Your true N/S and E/W lines are called the datum lines and are common on blueprints today. In most autoplants they're either 3' or 1 meter both directions from a designated column, depending if it's GM, Ford or Honda.

Why would you want to scribe circles from your datum lines to mark the building edge line? Just measure your distance and make a mark at each end and stretch a line.

Of course, if the thing were designed properly, cutting the last stones first to build the road with makes perfect sense, as does building the inside chambers before building the outside. Doing it the other way would be like painting oneself into a corner. Reminds me of the old guy who told me, "All discoverers do is point to what others do every day and claim it for there own"

Good lesson on the pathagrean theorum. But in real life using 6,8, and 10 is much more common. For large distances like this job, it'd be 60, 80, and 100 for more accuracy, but it's not needed. A straight line is just an angle of 180 degrees, and any angle can be bisected using just a string. And checked just as easily.

Seems to me you're overthinking what is only good common sense. It's really not that difficult. Oh, and walking and shimming are the best way to move and raise the block too. By the time you lever, change rollers, lever, change to a bigger roller, your bigger roller will hit the step riser before the load gets transfered to the smaller rollers on the higher step. That one won't work as drawn. the concept is faulty. Going down it would though.

Chuck

Read back a few more pages, what you call "walking" is different than I referred to above. I am talking about the dual fulcrum shims under the load. This will move large blocks with little effort, safely too. Same with raising it.

Your method, OTOH, requires a level road and much uphill lifting of the load to get it up your steps. More work. My method uses gravity to help with the work. Your method fights gravity every step of the way. Mine is more efficient.

While reading, I found this:

And since you didn't get it,
Here
If the stones are triangular, how are you going to do that?

Captain America

Here ya go Teacher. Has the secret been discovered?
Was Great Pyramid built from inside out? - Science - MSNBC.com

__________________
Diplomacy is the art of saying 'nice doggy" until you can find a gun.

Huckabee for prez in 2012!

teacher

but my oft used phrase..."read all the words" comes to mind.

Anyone doubt I can put all this to rest?

1. Answer PMs.
Duece. Check here, try not to post quite yet.
Craps. Fail Duece. Goto TT's, rip.

And yea Cap, seen it, oh my, what a rant that is gonna be. Goota burr under my saddle, and a COMPLEATLY new way to raise a block 2 1/2', say "yea teacher", and so much friggin sh**t on my plate, well.

Any one feel for Chuck yet?

Well don't. Guy might bring sumpin.

I'll get to that.

Someone calling The Warden?

I love the smell of smack.

teacher

You know, it's one thing to have a suck pyramid threory, like having some idea that ramps were used, and news flash, no really, saw this on the scroll on CNN, with the ground breaking idea that the thing was built from the inside out, which is nuttin, cause once you can move these blocks one can erect this thing a gazillion differerent ways, (one of the alternate more advanced block moving and stacking ideas of mine I'll one day get to) and being a scientist getting your name on the news as a guy that has a new theory doesn't surprise me as they are all about taking care of the golden egg laying machine, especialy when you don't cover how to get the blocks there, leveling precisely, and well, you know, covering all the bases like someone we all know and love, just, damn, when you get CNN play for this and you got a name like...

wait for it...

Jean Pierre Houdin...

then it's time to bust out the idustrial size barrel of smack.

I'm gonna do the e-mail thing personally to this guy, one of the so-called movers and shakers on this topic, like I have done to the rest, blow by blow so you can see what these weasels do when I come a calling. It's classic. They bluster and carry on, "we'll see about your little theory safe moving boy". At times I've sat back and watched the "guest" come on, come straight here, spend hours here, then go away never to reply to my e-mails again.

Not saying this guy will, maybe he brings sumpin. Benifit of the doubt and all, but I aint holding my breath.

Then, when that carnage line has likely run it's usual course, gotta extra coin to play, ol' teach knows the name of the Rueters new agency reporter that filed this report. More e-mails. Never tried the reporter slant before, and they are usually vultures who just love some carnage...we'll see. But I got some fresh ideas playing this way.

Now all I know is the jist of this guy's idea, he got reported, and seems French.

But you should know the bragging, gloating and boasting comes first with me.

Makes it, in the end, that much more annoying when I've done what I said from a cold blind start.

Which amuses me.

But first...

How about a few new ideas you ain't seen before.

You know, the kind the whole universe can't seem to find flaws with...

Begin.

teacher

as a mime.



Okay, who's on the ball? Came up with this trying to improve the as yet unseen answer to Stonehenge. (Yea, I got it).

This is a rough 1st drawing (allready way beyond this) of the basic idea for getting a block up 2 1/2' feet...

without steps. Gonna let it lay like this a bit.

The variations and adaptations are near endless.

Left some color in there that matches my usual device identification. Basically a movable lifting device.

teacher