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Was the Physics Forum right to ban me for this post?

Onion Eater

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Was the Physics Forum right to ban me for this paper, which I posted in their social science section? Note that Evo is NOT a physics professor. She is just an undergraduate business major pretending to be a professor.

Evo said:
Dear Grozny,

You have received an infraction at Physics Forums.

Reason: General Warning
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Please read the guidelines, we don't allow this.
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This infraction is worth 1 point(s) and may result in restricted access until it expires. Serious infractions will never expire.

Original Post:
http://debatepolitics.com/forum/index.php?posts/2465707/
Steve Reglar (2005) writes:
Steve Reglar said:
As a tool of capitalist hegemony the doctrine of general equilibrium is very useful. It assumes that the normal condition of society is for the state to play as little a role in economic life as possible, because the market is part of human nature and the most efficient form of economic organization. The theory, therefore, has a role in legitimizing capitalist hegemony.

A tool of capitalist hegemony? My, what harsh language! One can almost visualize GE theorists visiting smoke-filled rooms to accept bribes from their cigar-puffing benefactors. Indeed, Post-Autistic economists, after observing the word "axiomatic" in the title of my book (Aguilar, 1999), dismissed it out-of-hand, denouncing me as a bought-and-paid-for stooge of Big Business. Apparently, just that one word was enough to convince them of this about me.

But before we dismiss this talk of an epistemological approach being a "tool" of Big Business to "legitimize" their obviously anti-social behavior, let us at least see if the socialists are consistent. James Yunker (2007) writes:
James Yunker said:
This article evaluates the performance of contemporary capitalism relative to that of a hypothetical alternative designated "profit-oriented market socialism." In most respects, profit-oriented market socialism would closely mimic contemporary market capitalism. The major difference would be that most profits and interest generated by the operations of publicly-owned business enterprises would be distributed to the general public as a social dividend proportional to household wage and salary income rather than in proportion to household financial assets. The basis of the comparison is a small-scale but comprehensive computable general equilibrium model.

Here we read that GE Theory is not a tool of capitalist hegemony, but a tool of profit-oriented market socialism, that is, publicly-owned business enterprises (e.g. Fannie, Freddie, AIG, etc.) that mimic contemporary market capitalism. And it is not a "tool" in the sense of legitimizing the socialists (presumably, their legitimacy is derived from emotional appeals of the "Gosh, there sure are a lot of poor people – darn capitalists!" variety), but a tool in the literal sense of defining a software model.

Well, which is it? Reglar thinks that GE Theory "assumes that the normal condition of society is for the state to play as little a role in economic life as possible." Yunker sees GE Theory as the basis for a central planner to "mimic contemporary market capitalism" while retaining for himself the authority to distribute the social dividend – hardly a "little role in economic life."

The primary (actually, the only) criticism that socialists have of my writing is that it lacks "substantial references." Apparently, he whose writing is filled with the most quotations from the most august of academic journals wins. Thus, having observed that Reglar and Yunker have opposite views of GE Theory, we clearly need a tie-breaker. Cristobal Young (2005) writes:
Cristobal Young said:
General equilibrium theory – the mathematical analysis of a market economy as a whole – has its roots in the late 19th century works of Leon Walras and Vilfredo Pareto… However, the project failed to attract much following and soon faded into dormancy.

It was the end of the Great Depression, ironically, that saw a tremendous revival of the General Equilibrium (GE)/Welfare economics project. In the US, a loose grouping of devout socialists were busy detailing the elegance of the market equilibrium. The leaders of the GE revival – Oskar Lange, Abba Lerner and Abram Bergson – were cutting-edge mathematical economists and true believers in Soviet-style central planning…

The GE framework, given sufficient mathematical complexity, is actually a grand narrative on the fragility and implausibility of perfect market equilibrium. Successive mathematical torturing has outlined an extensive list of unlikely conditions required to demonstrate general market efficiency. Mark Blaug has nicely summarized a partial inventory: "perfectly rational, omniscient, identical consumers; zero transaction costs; complete markets for all time-stated claims for all conceivable contingent events, no trading at disequilibrium prices; no radical, incalculable uncertainty…; only linearly homogenous production functions; no technical progress requiring capital investment, etc" (1997, p. 5)…

For an economic system that failed to satisfy such assumptions, there seemed a need for government intervention. General equilibrium theory provided a sort of checklist for market critics.

Young supports Yunker’s position though, while they agree that central planning is the inevitable result of economists' acceptance of GE Theory, Young see this as a bad thing and Yunker sees it as a good thing. Nevertheless, the Review of Political Economy and the SSRN trumps an obscure conference of socialists idling on the taxpayer’s dime, drinking tea and refining their plans for world conquest. Two out of three quotations wins!

Steve Keen (2007, p. 173) has also observed that satisfying the ever-growing list of assumptions made by Debreu and his followers is "unrealistic":
Steve Keen said:
It is almost superfluous to describe the core assumptions of Debreu’s model as unrealistic: a single point in time at which all production and exchange for all time is determined; a set of commodities – including those which will be produced in the distant future – which is known to all consumers; producers who know all the inputs that will ever be needed to produce their commodities; even a vision of "uncertainty" in which the possible states of the future are already known, so that certainty and uncertainty are formally identical. Yet even with these breathtaking dismissals of essential elements of the real world, Debreu’s model was rapidly shown to need additional restrictive assumptions.

In the context of GE Theory, the conditions required for capitalism to be efficient are implausible in practice, though conceivable in theory. The former implies that the free market is always inefficient. The latter implies that a central planner can mimic how capitalism would work if it were efficient while the "profits and interest generated by the operations of publicly-owned business enterprises would be distributed to the general public as a social dividend."

In the context of GE Theory, there is no way for libertarians to get around this dilemma without being impaled on one or the other horn. Either we live with a system that can never be efficient in practice or we have an efficient system but renounce private property rights and put distribution of the "social dividend" in the hands of a central planner.

Far from being a "tool of capitalist hegemony," acceptance of GE Theory is the death of capitalism. Our only compensation is that, like a condemned prisoner who gets to choose the firing squad or the hangman, we get to choose inefficiency or tyranny. How did free-market economists respond to this dreadful choice? Milton Friedman invoked his famous "assumptions don’t matter" dictum (1953) to avoid having to admit that he could not untie the Gordian knot of GE Theory – but that is cowardice. Surely there must be a better way!

Instead of attempting to untie it, I cut the Gordian knot of GE Theory by throwing all of Walras’ and Pareto’s assumptions overboard and starting from scratch with my own set of axioms. When faced with a dilemma "in the context of GE Theory," I invented Axiomatic Economics. As Hannibal Barca said, "we will either find a way, or make one." The same goes for libertarians; we will never accept socialism.

My assumptions are three:

1) One's value scale is totally (linearly) ordered:

i) Transitive; p ≤ q and q ≤ r imply p ≤ r

ii) Reflexive; p ≤ p

iii) Anti-Symmetric; p ≤ q and q ≤ p imply p = q

iv) Total; p ≤ q or q ≤ p

2) Marginal (diminishing) utility, u(s), is such that:

i) It is independent of first-unit demand.

ii) It is negative monotonic; that is, u'(s) < 0.

iii) The integral of u(s) from zero to infinity is finite.

3) First-unit demand conforms to proportionate effect:

i) Value changes each day by a proportion (called 1+εj, with j denoting the day), of the previous day's value.

ii) In the long run, the εj's may be considered random as they are not directly related to each other nor are they uniquely a function of value.

iii) The εj's are taken from an unspecified distribution with a finite mean and a non-zero, finite variance.

Read my Simplified Exposition of Axiomatic Economics for a more detailed, but still undergraduate-level discussion of my economic theory. This paper requires knowledge of multi-variable calculus but omits the real analysis that plagues readers of my 1999 book.


REFERENCES

Aguilar, Victor. 1999. Axiomatic Theory of Economics. Hauppauge, NY: Nova Science Publishers, Inc.

Blaug, Mark. 1997. "Ugly Currents in Modern Economics." Policy Options. 18: 3-8

Friedman, Milton. 1953. "The Methodology of Positive Economics." in Essays in Positive Economics. Chicago, IL: University of Chicago Press.

Keen, Steve. 2001. Debunking Economics. Annandale, NSW Australia: Pluto Press

All the best,
Physics Forums
 
Was the Physics Forum right to ban me for this paper, which I posted in their social science section? Note that Evo is NOT a physics professor. She is just an undergraduate business major pretending to be a professor.

Wait...did you really type that??? dood...you have ENTIRELY too much time on your hands!

cant speak to the banning part...Ive been banned, punished, slapped around...half the time I dont know what for and if you point out the fact that they were wrong you get infracted AGAIN for daring to speak against the Gods...so...good luck!
 
What exactly is the reason why you were banned?
 
Wait...did you really type that??? dood...you have ENTIRELY too much time on your hands!

cant speak to the banning part...Ive been banned, punished, slapped around...half the time I dont know what for and if you point out the fact that they were wrong you get infracted AGAIN for daring to speak against the Gods...so...good luck!
Some folk are extreme nerds. ;)

As far as forums, anyone can start one and ban whomever they please, since they own the forum.
 
Some folk are extreme nerds. ;)

As far as forums, anyone can start one and ban whomever they please, since they own the forum.

that actually explains a lot...thanks!
 
I would have banned you for referencing your own book.

Coooooppp out
 
What exactly is the reason why you were banned?

My post was deleted and I was banned for a month. When I came back I found a PM from Evo (quoted above in its entirety) that just says "Please read the guidelines, we don't allow this."

I PMed the other moderators to ask for a review of Evo's actions and was permanently banned.
 
My post was deleted and I was banned for a month. When I came back I found a PM from Evo (quoted above in its entirety) that just says "Please read the guidelines, we don't allow this."

I PMed the other moderators to ask for a review of Evo's actions and was permanently banned.

Yep...thats the MO...seriously...play by their rules or they take your balls and you go home...
 
My post was deleted and I was banned for a month. When I came back I found a PM from Evo (quoted above in its entirety) that just says "Please read the guidelines, we don't allow this."

I PMed the other moderators to ask for a review of Evo's actions and was permanently banned.

That sounds pretty typical for many forums. If you want justice, you won't find it at many forums. They are run often arbitrarily by despot wannabees.
 
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You do kinda sound like you are pushing your book. And to me your writing sounds like something from a kooky website.

Onion Eater said:
Post-Autistic economists, after observing the word "axiomatic" in the title of my book (Aguilar, 1999), dismissed it out-of-hand, denouncing me as a bought-and-paid-for stooge of Big Business. Apparently, just that one word was enough to convince them of this about me.
:confused:

You asked the other mods for "a review of Evo's actions"? What about asking what you did to get the infraction. Say I get banned by Tucker Case for something like this
GoodPoster said:
Government shouldn't tell me what to eat
Fake Anarcho-fascist said:
Your only complaining cause you wanna keep stuffin grease in yer fat mouth you fat pig
I doubt I would have much success if I asked for "a review of Tucker Case's actions"


Rules said:
1)Posts containing only a link or quotes from other sources without any explanation on the part of the person posting them, unless they are in direct response to a request from another member for a source to back up a claim.
Your post reads like you were pasting big chunks of it.

Rules said:
Do not hijack an existing thread with off-topic comments or questions--start a new thread.
You go off talking about how your book solves the question posed in the thread and much much more.

Rules said:
...it is against our Posting Guidelines to discuss, in most of the PF forums or in blogs, new or non-mainstream theories or ideas that have not been published in professional peer-reviewed journals or are not part of current professional mainstream scientific discussion. Personal theories/Independent Research may be submitted to our Independent Research Forum, provided they meet our Independent Research Guidelines; Personal theories posted elsewhere will be deleted. Poorly formulated personal theories, unfounded challenges of mainstream science, and overt crackpottery will not be tolerated anywhere on the site. Linking to obviously "crank" or "crackpot" sites is prohibited.
I would have to say your post seems to break this rule.
 
The Modern Fascist Movement.

Of course, this is not the first time that the fascists have resorted to censorship to advance their agenda.

Ludwig von Mises said:
Economics in the second German Reich, as represented by the government-appointed university professors, degenerated into an unsystematic, poorly assorted collection of various scraps of knowledge borrowed from history, geography, technology, jurisprudence, and party politics, larded with deprecatory remarks about the errors in the "abstractions" of the Classical School.

After 1866, the men who came into the academic career had only contempt for "bloodless abstractions." They published historical studies, preferably such as dealt with labor conditions of the recent past. Many of them were firmly convinced that the foremost task of economists was to aid the "people" in the war of liberation they were waging against the "exploiters."

This was the position Gustav Schmoller embraced with regard to economics. Again and again he blamed the economists for having prematurely made inferences from quantitatively insufficient material. What, in his opinion, was needed in order to substitute a realistic science of economics for the hasty generalizations of the British "armchair" economists was more statistics, more history, and more collection of "material." Out of the results of such research the economists of the future, he maintained, would one day develop new insights by "induction."

Does Gustav Schmoller remind you of anyone alive today?

James Devine said:
The original statements by the rebellious French economics students define autistic economics in terms of its one-sided and exclusionary interest in "imaginary worlds," "uncontrolled use of mathematics" and the absence of pluralism of approaches in economics. The hard-core autistic walling off from the societal environment can be seen most strongly in the specific, highly abstract, axiomatic school that the students protested against.

More recently, the Post-Autistic Economics Network has grown bold enough to demand that federally-funded economics associations censure anybody who displays “axiom-happy behavior,” as this is considered symptomatic of autism.

Real-World Economics Review said:
It is accepted fact that the economics profession through its teachings, pronouncements and policy recommendations facilitated the Global Financial Collapse (GFC). To date, however, the world’s major economics associations have declined to censure the major facilitators of the GFC or even to publicly identify them. This silence, this indifference to causing human suffering, constitutes grave moral failure. It also gives license to economists to continue to indulge in axiom-happy behaviour.

Since these associations are funded entirely by the Federal Government, this is tantamount to government censorship. Indeed, their use of the word censure, rather than censor, implies a formal reprimand issued to an individual by an authoritative body. This is highly reminiscent of the Nazi practice of denouncing dissidents as mentally ill. If preventing autistic people from getting published becomes government policy, it is only a short step to forcibly institutionalizing anybody who has studied geometry or otherwise shown an aptitude for the axiomatic method.

If this comparison seems unimportant, recall what the German Historical School led to.

Ludwig von Mises said:
The political significance of the work of the Historical School consisted in the fact that it rendered Germany safe for the ideas, the acceptance of which made popular with the German people all those disastrous policies that resulted in the great catastrophes. The aggressive imperialism that twice ended in war and defeat, the limitless inflation of the early 1920s, the Zwangswirtschaft and all the horrors of the Nazi regime were achievements of politicians who acted as they had been taught by the champions of the Historical School.

At this early stage of the Post-Autistic Movement, the most obvious point of comparison with the Nazis is their campaign to ban academic papers.

250px-1933-may-10-berlin-book-burni.jpg


Just because it is not the government, in the sense of actual federal agents, who are burning books does not mean that it is any less wrong or any different than Nazi book burning. That was not done by the government either. It was the German Student Association.

Wikipedia (Nazi Book Burning) said:
The German Student Association (Deutsche Studentenschaft) proclaimed a nationwide "Action against the Un-German Spirit," to climax in a literary purge or "cleansing" ("Säuberung") by fire.

Placards publicized the theses, which attacked "Jewish intellectualism," asserted the need to "purify" German language and literature.

On May 10, 1933 the students burned upwards of 25,000 volumes of "un-German" books, presaging an era of state censorship and control of culture. On the night of May 10, in most university towns, nationalist students marched in torchlight parades "against the un-German spirit."
 
You deserved to be banned because all of that was utter gibberish.
 
You deserved to be banned because all of that was utter gibberish.

Too many big words?

For those of you who prefer your ideas boiled down to bumper sticker slogans, I have had some bumper stickers printed up and I am giving them away for free.

bumpersticker-1.jpg


Contact me at my website if you want one.
 
Once again, why are you posting on a discussion forum about what happened to you on an entirely different discussion forum as if anyone here cares?

At this early stage of the Post-Autistic Movement, the most obvious point of comparison with the Nazis is their campaign to ban academic papers.



Just because it is not the government, in the sense of actual federal agents, who are burning books does not mean that it is any less wrong or any different than Nazi book burning. That was not done by the government either. It was the German Student Association.

Once again, you repeat the exact same f*cking thing. You really need to get a life.
 
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Once again, why are you posting on a discussion forum about what happened to you on an entirely different discussion forum as if anyone here cares?



Once again, you repeat the exact same f*cking thing. You really need to get a life.

Why are you responding? :doh
 
Once again, why are you posting on a discussion forum about what happened to you on an entirely different discussion forum as if anyone here cares?



Once again, you repeat the exact same f*cking thing. You really need to get a life.

You're gonna get an infraction for self-censoring the above 4-letter word most likely, be careful! We dont' want this thread to be a thread about banning to become a blackhole that sucks us all into getting banned :) (reviews what I just wrote to ensure banning risk is within acceptable range)


As to the OP, probably for self promotion, no big deal. Once you publish, it creates the potential conflict of interest with that published work.
 
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Too many big words?

For those of you who prefer your ideas boiled down to bumper sticker slogans, I have had some bumper stickers printed up and I am giving them away for free.

bumpersticker-1.jpg


Contact me at my website if you want one.

You know, a dictionary would have been a much faster way to figure out what those two words mean and how they aren't really equatable like that.
 
You know, a dictionary would have been a much faster way to figure out what those two words mean and how they aren't really equatable like that.

The Post-Autistic Economics Network's strategy is to infiltrate the moderator staffs of political forums with people like Evo who quietly ban anybody who favors a free market.

Meanwhile, in the name of "pluralism" they encourage the fascists and the socialists to yell at each other and angrily claim to be completely different. This creates a false dichotomy where the general public begins to believe that fascism and socialism are the only available options. They then conclude that they will be "centrist" by taking a position halfway between fascism and socialism.

But, of course, this was the objective of the Post Autistic Economics Network all along. After shunting axiomatic economics aside by banning free market economists and/or denouncing them for having a mental illness (autism), they have forced people to decide between two forms of totalitarianism that are almost indistinguishable, as my bumper sticker makes clear.

bumpersticker-1.jpg
 
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Your sticker has a spelling error. Claim to be using the "Wet Piant!" effect, where painters purposely misspell the word so that people notice the sign..... everyone will be persuaded...
 
Pretty simple. Their forum, their rules. Don't like it? Tough. /shrug

That is life on the internet. Why not start your own forum or blog about your thoughts, etc.. and not worry about it?

Seems you have spent a tremendous amount of time obsessed by who was 'right or wrong' when in reality - it doesn't matter.
 
Hey don't worry, I usually get some nut sending me an infraction email about once a month.
I have a laugh over it and then consign it to the crap section of my email.
 
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