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Does ESP exist?

Pin dÁr said:
Does ESP, like telepathy, clairvoyance, psychokineses etc really exist?

If not, why not?
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No, there is no evidence that would demonstrate any of these things exist.
 
Risky Thicket said:
Ah, but I don't need to prove it. From personal experience I know it exists.
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Actually you do. Anecdotes (like the one you made) only ever apply to individuals or individual experiences and are subject to the biases that this brings with it. It is impossible to say that an individual anecdote is representative of the situation/subject as a whole. If you want to definitely prove something, then you have to provide some empirical evidence rather than relying on anecdotes.
 
Pin dÁr said:
Does ESP, like telepathy, clairvoyance, psychokineses etc really exist?

If not, why not?
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Greetings, Pin dAR. :2wave:

I believe it's possible they do exist, and I'll explain why. When my father passed away, my friend who lives in Florida called me within minutes of his death to ask me what was wrong. I live in NE Ohio! When I explained why we were crying, she said she just "knew" something had happened, although she didn't know what it was. Is that an example of the type of thing you were referring to?

What about getting a strong feeling while you're driving a car that you should take the next exit and learn later that had you not done so, you would have been involved in a bad accident? I have, but I always chalked it up to guardian angels looking after us. We don't know enough yet about how the mind works to say it's not possible, because what if it is?
 
TheGoverness said:
Actually you do. Anecdotes (like the one you made) only ever apply to individuals or individual experiences and are subject to the biases that this brings with it. It is impossible to say that an individual anecdote is representative of the situation/subject as a whole. If you want to definitely prove something, then you have to provide some empirical evidence rather than relying on anecdotes.
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Check the OP, baby cakes. It asked if people believe in ESP. It did not ask people to prove ESP. I do believe ESP exists, in fact, I know it. I've known it since a very young age. I haven't always thought of it as blessing or a gift, if you like. Sometimes I'd rather not feel or know something other people aren't aware of.

Among other things I am a strong empath. That's fairly common for people who are aware of such things. Damn near my entire life I have correctly felt what another person is feeling. That does not mean I know what other people are thinking. There is a difference. What people say and what they actually feel are not always the same thing. I am right more often than not. Almost always I'd like to be able to not know. It is not something I wanted or developed. Fortunately it doesn't seem to be too reliable when using the Internet.

As to the question of proof, I ain't no rookie. When you affirm that ESP exists you will almost always be demanded to prove it. That too has been my experience since as long as I can remember. To my thinking and my experience ESP isn't a party trick. I have no compelling need to prove ESP to anyone.
 
shrubnose said:
Anyone who actually had it could put the lotteries out of business and that hasn't happened yet.

Think about that a little bit.
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One would need to be a clairvoyant to accomplish that. Clairvoyants can see the future. So that doesn't necessarily discount ESP.
 
Kal'Stang said:
One would need to be a clairvoyant to accomplish that. Clairvoyants can see the future. So that doesn't necessarily discount ESP.
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Poker, then.
 
Pin dÁr said:
well, no, Because it simply doesn't work that way.

This is kind of a circular reasoning, which, btw, most science is, circular reasoning.

It is the only way 'science' 'survives"

But rest assured, it is going down.
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This is of course wrong. Science is something that is proven via observation and testing. It comes to solid conclusions. There are however things in science that are not yet fully proven but do have a lot of circumstantial evidence to support them. Those are generally called theories.
 
HonestJoe said:
I agree. I think accepting a specific explanation for given phenomena by reflex action is similarly a sign of a closed mind. That’s why your answer to the question is as important as anyone else’s.

The problem I have with these questions is that the words you list in your OP aren’t clearly defined and specifically don’t clearly distinguish between cause and effect. When you talk about there being evidence, you’re talking about evidence of effects. People having information without an apparent source for it, objects behaving in ways there are no immediate explanation for. None of that proves anything other than there being things we don’t yet have explanations for. Where this kind of field becomes difficult is that some people propose explanations based on mechanisms for which there is no actual evidence and often for which there is no detail explanation or structured hypothesis.

So, I don’t think there is any meaning to the questions you’re asking in the OP without clarifying in a lot more detail exactly what you’re actually referring to when you use terms like ESP. I’d love to be able to discuss these things – I think they’re really interesting concepts. I only think those discussions can have any meaning with a solid basis of definition and understanding though, and sadly many of the people who raise them don’t appear to be willing or able to work on that basis.
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I agree with this. In his OP he asks about ESP. ESP is shorthand for "extrasensory perception". It is a general term used to encompass a broad array of what many consider supernatural abilities or abilities that allow a person to do or see or hear things that the average person cannot. This includes, but is not limited to: Clairvoyance, Telepathy, Clairaudience and many more.

There are some scientists that think that some of these things are possible, just not in the way that many people that believe in ESP believe. They believe that some people are able to take in physical information from their surroundings (such as placement of objects, micro expressions in people etc etc), process it, and based on that info be able to tell or see things that the average person cannot. It's like a heightened awareness. And they're able to do this often without realizing it. To the average person that might come across as telepathy or clairvoyance. But in reality it was just the person essentially paying more attention to their surroundings than other people.

The problem is that many that believe in ESP "powers" simply don't want to believe that the above is true and that's where the conflict arrives.
 
Pin dÁr said:
Does ESP, like telepathy, clairvoyance, psychokineses etc really exist?

If not, why not?
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I believe in the rare premonitions, however I don't think anyone who has them has any control of them. Psychics are quacks.
 
I know I do. ;)
 
Pin dÁr said:
Does ESP, like telepathy, clairvoyance, psychokineses etc really exist?

If not, why not?
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probably (sort of)

time isn't really linear so I think we get break-throughs once in a while

at least I do sometimes

I just know exactly what is going to happen with a situation which has not yet arisen

I also believe everything/one is connected and sometimes we just feel the vibe and know
 
Kal'Stang said:
:shrug: That could be discounted as simply counting cards. Which people do all the time.
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Yes, although counting cards is still involves a measurable probability. (Because that's the basis of counting cards) Given a large enough sample size, one could measure a win percentage of a card counter against its theoretical probability.

ESP should be able to beat that.
 
There has never been a legitimate scientific study that demonstrates ESP exists. If ESP existed it would be very easy to demonstrate, all one would have to do is consistently do better than chance. It never happens.
 
Deuce said:
Yes, although counting cards is still involves a measurable probability. (Because that's the basis of counting cards) Given a large enough sample size, one could measure a win percentage of a card counter against its theoretical probability.

ESP should be able to beat that.
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IF one is counting cards.
 
Risky Thicket said:
IF one is counting cards.
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Right. What I'm saying is that this would be a method to tell the difference between a card counter and someone with magic powers.
 
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