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6 N.Y. church members arrested after teen dies in assault

Dragonfly

Dragonfly

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New Hartford World of Life church members arrested after teen dies - CNN.com

(CNN)A counseling session on the spiritual state of two brothers turned physical at Word of Life Christian Church in New Hartford, New York, resulting in the death of a young man and serious injuries to his brother, New Hartford Police Chief Michael Inserra said Wednesday.Their parents, Bruce T. Leonard, 65, and Deborah R. Leonard, 59, each face one count of first-degree manslaughter, a Class B felony.
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"Both brothers were continually subjected to physical punishment over the course of several hours in the hopes that each would confess to prior sins and ask for forgiveness," he said.
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"but if you listen to the teachings, they are accurate to the Bible."
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Wow...just wow.
 
Beaudreaux said:
I saw this early this morning. I would have to say that the term CULT would be more accurate than CHURCH. But, that's just me.
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sounds like it.
the bible says to confess your sins and He is willing to forgive them.

now where does it say beat a person to death.

closed knit little interaction with anyone else. people complained about noise and such.
yea I am thinking it is a cult more than a church.
 
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In news reports it was said the beatings went on for 10 hours. TEN HOURS. That means they probably had to stop and have lunch.

I just can't wrap my brain around what kind of people these are. Cult , definitely.
 
Beaudreaux said:
I saw this early this morning. I would have to say that the term CULT would be more accurate than CHURCH. But, that's just me.
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But then you would have to say that THOSE Bible- followers aren't like meeeee!

No true Scotsman fallacy.
 
Manc Skipper said:
But then you would have to say that THOSE Bible- followers aren't like meeeee!

No true Scotsman fallacy.
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Pardon me? If I said that, sure. But I didn't, so there's that. I see where your argument could be made, but I was not implying the required paradigm the would raise it to a No True Scotsman claim by me. If it appeared that way to you, I apologize for your confusion.

As a man of Scottish ancestry, I would know a No True Scotsman claim if I saw one.
did-social-data-predict-the-outcome-of-the-scottish-independence-vote-measure-fest-october-2014-32-638.jpg
 
I think 'wow' sums it up nicely.

Crazy ****ed up world these days.
 
Boy this is a terrible story. I just watched Shep Smith reporting on it. I've never heard of such a practice called a "spiritual beating". But there is good reason for that because this group is made up of 5 families with about 35 members. Hardly a mainstream church. Some of the details coming out say the reason these "spiritual beatings" occurred were because the two brothers wanted to leave the church. And the beatings from the accounts I have read happened at the sanctuary with the mother, father and sister part of the team that beat the teens. Oh my Lord.

Police: Teen in N.Y. church assault wanted out | National News - KETV Home
 
Beaudreaux said:
I saw this early this morning. I would have to say that the term CULT would be more accurate than CHURCH. But, that's just me.
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I agree.
Unable to leave the church? Since when do bonafide Christian churches force members to stay? Christianity is never enforced - it's voluntary faith.
The free exercise of free will.

Preventing people from leaving, is the dead give away - it's a cult.
Unfortunately some people do not recognize the difference.
 
Manc Skipper said:
But then you would have to say that THOSE Bible- followers aren't like meeeee!

No true Scotsman fallacy.
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:lol:



Bible-followers. That's the key-phrase, isn't it?

Anyone who have some understanding of the Bible would definitely know that anyone using torture, and anyone forcing someone to be a believer,
is NOT a Bible-follower.



Torture, and forcing someone to have Christian faith is contrary to Biblical teaching. If what you do is contrary to the teaching....would you be called a follower of that teaching? To say that they are - now, that is the fallacy.
 
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tosca1 said:
:lol:



Bible-followers. That's the key-phrase, isn't it?

Anyone who have some understanding of the Bible would definitely know that anyone using torture, and anyone forcing someone to be a believer,
is NOT a Bible-follower.



Torture, and forcing someone to have Christian faith is contrary to Biblical teaching. If what you do is contrary to the teaching....would you be called a follower of that teaching? To say that they are - now, that is the fallacy.
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No true Scotsman fallacy.
 
tosca1 said:
:lol:



Bible-followers. That's the key-phrase, isn't it?

Anyone who have some understanding of the Bible would definitely know that anyone using torture, and anyone forcing someone to be a believer,
is NOT a Bible-follower.



Torture, and forcing someone to have Christian faith is contrary to Biblical teaching. If what you do is contrary to the teaching....would you be called a follower of that teaching? To say that they are - now, that is the fallacy.
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George W Bush was okay with torture. Does that mean he isn't a christian?
 
tosca1 said:
:lol:



Bible-followers. That's the key-phrase, isn't it?

Anyone who have some understanding of the Bible would definitely know that anyone using torture, and anyone forcing someone to be a believer,
is NOT a Bible-follower.



Torture, and forcing someone to have Christian faith is contrary to Biblical teaching. If what you do is contrary to the teaching....would you be called a follower of that teaching? To say that they are - now, that is the fallacy.
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99percenter said:
George W Bush was okay with torture. Does that mean he isn't a christian?
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Who says anything about who's a Christian and not? Read again. It's not for me to make judgement on that.

I'm talking about a "Bible-follower."
Someone who doesn't follow the teachings in the Bible....is not a Bible-follower. That's simple logic.
 
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tosca1 said:
Who says anything about who's a Christian and not? Read again. It's not for me to make judgement on that.

I'm talking about a "Bible-follower."
Someone who doesn't follow the teachings in the Bible....is not a Bible-follower. That's simple logic.
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It's actually somewhat silly.

I, like you, oppose the attempts to turn this into a "typical Christian" spin or "typical bible follower" spin. However that these nuts followed the bible is not in dispute, no matter the extent to which they clearly misunderstand it.

What you're actually supporting is the notion that anyone or everyone following the bible is by default correct in his folllowership.

That's what constitutes illogic.
 
Chagos said:
It's actually somewhat silly.

I, like you, oppose the attempts to turn this into a "typical Christian" spin or "typical bible follower" spin. However that these nuts followed the bible is not in dispute, no matter the extent to which they clearly misunderstand it.

What you're actually supporting is the notion that anyone or everyone following the bible is by default correct in his folllowership.

That's what constitutes illogic.
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The significant message of Christ are consistent on all translations. Of coruse, I'm not referring to new Bible translations that's not recognized as "authentic" (the right word escapes me at the moment). I'm referring to Bibles used by bible scholars!


That there are those who'd manipulate the message to conform to whatever they desire is not an excuse.
What's manipulated and changed is no longer the message. Thus it's stipulated in the Bible that it's forbidden to change the message in the Bible.


Bottom line: if one does not follow the Bible, he is not a Bible-follower.
 
tosca1 said:
The significant message of Christ are consistent on all translations. Of coruse, I'm not referring to new Bible translations that's not recognized as "authentic" (the right word escapes me at the moment). I'm referring to Bibles used by bible scholars!


That there are those who'd manipulate the message to conform to whatever they desire is not an excuse.
What's manipulated and changed is no longer the message. Thus it's stipulated in the Bible that it's forbidden to change the message in the Bible.


Bottom line: if one does not follow the Bible, he is not a Bible-follower.
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Now THAT is far more logical.:thumbs:
 
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